Collection of Ideas for Elite 4

[Kipper]

Thing with jump gates is... why would you? I mean if you have developed on board hyperspace system.

Like someone said, it detracts from a game because it gives you the impression of linearity. IE, I can't just go wherever i want when i want, i have to navigate through several sets of gates.... in the X series, each system felt like an arena, rather than part of one big universe.

Small ships with insufficient hull space to mount a drive would dock with larger ships in their fleet for the jump. There would be in-system only type vessels as well as hyperspacing cruiser types.

Not to mention the largest ships which might not hyperspace, they might just cruise between systems on autopilot!

 

[VR jefranklin18]

Thing with jump gates is... why would you? I mean if you have developed on board hyperspace system.

Like someone said, it detracts from a game because it gives you the impression of linearity. IE, I can't just go wherever i want when i want, i have to navigate through several sets of gates.... in the X series, each system felt like an arena, rather than part of one big universe.

Small ships with insufficient hull space to mount a drive would dock with larger ships in their fleet for the jump. There would be in-system only type vessels as well as hyperspacing cruiser types.

I see jump gates kind of being like toll bridges: there are normally other ways to get across the obstruction but they normally take a longer route. If you have a higher charge for using a jump gate, those in a Kestrel airfighter or similar could use them.

Although piggy-backing on a capital class vessel could be option, this could be set up so that it takes longer (eg insufficient range to jump over longer ranges) or risky (going through pirate-infested areas without any means of defending yourself).

All three options (on-board hyperdrive, jumpgates and capital-class vessels) would be cool

 

[Kipper]

You could draw a parallel with current aviation operation. Assume that travel between continents on earth equals interstellar/inter-system travel. Assume that travel between planets or bases in system is equivalent to domestic travel.

So small private planes on earth don't ever go very far from 'home' - they're not designed to. Small fighters travel the world, but not under their own steam, they operate from carriers (capital ships, if you will).

When it comes to large bombers and civilian liners, well they operate from their own vast on-board fuel reserves and can operate sometimes globally without having to stop.

A jump gate then would be the equivalent of strapping a shuttle's rocket booster to the bottom of either of these classes of aircraft. IE, ridiculous! You just have to pick the craft that is designed to do the job you want it to do!

 

[basilb]

As I said before networks of jump gates could help to represent the 'organisation' of certain groups of systems, like the federation or empire. for example you would not be able to find a jump gate from a federation system to one alligned to the empire.

from the point of view of logistics, it would be more economically viable for Alliances of systems to set-up jump gates for cheap transporters to ferry regularly demanded goods around (along well established trade routes), than to equip each individual transport with a hyperdrive.

the knock-on effect for the gamer of course would be that trading could become a far more challenging prospect. for example take this scenario:-

you are at a starport in a stable system aligned to the federation.
Choice A
you can pick up computers which are manufactured there, and transport them to another system within the federation that demands them. however because it is along a well established trade route via jump-gates, you know the best profit margin you'll get is 1% on what you transport.

Choice B
at the same time, a report has just come in from a landing commander that an armed conflict has broken out between 2 independent groups (lets call them Sirius Corp., and erm QuasarCheese Plc.) over a close (8-15 l.years) and as yet un-affiliated system. There is a starport on one of the planets there in dire need of medical supplies to treat wounded, with no inter-stellar communications set-up to call for help.

So you could choose to take the low risk low reward route, with cheap over heads being basic fuel and jump-gate toll. On the other hand you could load up your ship with medical supplies (which arn't even that cheap in the federated system), buy some expensive hyperdrive fuel and self-jump to the embattled system. Of course in your journey from exit point of hyper space (which is further from starports than jump gates would be) to starport, you would risk being shot at by either groups military ships. Should you make it to the starport, you personally would be able to set the selling price for the medical supplies. (as an addition you could opt to give away the medical supplies for free/at cost price, doing so giving a large prestige/reputation bonus to your commander in the game universe)

