I don't think anyone has a problem with pirates do they? I welcome any attempt to pirate me (which if I can't get away will probably be successful), not that it's even happened yet.
please don't confuse PvPers with griefers
- Thread starter ReaperAlex
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PvP is a lot like sex.
Doing it by yourself or with someone who agrees to do it with you is just fine and can be a lot of fun. Doing it to someone else without their consent is not okay.
And no, just being in Open isn't justification any more than "dressing like that" or walking down a given street IRL
Doing it by yourself or with someone who agrees to do it with you is just fine and can be a lot of fun. Doing it to someone else without their consent is not okay.
And no, just being in Open isn't justification any more than "dressing like that" or walking down a given street IRL
Well this certainly is a big post. Too big for a troll post? Maybe not, lets hope you actually believe what you say
First of all, it sounds like you want to attack new players, but want to let everyone on the forums know it isn't because you want to cause them grief, its because you enjoy an unfair fight. Am I reading this wrong?
If you are lucky to find a player then you can attack them if you want, the game doesn't forbid this, but many things have been set up to discourage this.
Combat zones exist for combat, PvP is encouraged here, there are no bounties for killing.
Piracy is hard enough to do right now, having someone such as yourself killing players for no reason, other than you like an unfair fight (please correct me if I have misunderstood this), will make players leave open and play in solo.
I agree that all PvP isn't griefing, but your post has convinced me that the only PvP you are interested in would be called griefing.
Did you start attacking other players in your sidewinder, or did you grind some money in solo so you can start the PvP with a "real" ship?
I'd have to ask you, right at the start, what actions would constitute causing grief?
Under what definition would someone call them griefers, or not call them griefers?
Well I'm not sure how a newbie can talk to one of your good natured PvPers after they are dead, but you really should say this is how you will/would act, not some generalisation of all players who play in open.
Here's when I'm not sure if the trolling begins. These PvPers (lets call them you so you don't speak for others) "want to have fun scrapping", but will not pick a fair fight. You will also offer advice to the newbies that you kill.
First of all, it sounds like you want to attack new players, but want to let everyone on the forums know it isn't because you want to cause them grief, its because you enjoy an unfair fight. Am I reading this wrong?
I really think you have bought the wrong game. I don't want to use the word griefer, lets say bully. Attacking someone as they undock is pretty low. I commend you for being able to do it without dying, the stations have been set up to stop this behavior from happening, not as a challenge, but because many players would call you a griefer.
Personally I would like this feature, but the players I have fought have usually instigated the fight with me, or I've asked them if they want to do some PvP. I can't imagine anyone at the end of your seal club would want to chat, they will probably set you to ignore in the hopes of never seeing you again.
Nothing wrong with players not wanting to lose their ship, saying you don't want to fight an NPC because its too hard is a bit strange. PvP combat should be much harder than an elite anaconda. Am i still reading your post wrong, are you saying you want to fight new players who are in weaker ships than yourself?
Well you are back talking about a PvPer as if this is a thing. There are many systems in Elite Dangerous and the game is set up as a single player game, that just happens to have some other players in it. Outside of some busy systems it is rare to see another player. This isn't the game for you is you only want to attack actual people.
If you are lucky to find a player then you can attack them if you want, the game doesn't forbid this, but many things have been set up to discourage this.
Combat zones exist for combat, PvP is encouraged here, there are no bounties for killing.
Piracy is hard enough to do right now, having someone such as yourself killing players for no reason, other than you like an unfair fight (please correct me if I have misunderstood this), will make players leave open and play in solo.
I agree that all PvP isn't griefing, but your post has convinced me that the only PvP you are interested in would be called griefing.
Did you start attacking other players in your sidewinder, or did you grind some money in solo so you can start the PvP with a "real" ship?
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I think FD would be doing themselves a favor simplifying and fixing coms so that proper pirates and bounty hunters can go about their business and non combative players. As well as making it easier to give portions of wealth away for non combatants to satisfy demands.
I only tried to deposit cargo once and it seemed to be a all or nothing thing last time I tried (unless that changed recently).
Meanwhile I'll probably be sticking to the Mobius PvE group. The last few days I haven't been able to text chat to any of my War Thunder squad mates that also play ED. The messages seldom get through. With working coms players might seem more than just faceless but less predictable NPC's to PvP fanciers There might be more opportunities to negotiate your way around a battle, find safety in numbers as well as put player initiated bounties on those that truly misbehave in a griefing type fashion.
I only tried to deposit cargo once and it seemed to be a all or nothing thing last time I tried (unless that changed recently).
Meanwhile I'll probably be sticking to the Mobius PvE group. The last few days I haven't been able to text chat to any of my War Thunder squad mates that also play ED. The messages seldom get through. With working coms players might seem more than just faceless but less predictable NPC's to PvP fanciers There might be more opportunities to negotiate your way around a battle, find safety in numbers as well as put player initiated bounties on those that truly misbehave in a griefing type fashion.
I find this thread an interesting debate. The PvPers want to be respected for attacking people unprovoked. In our modern society there are even playing fields for competition. A boxer that is a heavyweight champion isn't put into the ring with a welterweight amateur because the heavyweight want's a good "scrap". This scenario is similar to what PvPers are trying to defend, and its a hard argument to make with rational minded law abiding citizens. Someone who picks on an obviously weaker target unprovoked is a bully, griefer or whatever other adjective applies to someone taking advantage of someone else. You can say that this is an open world game with sandbox game-play with PvP elements, and therefore its just part of the game and people should expect it. Does that make it ok? Is attacking someone because you want a fight a good reason?
