My preference on combat logging would be for the logger to be converted to an NPC with 'flee' behaviour active, which may include dropping cargo as a distraction (and possibly with a modicum of defense). Once the NPC version has jumped and it's clear that the attacker isn't following, the player would be logged out safely. The P2P exploit of the attacker blocking out the P2P connection would be avoided because the victim in that case would still be actively in contact with the matchmaking server, so the conversion to NPC behaviour wouldn't occur.
Whats the point of open play?
- Thread starter Flying_Fox
- Start date
This. If people couldn't run away when I interdicted them this would be insane. Get a fast ship, chase them down, ding their hull. You may not kill them, but they have repears, and you can always super-cruise after them and pull them out for another round.
What occurs to me here is that a lot of the people posting in this thread seem to view PvP as the only multi-player interaction worth engaging in.
I appreciate there are people who enjoy pvp combat, and there are people that don't. Personally, my major motivation for playing in open is for the cooperative multi-player aspects of open. I like doing things with other people. I like the opportunity to talk to other commanders I run across. I like the times I've teamed up with other commanders for cooperative pirate hunting. Flying together, sharing information, helping where needed.
All things I can't do in solo. I've played the piracy game too. If another player is going to disconnect, I can either let it bother me, or I can move on and take on another target. I don't restrict my targets to players. I'm happy to prey on NPC's too.
The one attitude I did find quite amusing early in the thread was a poster that claimed that his victims were exhibiting cowardice by disconnecting, while simultaneously claiming he picked only on ships that had no chance whatsoever of opposing him in any other way.
I appreciate there are people who enjoy pvp combat, and there are people that don't. Personally, my major motivation for playing in open is for the cooperative multi-player aspects of open. I like doing things with other people. I like the opportunity to talk to other commanders I run across. I like the times I've teamed up with other commanders for cooperative pirate hunting. Flying together, sharing information, helping where needed.
All things I can't do in solo. I've played the piracy game too. If another player is going to disconnect, I can either let it bother me, or I can move on and take on another target. I don't restrict my targets to players. I'm happy to prey on NPC's too.
The one attitude I did find quite amusing early in the thread was a poster that claimed that his victims were exhibiting cowardice by disconnecting, while simultaneously claiming he picked only on ships that had no chance whatsoever of opposing him in any other way.
That doesnt happen often though. I think it removes all danger and make PvP completely uninteresting when you can skip it whever you want. ESC and Alt+F4 can be coded so its ignored during combat. Pulling the cable out of the modem or a real DC might be impossible to detect. Would be neat if you actually could see if it was a problem outside your PC, but at least it makes it a little more annoying for those wanting to just leave the fight to disable ESC and Alt+F4 during combat. Maybe even lock Alt+TAB during combat so its harder to kill the process. To me if i developed ED these would be a given to add in.
The point I failed to make is: running away just because your shields dropped in a viper or a cobra and you have no shield capacitors left.
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Players who is loseing didnt DC they switch to solo mode. I metioned this many time on this fourm. Change mode of play shouldnt be allowed in open space, only in stations. Login off in space should have 1minute cooldown , in fight instance 2 minutes. This is EOT, if this dosent change there is no point be pirate in this game.
Since FD are giving actual money away from being first to elite only if you play open always, you should expect this. There are likely a whole load of people playing open that would otherwise not be playing open. I play solo only, but if some proper multiplayer coop content ever comes I may play open.
I have no interest in killing players, I get no sick pleasure from hurting others, and I have no intention of ever letting a player kill me.
If you don't like players quitting rather than face certain defeat, perhaps you should pick on NPCs or ships that are bigger and tougher than you. I have absolutely no sympathy with pirates who lose out by people DCing. Play your way by all means, be an antisocial parasite, but don't cry when other people play their way.
I have no interest in killing players, I get no sick pleasure from hurting others, and I have no intention of ever letting a player kill me.
If you don't like players quitting rather than face certain defeat, perhaps you should pick on NPCs or ships that are bigger and tougher than you. I have absolutely no sympathy with pirates who lose out by people DCing. Play your way by all means, be an antisocial parasite, but don't cry when other people play their way.
Disclaimer: I've not played open yet (except by accidental misclick), only group/solo. Also i do not like PvP except by consent. Therefore you can take my opinions here with a pinch of salt.
