Game Discussions Star Citizen Discussion Thread v12

Cosmo

Cosmo
Ed02350 said:
Stumbled on to this while looking for videos on Star Frontier RPG.
I really hate how Star Citizen keeps randomly popping up like pinterest when I search for anything.
Source: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OED3uhcAwoU
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Farrister concludes "but for me, what we have right now is pretty good. It's far from problem free, there's still an awful lot missing, but this game has managed to keep me playing week in week out for the past few years."

If Star Citizen is pretty good then CIG could do an early-access release on Steam. CIG won't do that, because the average user score would be very negative. After 10 years, what we have is a very buggy alpha-game, predatory business model to get money from backers, far from the final product that was promised by CIG. They've delayed countless features, and development has taken far longer than expected. So Farrister is a big SC fanboy with a very biased opinion.

Counter video by GEM REVIEWS:

 
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VR Golgot

VR Golgot
Interesting post from the MMO dev who hangs out at refunds. Seems it is a recognised instancing variant:

Depending on how they’re doing the instancing in this case, this is actually a pretty common bug to encounter when building the system.

Instancing isn’t as cut and dry as most people think. In this case it looks like they’re using a state-based “phased instance” instead of passing the player to a different VM.

A phased instance just selectively replicates what is on the server, making each client see different things in different states.

Phasing in WoW and New World’s housing system both use similar tech.

You use phasing when you don’t want to handle a connection change between vmachines.

In SC’s case here they don’t want to run a whole game server just so individual players can load ships, but they also need to solve for N players being in the same geographic location. Additionally they likely don’t want to introduce connection risk by having the players jump to/from different vmachines when moving to/from their hangars (either by elevator or in a ship).
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I can’t comment much on the method of implementation (also just guessing at their implementation based on the bug in the video based on my own dev experience, I could be totally wrong!), but if they’re using some kind of phasing system, it’s best used for situations where super high-fidelity interactions (like larger scale combat, lots of AI simulation, and such) aren’t required.

In that way it’s perfect for a group of players loading up a ship and equipping items or decorating an area with static objects like fish tanks.
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I'm sure CIG will manage to CIG it up though ;)
 
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Agony_Aunt

Agony_Aunt
Cosmo said:
If Star Citizen is pretty good then CIG could do an early-access release on Steam.
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This is the ultimate gotcha any time a faithful says something like this. If its that good, even with bugs, they could do an EA release.

Now, at the risk of @Viajero jumping in here and saying CIG have already released the game, its worth keeping in mind that its still in that quantum state where its both released and not released, depending on who you're asking and whether the game needs defending or bigging up. I mean an open statement saying the game is actually released and can be treated like a released (albeit EA) product.

But CIG will never do that, because they know it will get ripped to shreds.
 

Agony_Aunt

Agony_Aunt
VR Golgot said:
Interesting post from the MMO dev who hangs out at refunds. Seems it is a recognised instancing variant:



I'm sure CIG will manage to CIG it up though ;)
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Ok, amateur dev time here, but i don't understand this guy. You don't need to spin up a separate server to instance people. Its not like they are spinning up new servers just because two people are in slightly different location. You just need those places to be in discrete places in the game world.
 

VR Golgot

VR Golgot
Agony_Aunt said:
Ok, amateur dev time here, but i don't understand this guy. You don't need to spin up a separate server to instance people. Its not like they are spinning up new servers just because two people are in slightly different location. You just need those places to be in discrete places in the game world.
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I think he's saying:

  • Classical dungeon instancing is how most players think about instancing. (Capped player counts in a dedicated area, but ungated access because multiple instances hosted by a VM each etc)
  • 'Phasing' sounds like it's better for player bases in social hubs etc: IE you've got limited housing assets in a city, or whatever, but a lot of people want to use them. So just shove everyone in, but only show them themselves and their friends etc. (A single VM is fine hosting this because no combat / heavy gameplay etc).

I guess they're both scenarios where a bunch of people want to be in the same place. Just different use cases.
 
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VR Golgot

VR Golgot
An old hand has tired of CIG's ways...

Latest Glassdoor:

1/5

Project with unrealistic goals, lots of bullying and in-house politics​

Game designer
Former employee, more than 8 years
Manchester, England

Recommend ❌
CEO approval ❌
Business outlook ❌

Pros
  • Lots of talented people who work at this company
Cons
  • Management are clueless on where the project is heading
  • Progression is rare and revolves around in-house politics
  • Low chance of salary increase (this is where the in-house politics come into it)
  • Bullying in the workplace (Personally caused lots of mental stress)
  • A lot of new employees, mostly juniors are hired for 6 months without any guidance and are let go once their probation is up
  • Ridiculous amount of spending on useless props and items in the office
  • Tasks given are not consistent and dropped the majority of the way through
  • Forced overtime and never gives time off in lieu (employees were even told not to track their time off in lieu at one point)

Advice to Management
  • Treat employees with the respect they deserve and not like doormats. A lot of employees are underpaid and overworked. This used to be a good company to work for within the first few years Foundry 42 (CIG UK's old company name) but it has clearly lost it's way.
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Viajero

Volunteer Moderator
Viajero
Agony_Aunt said:
This is the ultimate gotcha any time a faithful says something like this. If its that good, even with bugs, they could do an EA release.