{ there are variations on the idea of taking supplies to such a system. You could instead choose to take weapons to one of the groups, docking with their fighter-carrier ships (maybe going so far as to sell to the highest bidder), though becoming a confirmed QuasarCheese arms supplier would put you at threat of determined attacks by Sirius forces. If you become a loyal and well regarded arms supplier, groups you sell to might even go so far as giving you military escorts.}
_______________________________________________________

p.s. woh didn't mean to write that much. all i have left to say is i'm gonna make a "To jump gate or not" thread so the J.G. discussion doesn't get in the way of ppl's other ideas

 

[VR jefranklin18]

Hmm, thinking about giving things away you could do the same with slaves.

Load up a Panther clipper with slaves and when you are on a planet you could release them. 1 ton would be about 20 slaves (assuming they're about 50kg each), so there could also be a cost of 2000 credits to release them as you give them 100 each to make their way. That would give you a good reputation

Of course, if you dump them on an unhabited planet they would fall in to anarchy pretty soon.

I wonder if anyone from Frontier is reading this thread? I know that DB is not too keen on soliciting ideas from the community for fear of law suits over "idea theft".

 

[caol]

Hmm, thinking about giving things away you could do the same with slaves.

Load up a Panther clipper with slaves and when you are on a planet you could release them. 1 ton would be about 20 slaves (assuming they're about 50kg each), so there could also be a cost of 2000 credits to release them as you give them 100 each to make their way. That would give you a good reputation

Of course, if you dump them on an unhabited planet they would fall in to anarchy pretty soon.

I wonder if anyone from Frontier is reading this thread? I know that DB is not too keen on soliciting ideas from the community for fear of law suits over "idea theft".

Hey! That was one of my ideas! No but seriously though I always thought the whole setting slaves free thing would be cool too.

 

[DeLeiros]

I'm liking some of these ideas...how's about forget Frontier and we all get together to make our own game.

 

[VR jefranklin18]

I'm liking some of these ideas...how's about forget Frontier and we all get together to make our own game.

The problem is a lot of the hobbyist atempts at a Frontier replacement soon lose steam due to the amount of work that needs to be put in. Better to wait for DB and co to bring out E4.

In the mean time, we keep posting here and they will get the message that we're pretty keen for it

 

[DeLeiros]

The problem is a lot of the hobbyist atempts at a Frontier replacement soon lose steam due to the amount of work that needs to be put in. Better to wait for DB and co to bring out E4.

In the mean time, we keep posting here and they will get the message that we're pretty keen for it

Don't you worry...I wouldn't dream of doing anything of the sort. But a canny game maker could do a lot worse .

 

[Cyborg]

Possible...perhaps...?

Hi Folks,

I think you are right with the Idea, to allow Jump gates for established Trade Routes... but not for Elite... it´s not realistic enough....

Perhaps...
For Jump via Hyperspace, a target is needed...
The Sun(s) are great targets, but a bit Hot
so we take a second big Mass and calculate again...
We target a point between the two biggest Masses in a System.
Then, every System gets an arrival point (or two...2 Suns...3...)
That’s a Jump gate without a gate...(one way)

The other way...it’s up to you...jump were you want...

For MP I have no idea to realise a short flight time without a time accelerator.
And this tricky thing isn’t useful for MP...?????

Greetz

 

[DeLeiros]

Had an extra thought, and that was to make the trading more versatile/realistic.

When I decide to buy something there's first a choice of shops (Tescos vs Waitrsoe), and then a choice of brands (Kellogs vs Nestle) and then a choose of products (cornflakes vs rice crispies). It would be nice to see something similar. So when you go to a planet or there's a choice of markets, different brands within those markets, and different quality goods. That way there could be a rating of quality/durability etc for each product and you can choose between different sellers. And if you are a regular customer or bulk buy, maybe you could get discounts.