1) OP - attacking sidewinders? For shame! Ok, if they have a combat ranking of better than Harmless/Mostly Harmless, then maybe its ok, they have combat experience. But otherwise *shakes head*
2) The internet is full of jerks. Maybe people will simply disconnect before battle simply because they will presume you are a jerk. Your first aim should not be demanding cargo, it should be trying to convince the other player you are not a jerk who will blow them to smithereens regardless of whether they have cargo or not or drop cargo or not.
3) People who disconnect once battle has commenced, especially if they have shot at you, should face some possible punishment. However, until the netcode for the game in improved, i certainly wouldn't want to see any punishments for disconnects as the likelyhood of it being a game bug is still real enough to mean you could unfairly punish people.
4) I don't like the idea of having your ship sit there if you disco. Imagine you are in SC and your router dies. While you are scrabbling to reset your router, and NPC comes up, interdicts you, and blows you away. You finally get in to see yourself facing an insurance screen with no idea why. Think about it for those calling for this sort of thing. How would you feel about it if this happened to you? Imagine you were flying your souped up Python and you had foolishly been flying with not enough insurance! Image the potential for ragequit here!
There must be a better solution. The suggestion about your ship becomes and NPC set to flee mode could be ok, just so long as it doesn't flee so much it leaves you without fuel
5) People DC'd after you took out their thrusters? LOL... then its a bit late. You got your victory. They will log back in to find their only option is to self-destruct anyway. The only shame is you can't hang around to see it happen.
To be honest, i'd be quite happy if there were no different playmodes, just one big happy galaxy all together, with one small feature. A PvP toggle, that can only be set on login. If you go in with this set, other players cannot harm you, and they know not to bother because if they scan you it would be clearly indicated. Nobody then needs to disconnect, nobody needs to cry over being interdicted or having someone DC on you. If you want PvP, then you set it, and you shouldn't be disconnecting. If you do have a disconnection when in combat with another player, it is logged. If it occurs more than X number of times, staff get an alert and the player is investigated, with possible punishment for bad sportsmanship.
I'm sure there are problems with my suggestion, but i'd hope less than exist with the current system.
1) OP - attacking sidewinders? For shame! Ok, if they have a combat ranking of better than Harmless/Mostly Harmless, then maybe its ok, they have combat experience. But otherwise *shakes head*
2) The internet is full of jerks. Maybe people will simply disconnect before battle simply because they will presume you are a jerk. Your first aim should not be demanding cargo, it should be trying to convince the other player you are not a jerk who will blow them to smithereens regardless of whether they have cargo or not or drop cargo or not.
3) People who disconnect once battle has commenced, especially if they have shot at you, should face some possible punishment. However, until the netcode for the game in improved, i certainly wouldn't want to see any punishments for disconnects as the likelyhood of it being a game bug is still real enough to mean you could unfairly punish people.
4) I don't like the idea of having your ship sit there if you disco. Imagine you are in SC and your router dies. While you are scrabbling to reset your router, and NPC comes up, interdicts you, and blows you away. You finally get in to see yourself facing an insurance screen with no idea why. Think about it for those calling for this sort of thing. How would you feel about it if this happened to you? Imagine you were flying your souped up Python and you had foolishly been flying with not enough insurance! Image the potential for ragequit here!
There must be a better solution. The suggestion about your ship becomes and NPC set to flee mode could be ok, just so long as it doesn't flee so much it leaves you without fuel 5) People DC'd after you took out their thrusters? LOL... then its a bit late. You got your victory. They will log back in to find their only option is to self-destruct anyway. The only shame is you can't hang around to see it happen.
To be honest, i'd be quite happy if there were no different playmodes, just one big happy galaxy all together, with one small feature. A PvP toggle, that can only be set on login. If you go in with this set, other players cannot harm you, and they know not to bother because if they scan you it would be clearly indicated. Nobody then needs to disconnect, nobody needs to cry over being interdicted or having someone DC on you. If you want PvP, then you set it, and you shouldn't be disconnecting. If you do have a disconnection when in combat with another player, it is logged. If it occurs more than X number of times, staff get an alert and the player is investigated, with possible punishment for bad sportsmanship.
I'm sure there are problems with my suggestion, but i'd hope less than exist with the current system.
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I guess you are not going to agree with me on this, however i think you raise a genuine issue with this.
imo once a commander escapes you as the agressor should NOT be able to jump after the person and attack them again.... and again.... and again. That is just not cricket.