Now, at the risk of @Viajero jumping in here and saying CIG have already released the game, its worth keeping in mind that its still in that quantum state where its both released and not released, depending on who you're asking and whether the game needs defending or bigging up. I mean an open statement saying the game is actually released and can be treated like a released (albeit EA) product.

But CIG will never do that, because they know it will get ripped to shreds.
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I think he was referring to early access release in Steam. Star Citizen was indeed released already (in early access) many years ago as officially confirmed by CIG themselves. They have just not used the Steam platform for it.

As for the "quantum state" you mention, that is purely an imaginary construct some people use to support their own personal narratives of the moment. Star Citizen objectively is, to all real actual effects that matter (accounting, legal, tax, commercial), a released product. It is just a very crappy and broken one 🤷‍♂️ .

What CIG is also doing is adding a lot of vocabulary such as "alpha" and "backers" to bamboozle the market into thinking there is some kind of guarantee or commitment to improve or complete a broken product. By definition any released product (early access or not, broken or not) is it. And it carries zero guarantees or commitments on future states or that any revenues will have to be used in that product.
 
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Agony_Aunt

Agony_Aunt
Viajero said:
I think he was referring to early access release in Steam. Star Citizen was indeed released already (in early access) many years ago as officially confirmed by CIG themselves. They have just not used the Steam platform for it.

As for the "quantum state" you mention, that is purely an imaginary construct some people use to support their own personal narratives of the moment. Star Citizen objectively is, to all real actual effects that matter (accounting, legal, tax, commercial), a released product. It is just a very crappy and broken one 🤷‍♂️ .

What CIG is also doing is adding a lot of vocabulary such as "alpha" and "backers" to bamboozle the market into thinking there is some kind of guarantee or commitment to improve or complete a broken product. By definition any released product (early access or not, broken or not) is it. And it carries zero guarantees or commitments on future states.
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The quantum state i mentioned is exactly what you are talking about. How the faithful and CIG use whatever term they want to defend the product.
 

Ed02350

E
Skizomeuh said:
So basically they put players in the same location but in different layers... What can go wrong? And that explains the sound issues...

It's odd instancing as much as drowning is odd swimming.
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Here in 2024 I stopped thinking CIG are even developing the game anymore. They look like they're intentionally prolonging the development by making it as buggy as possible, prioritising none core features so they can have as many excuse to fix and polish the game until cold fusion becomes home appliance.
 

VR Golgot

VR Golgot
The long tradition of starter ships being broken moves full circle...

Updated Aurora series cargo physics proxies to help manual loading of cargo
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How in the world could anybody have looked at this and considered this "fixed"? The cargo boxes are now floating below the ship, are 50% underground when attached and getting them on the ship is still a massive pain in the youknowwhere.
Is this a late Aprils Fools joke?

robertsspaceindustries.com

Spectrum - v7.46.7

RSI’s Spectrum is our integrated community and player interaction service, including chat, forums, game integration, and Player Organization facilities. Player Organizations (“Org”...
robertsspaceindustries.com robertsspaceindustries.com
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Updated Aurora series cargo physics proxies to help manual loading of cargo
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You lowered the cargo grid halfway into the ground and made it such that we couldn't pull any box off we managed to get on but the boxes still can't slide well under the aurora to get into the middle or rear positions. You need to lengthen the landing legs and the walk-in ladder (or revert to the old ladder). I had to rest the back of the ship on an 8 SCU box just to hold it up high enough to get the other two attached. Then I placed it back on the ground to test unloading elsewhere and you can't pull them. I even had the item ports unlocked to be sure.
Edit 1: I discovered just now that you have to aim the tractor beam near the top of the boxes but you risk pulling off the cargo rack and causing collision with your ship as it bounces on it. This remove was only possible while the rear was seated on the 8 SCU container though.
Edit 2: Removing the rack first to attach the boxes shows that you can't reattach the rack because it sits too tall.
tavern_upload_large.jpg


Pro tip:
Land upside down.
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Wan el mask

Wan el mask
Hi guys ! Been a while since I showed up here. How have you all been doing? Still not understanding game development ?
Apparently CIG is on the verge of discovering fire ? With a bit of luck the next step is them successfully adopting a bipedal posture and, eventually, how to use crude stone tools !!
 
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