Or maybe you could look for orders in one system...So in Sol I see an ad for wanting a regular supply of Easter eggs for easter, so I agree with the trader that I'll do a regular flight to another system to pick 'em up over 3-4 months, bringing X tonnes/month. Silly example, but something like that.

And just to add extra falour, maybe you could choose to do this all yourself, or hire someone to do it for you.

Right, back to the desk job now

 

[VR jefranklin18]

Had an extra thought, and that was to make the trading more versatile/realistic.

When I decide to buy something there's first a choice of shops (Tescos vs Waitrsoe), and then a choice of brands (Kellogs vs Nestle) and then a choose of products (cornflakes vs rice crispies). It would be nice to see something similar. So when you go to a planet or there's a choice of markets, different brands within those markets, and different quality goods. That way there could be a rating of quality/durability etc for each product and you can choose between different sellers. And if you are a regular customer or bulk buy, maybe you could get discounts.

The same could be extended to servicing your vessel. Flying into a port and only having one choice of service technician always smacked of communism to me.

Or maybe you could look for orders in one system...So in Sol I see an ad for wanting a regular supply of Easter eggs for easter, so I agree with the trader that I'll do a regular flight to another system to pick 'em up over 3-4 months, bringing X tonnes/month. Silly example, but something like that.

Pre-contracted deliveries? Possible but I don't know if people would want the commitment to do that for a period of time. There's a whole universe out there to explore!

Chucking in an idea of my own, regular passenger runs between major systems where the vessel is mainly passenger cabins. Bringing the age of steamliner to the Frontier universe. There could also be the different classes of cabin (mentioned earlier I think) for people to ride in, with cosequently different ticket prices.

Right, back to the desk job now

That sucks. My 6 month world trip is currently at the 8 month mark. Really must get my CV out there sometime.

 

[waitingfordavid]

JazHaz - you're in luck - the game you described already exists.

Its called 'eve online'.

yes..and if you can find an online college that has a course showing you how to play....then ....your a smarter man than i...
and im pretty farking smart thank you very much
~m

 

[RAK]

Had an extra thought, and that was to make the trading more versatile/realistic.

When I decide to buy something there's first a choice of shops (Tescos vs Waitrsoe), and then a choice of brands (Kellogs vs Nestle) and then a choose of products (cornflakes vs rice crispies). It would be nice to see something similar. So when you go to a planet or there's a choice of markets, different brands within those markets, and different quality goods. That way there could be a rating of quality/durability etc for each product and you can choose between different sellers. And if you are a regular customer or bulk buy, maybe you could get discounts.

Or maybe you could look for orders in one system...So in Sol I see an ad for wanting a regular supply of Easter eggs for easter, so I agree with the trader that I'll do a regular flight to another system to pick 'em up over 3-4 months, bringing X tonnes/month. Silly example, but something like that.

And just to add extra falour, maybe you could choose to do this all yourself, or hire someone to do it for you.

Excellent idea, but first of all, you'd want to diversify the standard trading system a bit more. While there might be a lot of choices on what you can buy, there are only a few logical choices. Usually, on the industrial end, you pick up Computers and Robots, and at the agricultural/tourist end, you pick up Luxury Goods and possibly Liquor. This means that things such as Industrial Parts and Heavy Plastics wouldn't make as much sense to buy.

Here's a small suggestion off the top of my head: Trade thresholds. Things like Luxury Goods aren't going to be in as much relative demand as Grain, for example. Therefore, as you sell Luxury Goods in large quantities, prices for them drop every time you sell. However, for things like Fruit and Veg and Industrial Parts, the reduction would be slim, if existent at all. I'm not sure whether it's a good idea - as I said, I just came up with it off the top of my head.

But anyway... Journals. I really liked the idea and it marvellously told the story and set the game well. How about a couple of others, such as the What Spaceship? or Pilot's Trader sort? How about a bit more detail - flesh them out a bit... perhaps newsletter size or something like that?

