Attention all Pirates, Pirate corporations, Pirate Leaders, and PVPers in general.

[Bigcheese]

So, if being attacked by a greatly superior ship/far more skilled pilot is so much fun for the victim... why are they all going to solo?

Maybe YOU need to stop telling other people how they should be playing their game.

Because danger makes them throw up their hands and quit, so solo is the better place for them. They should try pve groups as well. You guys clearly don't enjoy risk so use the options available.

The only person telling others how to play is YOU. I'm saying you need to stop or find like minded individuals to play with. Trying to make everyone conform to you is insanely selfish.

 

[Cosmos]

The problem with piracy atm imo is that its not that great a part of the game, mostly because being caught with stolen goods is extremely punative from a faction point of view. 10 cans of stolen gold got me hostile with the Empire. I don't know if that was a bug, but as it stands I find smuggling stuff not worth the risk or the effort and potential loss of rep.

That said I have done missions to aquire black boxes and rebel transmissions etc..

 

[Julio Montega]

Good luck OP,
may you train some worthy apprentices.

 

[Sandmann]

Because danger makes them throw up their hands and quit, so solo is the better place for them. They should try pve groups as well.

You guys clearly don't enjoy risk so use the options available. The only person telling others how to play is YOU genius. I'm saying you need to stop or find like minded individuals. Duh.

That's the point you seem to be missing here so I'll return your "duh" to you. They ARE going to the solo and groups mode.. and that's what the PvPers are complaining about. Then along you come telling us "You really need to stop trying to pretend pvp is griefing" while accusing me of telling people how they have to play. No.. I'll say it again simply for you and maybe you'll get it this time:

If your game takes away your victims fun they will leave. If they do this, don't complain that you don't have any more victims. If you want them to stay, make it fun for them too. You don't HAVE to do anything different, but don't complain about the consequences.

Now, do you see where I'm NOT telling pirates, pvpers etc how they "have to" or "should" play their game?

 

[Bigcheese]

That's the point you seem to be missing here so I'll return your "duh" to you. They ARE going to the solo and groups mode.. and that's what the PvPers are complaining about. Then along you come telling us "You really need to stop trying to pretend pvp is griefing" while accusing me of telling people how they have to play. No.. I'll say it again simply for you and maybe you'll get it this time:

If your game takes away your victims fun they will leave. If they do this, don't complain that you don't have any more victims. If you want them to stay, make it fun for them too. You don't HAVE to do anything different, but don't complain about the consequences.

Now, do you see where I'm NOT telling pirates, pvpers etc how they "have to" or "should" play their game?

Pirates are too much for you, we get it. Despite the nearly endless options everyone has at their disposal to deal with it, you'd rather everyone just quit doing something you have no interest in.

You are very self centered. Please understand everyone doesn't want the dull, everybody holding hands experience you want. One of the best reasons to play in open is having other players attack. It makes things dangerous (you know, like the name of the game) and is a lot of fun for many people. If you play in open, any reasonable person would expect to get attacked at some point.

Even though you can play how you want and easily avoid it, you'd rather nobody pirate at all. I hope FD ignores people with such obviously self serving "feedback". There's always those people that think everyone should play a game like they do and campaign to have alternatives removed, you're one of them. Try to be aware of that when attempting to dictate how people should play.

 

[technophebe]

Pirates are too much for you, we get it. Despite the nearly endless options everyone has at their disposal to deal with it, you'd rather everyone just quit doing something you have no interest in.

You are very self centered. Please understand everyone doesn't want the dull, everybody holding hands experience you want.

Is this nonsense still going on in here? Can we please get some moderation and get unpleasantness locked?

 

[Sandmann]

Pirates are too much for you, we get it. Despite the nearly endless options everyone has at their disposal to deal with it, you'd rather everyone just quit doing something you have no interest in.

Uh.. no. I'm happy for you to do what ever you want. If you annoy me I'll either shoot you or avoid you.

You are very self centered. Please understand everyone doesn't want the dull, everybody holding hands experience you want.