If you cant finish them off fair and square then tough, they got away, and i reckon this needs to be tweaked.
if a CMDR escapes legitamately i think it is completely fair enough if they then choose to DC once they got to SC.
that being said, I have no issue with a players ship staying in game world for 20seconds after they DC IF they are in a battle situation.
I do not think sitting defenseless is the answer however....
actually rather than a count down to DC, maybe instead of that, simply have the AI take over - with a high rating, not some harmless terrible AI!) and try to escape to SC. if they manage it successfully then great, but if not then you "win"
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Sorry, rather off topic, but could you let a Noob know how you set a macro in ED? Or let me know where to find out.
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SYSEM WIDE BEACONS!
we need system wide beacons for players that go rogue and rack up a high enough bounty!
that way peaceful players can avoid and bounty hunters can chase them down :]
Maybe, maybe not. If not, the time to escape should be much longer. Simply enough, there isn't enough time between the interdiction completing and them escaping to make a reasonable proposition for their cargo, especially if they submit to the interdction. You almost always need to show you can do damage and have the power to kill them. A single interdiction is rarely enough time to get all of this across, especially if you want to do a cargo scan.
If I couldn't do a second interdiction I'd be much more brutal. Demanding messages in the chat, and guns free from the moment I see you. I'd also be shooting to kill if you looks like you're going to get away, because empty threats are empty. I'd get a lot more PvP kills, and a lot less cargo.
That said, multiple interdictions do mean that, so long as I can win the minigame, I have the power to kill most people who are weaker than me in a system. Being a pirate isn't the same as being a griefer though, I'm not going to kill you unless you fight back and I have no choice/are stubbon and simply won't dump his cargo when I have a good 30+ second window to kill.
There is a central server. It's p2p + server not pure p2p.
FD can keep a DC player's ship in your instance for as long as they want. Not sure why this hasn't been implimented yet. Possibly FD wanted to wait until they were sure the networking was stable enough?
ED is not pure client/server model because of the massive overheads that incurs (and the agressive monetisation to fund that would require to maintain).
Because last night in Sorbago sector I had a lot of fun with and against other CMDRs in the conflict zones.
Disclaimer: I've not played open yet (except by accidental misclick), only group/solo. Also i do not like PvP except by consent. Therefore you can take my opinions here with a pinch of salt.
1) OP - attacking sidewinders? For shame! Ok, if they have a combat ranking of better than Harmless/Mostly Harmless, then maybe its ok, they have combat experience. But otherwise *shakes head*
2) The internet is full of jerks. Maybe people will simply disconnect before battle simply because they will presume you are a jerk. Your first aim should not be demanding cargo, it should be trying to convince the other player you are not a jerk who will blow them to smithereens regardless of whether they have cargo or not or drop cargo or not.
3) People who disconnect once battle has commenced, especially if they have shot at you, should face some possible punishment. However, until the netcode for the game in improved, i certainly wouldn't want to see any punishments for disconnects as the likelyhood of it being a game bug is still real enough to mean you could unfairly punish people.
4) I don't like the idea of having your ship sit there if you disco. Imagine you are in SC and your router dies. While you are scrabbling to reset your router, and NPC comes up, interdicts you, and blows you away. You finally get in to see yourself facing an insurance screen with no idea why. Think about it for those calling for this sort of thing. How would you feel about it if this happened to you? Imagine you were flying your souped up Python and you had foolishly been flying with not enough insurance! Image the potential for ragequit here!
5) People DC'd after you took out their thrusters? LOL... then its a bit late. You got your victory. They will log back in to find their only option is to self-destruct anyway. The only shame is you can't hang around to see it happen.
To be honest, i'd be quite happy if there were no different playmodes, just one big happy galaxy all together, with one small feature. A PvP toggle, that can only be set on login. If you go in with this set, other players cannot harm you, and they know not to bother because if they scan you it would be clearly indicated. Nobody then needs to disconnect, nobody needs to cry over being interdicted or having someone DC on you. If you want PvP, then you set it, and you shouldn't be disconnecting. If you do have a disconnection when in combat with another player, it is logged. If it occurs more than X number of times, staff get an alert and the player is investigated, with possible punishment for bad sportsmanship.
I'm sure there are problems with my suggestion, but i'd hope less than exist with the current system.
I'm also for the PvP toggle, but I'd actually want it to be toggleable in station, with a timer for turning it off. That way it's easier if you actually want to do some. Yes some people will switch back and forth depending on cargo and such, but that's better than the alternative.