Oh, and the smaller "fighter" class spaceships, also the Shuttle and Lifter - how about improving those, by fitting them with kit which would suit what they do, but "fixing" it so that the craft are specialised? The Interplanetary Shuttle is meant to be a small courier craft for between spaceport to spaceport - how about a few fixed cabins? The Lifter was meant to aid the movement of spaceships into landing depots, but a more appropriate use would be to bring baggage around, sort of like one of those baggage machines that you can see in the airport. The "fighter" class spaceships could be fitted with a small weapon as standard (a pulse laser), while limiting the cargo space to what would be necessary to hyperspace. The Shuttle and Lifter could be used by those who want to play it safe and earn a few credits before setting out to interstellar travel, while the "fighters" could be used to strike quickly, but actually be useful at attacking craft, as they were meant to originally. Anything under an Eagle Mk1 in size is currently useless.

 

[Cyborg]

Tradegoods....and more

Hi Folks,

In my opinion the trade goods should be more resources than goods…

On a "terra formed" world like the earth. It is possible to produce everything is needed.
Moon style Mining Colonies are needing Water, Fruits, Dry Food, Vegetable, Alcoholics, Clothes, House wares, Furniture, Computer, Electronics, Androids, Mining Supplies,.....
Spare parts…and Trash (You buy trash and pay for it and they buy it from you because of you didn’t lose it )
And they produce: Silizium, Steel, Gold, Copper, Silver, Aluminium,….(Kryptonite) lol…
Frontier Worlds needs: Terraforming Gas, Solar cells, and the whole remainder
In the Capital Systems and those which are similar, there are “Terra formed” Worlds and Mining Colonies together. Here governs the business and the Companies hire pilots to escort their Traders, or hire new Traders to keep running the business in their Colonies.(you can sign such a Contract?)
In War, Civil-War, Rebel, Anarchy or Dictatorship Systems weapons, explosives are needed too…
And you cannot buy or sell all of these everywhere (what they don’t need, they don’t buy and what they need, they don’t sell) and some goods are very rare.*

And you deal with a middleman, his job is, to take bred, sausage, jam, cheese, chocolate, noodles… in a package and put the “Dry Food” sticker on it. (The Kellogg’s question)

List of goods:
Water
Fruits
Dry Food
Vegetable
Alcoholic’s#
Clothes
Salt
Sugar
Spices
House wares
Furniture
Computer
Electronics
Androids#
Mining Supplies
Spare parts
Trash
Silizium
Metal Alloys
Steel
Gold
Copper
Silver
Krystal’s*
Aluminium
Terraforming Gas*
Solar cells*
Weapons*#
Explosives*#
Medical Goods
(Alien Artefacts)*# [Races dependently]
(Alien Life forms)*# [Races dependently]
Industrial Machines
Farming Supplies
Rare Woods*#
Plastics
Laboratory Supplies (needed in Research stations)*
Fuel
Military Goods*#
Military Fuel
Oil
Drugs*#
Luxury Goods*
Radio actives #

Some specials

………..

* = rare
# = sometimes Illegal



Greetz

 

[Kipper]

Basic supply and demand system as per real world economics... if a planet/base has plenty of something, they wont pay much for it. If they have nothing of it, and they need it, they will pay over the odds for it. Thus, the small fast ships can compete with the massive traders by getting the best prices for cargo in great demand.

Obviously bases that manufacture something, are likely to have a larger supply of it (provided they have the raw materials). All bases will need food, water, their waste products taken away (nice if you could go to a trash processing plant to turn that into something worthwhile), luxury items (but richer places will want more), etc.

Just like the system worked in X, only better and with more goods. The X trading system was the best thought out bit about it. I just didnt like the way you had to randomly zip between factories in the same vicinity. Boring.

 

[essezeta]

Hi to everyone!
I'm new here.
First, excuse my English!

I've played Frontier Elite II for the first time in the 1994 on A1200.
I've just fall in love with this game..

Now, I've got the chance to write some idea on Frontier official site!