You're aware that it's YOU telling people "if you don't want to play it my way, go play in solo" right? But yeah, I'm self centred... sure.

One of the best reasons to play in open is having other players attack. It makes thing dangerous (you know, like the name of the game) and is a lot of fun for many people.

Yes we all understand that's what YOU like best about playing open. You've made quite a bit of noise about that and I think we're all very clear on what you think now. This may come as a surprise to you but other people like open for different things. People are ALLOWED to be different from you, y'know? Err and FYI the "dangerous" in the name refers to the rank you have to be before being offered "elite" status. Y'know, Elite, like in the game's name?

Even though you can play how you want and easily avoid it, you'd rather nobody pirate at all. I hope FD ignore people with such obviously self serving "feedback". There's always those people that think everyone should play a game like they do, you're one of them. Try to be aware of that when attempting to dictate how people play.

I'm not the one telling people "Play my way or go play somewhere else". I'm the one saying "it should be fun for everyone, not just for you." Now, who's dictating?

 

[Adrian Steel]

They ARE going to the solo and groups mode.. and that's what the PvPers are complaining about.

Not in this thread, surely.

 

[Bigcheese]

Is this nonsense still going on in here? Can we please get some moderation and get unpleasantness locked?

Hey, I just got here. But yeah, trying to dictate everyone's behavior is a good way to start an argument. I guess this has been going on for a while so I'll stop.

Uh.. no. I'm happy for you to do what ever you want.

Then please stop crying about pirating and pretending it's something bad. You have all the options you need to play how you like. No need to neuter the game for the more adventurous folks. Frontier space should be dangerous. Thanks.

 

[Sandmann]

I don't know how the devs plan on addressing these:
[snip]
- Bouncing back and forth between groups to avoid players. (I think characters should be locked to specific groups. Players should not be able to influence the market/storyline/influence system in the "all group" by playing in other groups.)

Not in this thread, surely.

Quite possibly, yes.

- - - - - Additional Content Posted / Auto Merge - - - - -

Then please stop crying about pirating and pretending it's something bad. You have all the options you need to play how you like. No need to neuter the game for the more adventurous folks. Frontier space should be dangerous. Thanks.

If you're going to continue attempting to argue with me you really should read and understand what I've said first, which apparently you don't. As such, I'm no longer going to be responding to your feeble attempts to insult me.

[edit] Sorry, that last bit for some reason was quoted as coming from Adrian Steele instead of BigCheese. I've corrected the quote

 

[Jenner]

Knock off the trolling/sniping people.

 

[Zhang]

Those 'Space truckers' are the ones that made this game possible by funding it.

Oh? Is that a fact? You mean, our money is different than yours?

 

[Balance]

So now that my thread's been highjacked, I might as well throw my hat in the ring. A lot of what's said here is 100% correct. Currently, there is no incentive for PVE players to play in the open world, they only open themselves up to pilots looking to take their stuff. Insert care bear game comments here.

Is that an issue? Yep. Sure is. There's no way you can tell me that the game isn't keeping people away by limiting PVP. That being said - PVE Space Truckers aren't the only factor here, in fact, it's (if anything) one of the smaller ones. The biggest one being how big the damn game is. 400 Billion systems. Lots of explorers. Lots of trade runners making the long hauls for profit. Assume everyone on earth is playing 100% of the time. Chances of running into someone? Slim.

Moving onto the point of what I was trying to accomplish here - there are many of us interested in waiting this out and seeing of E/D becomes a place where we can enjoy the way -we- want to play the game as well. Some of us have already given up and left, I've got ~50 people that just wanted to reach out and ask to be notified if things change. So I'm a mail list administrator now. Wonderful.

The rest of us will do what we can to enjoy the game as we like. Sure, it's going to be a lot harder on our end, simply because finding people to 'pirate' won't be easy. Finding other PVPers to either fight, or fight with, will take time. But there's at least 150 of us (and growing pretty rapidly) waiting to stick it out and work together, now, hoping that on the horizon there will be a little more focus on what we'd like to see in the game.