I pose these questions because I think its a common theme in a lot of video-gaming communities. Games that are competitive in nature can be plagued with people who don't want to compete for the sake of a challenge or the thrill of victory, but for the simple pleasure of causing someone harm. The difficulty for many people on the receiving end of PvPers is they don't see the distinction.
If I'm walking down the street and a big burly dude walks up to me in my sandbox world where I deliver pizzas for a living. He says to me "give me your pizza and put up your fists I want to fight you and take your pizza." Would I be expected to look at that person and think; well that's cool because he looks like a PvPer so he just wants a good fight?
Just trying to put this argument in the scope of how we as humans think about our interactions in real life. I like to think as a gamer that even though I am separated by the internet from another person I should follow normal societal moral codes and values. I think in there are more and more people who feel that because its online, its not real life and there's an internet between us so its ok to act however we want.
Just my 2 pennies
I will continue to enjoy my gaming and ED with the hopes that I don't get shot down just for being a trader/smuggler.
I pose these questions because I think its a common theme in a lot of video-gaming communities. Games that are competitive in nature can be plagued with people who don't want to compete for the sake of a challenge or the thrill of victory, but for the simple pleasure of causing someone harm. The difficulty for many people on the receiving end of PvPers is they don't see the distinction.
If I'm walking down the street and a big burly dude walks up to me in my sandbox world where I deliver pizzas for a living. He says to me "give me your pizza and put up your fists I want to fight you and take your pizza." Would I be expected to look at that person and think; well that's cool because he looks like a PvPer so he just wants a good fight?
Just trying to put this argument in the scope of how we as humans think about our interactions in real life. I like to think as a gamer that even though I am separated by the internet from another person I should follow normal societal moral codes and values. I think in there are more and more people who feel that because its online, its not real life and there's an internet between us so its ok to act however we want.
Just my 2 pennies
I will continue to enjoy my gaming and ED with the hopes that I don't get shot down just for being a trader/smuggler.
People that flood forums with negativity
Yet things like piracy are very much part of the game (and always have been), and not something that I feel should be complained about, any more than if you take part in a game that's 100% PvP and complain about being shot at. If you don't want that there should be dull, safe, low profit trade routes to stick to. It's when people go further than that and don't do it for any in-game reason but simply because they like annoying people that it becomes wrong IMO. The type of people who'll join team PvP games and spend their time teamkilling.
For those who just want a fight a duelling area would be welcome. No reason someone couldn't organise it now although there isn't any way of getting any award from it (unless everyone deliberately racks up a bounty first). If at some point we can transfer money then a real high-risk, high-gain one would be possible.
Yes, and this is not one of them. This is one of the ones where everyone is thrown in together (technical issues notwithstanding) and it's up to you to avoid the unfair fights.
The only things which are not ok in a game are the things which violate the rules.
It's interesting that you compare an even fight to a boxing match, but when the fight is unfair you try to "put this argument in the scope of how we as humans think about our interactions in real life" and say that in a game "I should follow normal societal moral codes and values". If, instead of making idiotic comparisons to muggings, you actually make the comparison, you would find that in our real life interactions with other people, we find hitting people in the face unacceptable, unless it is part of a game. Everything done in ED is part of a game too.
Yet people who manage to stick to the letter of the rules in games yet completely fly in the face of the spirit of them often come in for a lot of criticism. Piracy, bounty hunting, hell, even blowing away people you know are Feds if you're a staunch Imperialist are all in the spirit as well as the rules. Blasting Sidewinders when they launch for the first time is not.
i admit that im feeling quite depressed atm and not feeling much like logging into the game, but i don't think i am over dramatic.
i have received RL threats !! because i supported PVP on the forums.
and i have been a pvp player in eve online for over 10 years and never did i ever experience something like that there.
what an unbelievable and highly inappropriate comparison of a mode of gameplay, GAMEPLAY!! with The nastiest of real life crimes
IQs have seriously dropped in here deary me
The entire point of the OP was "Don't hate me because I PvP." Sure, piracy exists in the game, and that's fine. But pirates are generally despised by civil societies because they violate the social contracts among people. PvPers are doing the same thing and should also expect to be hated by the majority of the game's society. PvPers don't just get to demand that their chosen playing style be respected among players who are trying to be law-abiding. They are, be definition, a scourge on everyone else in the game.
Now, this IS a game, and we respect the role-playing aspect of it. That is why people are discussing situations like piracy, war/faction fighting, and when profit is involved as justification for PvP against people who would rather not participate. In fact, I would say that the difference between valid PvP and griefing is whether there is an in-game justification - whether game mechanics or in role-playing. So if you want to be a pirate, own it. Don't come whining to the forum because people don't like you blowing their ships up.
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Hit a little too close to home?
Griefing is the price you need to pay to have freedom in a videogame. You can't have freedom if you don't have the option to do bad things.
That being said, If there was an option to find people who actually want to fight, most pvpers would stick to it.
That being said, If there was an option to find people who actually want to fight, most pvpers would stick to it.
In game and in character sure, but if you hate them in real life over their behaviour in a game, you need a reality check.
Hush, go back playing Elite: Space Trucker, in Solo Mode
Set up a PvP group and advertize it like the PvE and oldtimer groups that are already out there. There might already be one. The tricky part is getting enough players in the group that you might actually meet some. With Mobius PvE I have only seen one person in the last week and that group is fast approaching 2000 players.
Oh absolutely agreed! What kind of mental defectives hate people IRL over what happens in a video game?
ETA: Yes, I know they exist, unfortunately. I just like to pretend they don't.
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