Let's see.. dear Santa, my perfect Elite IV would be:

--- Space ---

- True space environment(procedural?): if you aim toward a star, you should be virtually able to fly to it without hyperdrive.

- Huge nebulas surrounding some systems or in deep space.
For huge i mean several light years wide (not the X spits..)

- Deep space bases: for example a research station inside a nebula.

- Asteroid tunnels: quite fun, aren'they?

- Planet rings: the best for me would be something like the ST Voyager tv show opening video: i love the reflection of the ship on the ring!

- black holes/space anomalies wich let you jump anywhere in the galaxy.

- Magnetic storm, solar flares, supernovae: they can cause equipment/engine failures or mis jumps.. it's a hard space, over there..

- Binary contact stars..

--- Planets ---

- Clouds, clouds and clouds!!!
Can you immagine the scenery? A ship is entering a Earth like planet atmosphere: the atmospheric shield is heating in the sunset sun, and below you can see black storm clouds wich lights up at every lightning. Now the ship enters the clouds and starts to rumble.. then it emerge below the clouds in a very bad thunderstorm that hides the spaceport lights...
Obviusly, each planet should have its own storm type (desert, snow..)

- I think that sea (or lake) rendering it's a must. But what about water change with weather conditions?

- A sun or a giant gas planet will rip in pieces your ship, if you are fuel scooping too close to it..

- I would like to see some weird planet like a volcanic world, or a destroyed planet for some natural reason (or Thargoid experiment?)


--- Equipment ---

- Military (or hacked) jump computer: you can set the exit coordinates of the hyperspace tunnel within the range of the hyperdrive.

- External lights: for night or asteroid navigation

- Multiple energy bomb storing

- Coil or rail guns

- Improbability drive?

- I would like to board a surrended ship and steal its cargo or the ship itself, and this mean that if i ask to an Interplanetary Shuttle to "surrender or die!" in my Panther Clipper it should not answer me "ha ha!"

--- Gameplay ---

-I agree with jumpgates only if they work in the game this way:
a sort of connection between distant key systems (for example a Gateway-Achenar route). The charge for the gate use should be twice the cost of hydrogen fuel needed to reach the destination system with conventional hyperdrive)

- Advertising of "treasure maps" on the BBS: most of them may be fake, some of them may be traps but some of them can lead you to lost secret ships or special equipment (and you need a jump computer)

- Rescue, escort, exploration missions?

- The 7 (more would be better) wonders of the universe?

- The player can use different vehicles on a planet (even moons): cars, bikes, trains and so on..

- In a system with "some prospecting and mining" and only two stars and no planets, i would like to find a little space station orbiting one of the suns

- If you call for help, someone will answer..

- Police can jam your hyperdrive if you have troubles with local laws

- If you pay the fine, the police must stop firing at you.

- If you don't have money, the police take your ship, but you can find a passage, or steal another ship..

- I would like to board a surrended ship and steal its cargo or the ship itself, and this mean that if i ask a Interplanetary Shuttle to "surrender or die!" in my Panther Clipper they should not answer me "ha ha!"

- People: it will be fantastic, but ihmo Elite is before all a space simulation game, so the flight model and the physics must be the priority in the game project.



Those were some ideas i've had during my waiting for Elite 4.
What do you think?

Bye!

 

[Kipper]

I like the idea of having amazing visuals such as planetary 'weather' systems and stuff... but if that were the case, please give us a bunch of external views with which to enjoy them, and a video recording facility so we can fly in the proper view and admire it later from the other views ... maybe even share videos

 

[Ulx]

What would be cool is to have your actions influence the economy or the political situation on planets. For example: if you ship a huge amount of weapons to a faction on a system in civil war, it could mean that it would tip te war in that faction's favour. The same for preventing shipments to arrive,

Being able to use a really, really, REALLY HUGE GUN in the BIGGEST SPACESHIP available to blow up a spacestation and thus devastating a planet's economy sounds appealing to me. Of course the consequenses would have to be in the program as well: No Schöne Blaue Donau for a while if you do something like that of course.