On a personal note, I'm not sure what the direction of the game is going to do to it in the long run. IMO Games that have no risk have no reward, and when the honeymoon period ends most people leave. Hauling system to system is fun (I guess), but ultimately will become boring as you are unchallenged, and will (quite quickly, if you're doing it right) eventually have nothing to spend your hard earned $ on. This is a great space sim, it has the potential to be something huge, catering to many audiences, not just those looking to fly space ships and PVE with minimal challenges.

Explorers? This is your paradise. Enjoy it. The chances of ever even seeing a pirate, or PVP fight are almost zero. I might be joining you in those efforts sooner rather than later.

In closing - stop hijacking my thread. Let me use it to continue to organize those of us PVPers that do want to stick around. There's no way it can possibly affect you unless you want it to. And who knows, maybe it'll even draw in some folk and get Frontier some more $.

Thanks.

 

[Sandmann]

First, I'd like to apologise for any part I played in the hijacking - it wasn't my intent.

Second, are you aware there are PvP groups? It's not only the PvEers who are doing it. Now, if your goal is to pirate players who aren't there specifically to be pirated that may not help you, but if your goal is real combat against other people and the current situation doesn't meet your needs then that may be a better plan? If you got your 150 friends and made a pirate group (or joined one of the existing ones) and limited the groups' travels to a certain sector of space you'd suddenly start seeing lots of hollow squares, right?

Before anyone accuses me of "telling pirates how to play"... no I'm not. Just making a suggestion - how you play is up to you.

 

[Julio Montega]

So now that my thread's been highjacked, I might as well throw my hat in the ring. A lot of what's said here is 100% correct. Currently, there is no incentive for PVE players to play in the open world, they only open themselves up to pilots looking to take their stuff. Insert care bear game comments here.

Is that an issue? Yep. Sure is. There's no way you can tell me that the game isn't keeping people away by limiting PVP. That being said - PVE Space Truckers aren't the only factor here, in fact, it's (if anything) one of the smaller ones. The biggest one being how big the damn game is. 400 Billion systems. Lots of explorers. Lots of trade runners making the long hauls for profit. Assume everyone on earth is playing 100% of the time. Chances of running into someone? Slim.

Moving onto the point of what I was trying to accomplish here - there are many of us interested in waiting this out and seeing of E/D becomes a place where we can enjoy the way -we- want to play the game as well. Some of us have already given up and left, I've got ~50 people that just wanted to reach out and ask to be notified if things change. So I'm a mail list administrator now. Wonderful.

The rest of us will do what we can to enjoy the game as we like. Sure, it's going to be a lot harder on our end, simply because finding people to 'pirate' won't be easy. Finding other PVPers to either fight, or fight with, will take time. But there's at least 150 of us (and growing pretty rapidly) waiting to stick it out and work together, now, hoping that on the horizon there will be a little more focus on what we'd like to see in the game.

On a personal note, I'm not sure what the direction of the game is going to do to it in the long run. IMO Games that have no risk have no reward, and when the honeymoon period ends most people leave. Hauling system to system is fun (I guess), but ultimately will become boring as you are unchallenged, and will (quite quickly, if you're doing it right) eventually have nothing to spend your hard earned $ on. This is a great space sim, it has the potential to be something huge, catering to many audiences, not just those looking to fly space ships and PVE with minimal challenges.

Explorers? This is your paradise. Enjoy it. The chances of ever even seeing a pirate, or PVP fight are almost zero. I might be joining you in those efforts sooner rather than later.

In closing - stop hijacking my thread. Let me use it to continue to organize those of us PVPers that do want to stick around. There's no way it can possibly affect you unless you want it to. And who knows, maybe it'll even draw in some folk and get Frontier some more $.

Thanks.

Let me suggest something:

Take small steps with this organizing task,
why not try to find like minded brothers and sisters out there and free a system to your liking,
like the Lugh movement did try.