We would love to have a great mass of people playing online, but if pirating becomes the norm for many experienced pilotes and they keep killing the easy targets there won't be.
I don't want to see the Eve Online security ratings for systems either, so the PVP flag would be the way to go.
There will always be players who aren't interested in pvp and that should also be respected. One other solution would be to have to instances running: Online PVE and Online PVP. Self explanatory so I won't explain.
+1 Rep. That's the sprit, made me smile
That message (and option) should be flashed by the game to every trader when they get interdicted, even by an NPC pirate!
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but it isnt..... so suck it up and deal with it or move on. This has been done to death, no point moaning about it in another thread.
Its like me saying prostitution should be legal.......... Maybe it should be, maybe it shouldnt be, but my opinions of it are moot and I would be an idiot to bring it up in a videogame thread about player killing
Me personally I think FD are right to have the 2 modes, though I fully agree there needs to be some kind of mechanism to stop people who are about to lose a fight from simply network cable pulling or mode jumping
PS and once that is sorted out and killing the game does not make our ships disappear right away, FGS frontier, please let us alt F4!. No piece of software should stop us from being able to kill it if need be. I get the odd crash with my display driver - I know why and am working on sorting it - but it is such a PITA trying to get elite to give up and go away once it has partially crashed.
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I think these contests are a poorly conceived publicity stunt that will prove to be mistake and that any incentivisation to do anything in game should remain in game.
Most of the people I've seen intentionally disconnect were those who initiated hostilities.
And they can have this without making inter player conflict arbitrarily more difficult or unlikely than PvE conflict.
Because he wanted the cargo and the sidewinder looked like easy prey. Same reason any predator goes after the young or infirm, and not the healthy adults that can put up a fight.
You may not personally like these tactics, I do not personally like these tactics, but to dismiss their validity is pure arrogance and highly disruptive to Open play, for anyone and everyone looking for some verisimilitude.
Any world were everyone is forced to behave in an honorable or sporting manner has jumped well beyond my ability to suspend my disbelief, even if I have every intention of role-playing a lawful-stupid paladin the whole time.
I hate being interdicted too. Which is why I fire upon any ship interdicting me, and why ~80% of players who have interdicted me got nothing but an insurance bill for their trouble.
That said, I haven't been interdicted by anything but NPCs with enormous bounties since release, so it hasn't been that bad as of late.
I don't like them getting away either. If someone has annoyed me to the point where I feel the need to fire upon them, I'm firing upon them because I want to inflict a penalty for what they have done to me.
If I want to be left alone without taking the arbitrary and gamist step of hiding in solo or private, I need to establish a reputation for retaliation, or otherwise look like I am more trouble than I am worth, just like in real life.
I don't think you would like fighting me at all.
I'd never disconnect, and I rarely use SCBs, but I don't fight to provide entertainment for any ass who fires upon or interdicts me. I fight to do as much harm to my opponent's credit reserves while suffering as little harm to my own as possible.
I'll happily kite someone around for thirty minutes until they run out of ammo and then shoot out their engines the second I see them retract weapons in preparation for a jump.
I flee the moment I lose confidence in my ability to defeat my opponent, while retaining confidence in my ability to escape.
Usually I make this call before hostilities are even started. If you are someone I know, or have reason to suspect, is a talented pilot, and I see notice you moving toward me, I'm not going to let you get within 3km, especially if your ship is of comparable speed to my own (the slower your ship, the better my margin for error).
Poor reason to disconnect. Good reason to seek revenge.
I remember the person responsible for my first death back in Beta 1.03. Took me five days and several hours of shadowing him around unregulated space, but he eventually put himself in a vulnerable position
It was a great experience from the second he opened fire on me without provocation, to Freeport blowing me out of the sky as one of my shots meant for him struck the station, to the moment his vastly more expensive vessel exploded in a spray of debris five days later after I ambushed him while he was fighting someone else.
Now, I'm not holding grudges from pre-release times, but my list is ready, and I will never forget a slight. Can't get slighted, and can't experience the orgasmic joys of vengeance when it's least expected, if I hide in Solo.
I prefer to submit to the first interdiction, immediately run and jump out, then if I am still being pursued, I drop to normal space, hyperspace jump three or four times in rapid succession, drop to mormal space again, boost, flick FA off, and shut down all systems except for life support...then I go get some coffee and find somewhere else to do missions when I get back.
Of course, this assumes I had to run in the first place, which is rare.
This is positively suicidal if the opposing pilot has hostile intent.
I agree.