There is a system near a starter area with the right settings,
a black market and a nearby neutral system with shops and repairs for the "brotherhood".

Step 1:
Free the system of oppression and return it to pure freedom,
anarchy of it's best.

Step 2:
Find people willing to stay near the system and expand,
root out the black sheep amongst your brethren, who will go renegade and hunt each other for cash.

Step 3:
Wing mechanic in january.

It is time to set the stage.

 

[Balance]

RE: Sandmann - Yes, I'm very aware there are PVP groups - they're who I'm working with for the most part. And it's the only way to get reliable action at the moment.

To pseudo-quote Jurassic Park - some PVPers don't want to be fed, they want to hunt. Organized fights, melee's, etc. are fantastic. But the unpredictability of combat is also something a lot of us desire as well.

RE:Julio - Please don't quote entire multi-paragraph posts, it's obnoxious.

Solid forward thinking, we're already doing that in two locations. And eagerly awaiting the January additions to the game. You mentioned take small steps - this forum post wasn't the first step, I took those over a week ago now. This was an attempt to garner more interest - but at this point, I'm seriously regretting posting on these forums. If there was a way for me to delete this topic, I definitely would have by now.

 

[Sandmann]

Yes, I'm very aware. They're who I'm working with for the most part. And it's the only way to get reliable action at the moment.

To pseudo-quote Jurassic Park - some PVPers don't want to be fed, they want to hunt. Organized fights, melee's, etc. are fantastic. But the unpredictability of combat is also something a lot of us desire as well.

Yeah I get the whole hunting thing, as long as you're not shooting tigers with machine guns, to misquote Michael Caine. There's not a lot of unpredictability in hunting a hauler with a maxed viper etc.

 

[Connatic]

The threat of Piracy is what makes Trading/Exploring/Bounty hunting fun! It completes the interstellar food chain.

If it turns out that 90% of the player base are 84ers that consider any form of PvP Piracy "Griefing", well then so be it. If that's the case, then Frontier better balance it out by making any PvE aspect of Piracy and Bounty hunting more fun, profitable, and challenging. We just have to accept the fact that the game is set up in a way that people can opt-out of PvP very easily. It's just aggravating to me to see people post complaining about being killed by a Pirate/Griefer in Open play. I thought that was the whole point of open play! To experience the risk of facing truly deadly opponents. We just need to make sure the costs of committing mass murder are high enough to discourage it to the point where it's pretty rare. You Pirate commodities...not dead bodies and souls. I feel this needs to be achieved before every Hauler and Type-9 leaves Open play for good.

Really I hope Wings/Squadrons will help fix this. Instead of your average Space Trucker leaving Open play to make a safer trade route...they can just bring their friend along to escort them in a Viper.

Explorers? This is your paradise. Enjoy it. The chances of ever even seeing a pirate, or PVP fight are almost zero. I might be joining you in those efforts sooner rather than later.

I wish there could be a way to steal Explorers data so there might be some incentive for "pirate explorers". ;D But really it would be nice in the future for there just to be a new type of NPC spawn for "Deep space". Like other hostile explorers, or those Thargoid alien things I've heard about.

 

[Andovar]

I also want to kill people and take their stuff.

Wait, what?
You want to kill people and take their stuff? Maybe i missed something, but how are you planning on stealing someones stuff if you blow them up? I thought the whole point of pirating was the art of stealing.

Don't get me wrong, I have no issues with pirating or those who play that role (I actually respect it because it seems like a damn difficult one).
I also wouldn't have any issue with dropping some cargo for a pirate if that's what I need to do to get away from a superior pilot in a superior ship. But if you blow me up after I give up the cargo, I'll be damned if I give it up the next time. All you'd get from me was a bounty on your head.

Please tell me I read that wrong, and you're not actually promoting stealing and then killing the person you stole from?

 

[Zing Freelancer]

I'm offering information on where fellow pirates are operating. When they play. What kind of operations they're running, and what their goals are. Looking for a pirate corp?
-B

I am a bounty hunter, how much for the information?