 

[caol]

Hi to everyone!
I'm new here.
First, excuse my English!

I've played Frontier Elite II for the first time in the 1994 on A1200.
I've just fall in love with this game..

Now, I've got the chance to write some idea on Frontier official site!

Let's see.. dear Santa, my perfect Elite IV would be:

--- Space ---

- True space environment(procedural?): if you aim toward a star, you should be virtually able to fly to it without hyperdrive.

- Huge nebulas surrounding some systems or in deep space.
For huge i mean several light years wide (not the X spits..)

- Deep space bases: for example a research station inside a nebula.

- Asteroid tunnels: quite fun, aren'they?

- Planet rings: the best for me would be something like the ST Voyager tv show opening video: i love the reflection of the ship on the ring!

- black holes/space anomalies wich let you jump anywhere in the galaxy.

- Magnetic storm, solar flares, supernovae: they can cause equipment/engine failures or mis jumps.. it's a hard space, over there..

- Binary contact stars..

--- Planets ---

- Clouds, clouds and clouds!!!
Can you immagine the scenery? A ship is entering a Earth like planet atmosphere: the atmospheric shield is heating in the sunset sun, and below you can see black storm clouds wich lights up at every lightning. Now the ship enters the clouds and starts to rumble.. then it emerge below the clouds in a very bad thunderstorm that hides the spaceport lights...
Obviusly, each planet should have its own storm type (desert, snow..)

- I think that sea (or lake) rendering it's a must. But what about water change with weather conditions?

- A sun or a giant gas planet will rip in pieces your ship, if you are fuel scooping too close to it..

- I would like to see some weird planet like a volcanic world, or a destroyed planet for some natural reason (or Thargoid experiment?)


--- Equipment ---

- Military (or hacked) jump computer: you can set the exit coordinates of the hyperspace tunnel within the range of the hyperdrive.

- External lights: for night or asteroid navigation

- Multiple energy bomb storing

- Coil or rail guns

- Improbability drive?

- I would like to board a surrended ship and steal its cargo or the ship itself, and this mean that if i ask to an Interplanetary Shuttle to "surrender or die!" in my Panther Clipper it should not answer me "ha ha!"

--- Gameplay ---

-I agree with jumpgates only if they work in the game this way:
a sort of connection between distant key systems (for example a Gateway-Achenar route). The charge for the gate use should be twice the cost of hydrogen fuel needed to reach the destination system with conventional hyperdrive)

- Advertising of "treasure maps" on the BBS: most of them may be fake, some of them may be traps but some of them can lead you to lost secret ships or special equipment (and you need a jump computer)

- Rescue, escort, exploration missions?

- The 7 (more would be better) wonders of the universe?

- The player can use different vehicles on a planet (even moons): cars, bikes, trains and so on..

- In a system with "some prospecting and mining" and only two stars and no planets, i would like to find a little space station orbiting one of the suns

- If you call for help, someone will answer..

- Police can jam your hyperdrive if you have troubles with local laws

- If you pay the fine, the police must stop firing at you.

- If you don't have money, the police take your ship, but you can find a passage, or steal another ship..

- I would like to board a surrended ship and steal its cargo or the ship itself, and this mean that if i ask a Interplanetary Shuttle to "surrender or die!" in my Panther Clipper they should not answer me "ha ha!"

- People: it will be fantastic, but ihmo Elite is before all a space simulation game, so the flight model and the physics must be the priority in the game project.



Those were some ideas i've had during my waiting for Elite 4.
What do you think?

Bye!

These are some of the best suggestions for Elite IV that I've yet seen on this forum! Nice one essezeta! I like the fact that a lot of your suggestions come directly from some of the frustrations of earlier Elite games. I can certainly relate to most if not all of those frustrations. Especially the lack of responses you got from other pilots etc (e.g. no-one anwers "broadcast message to all in range...", no-one answers calls for help, if you say "surrender or die" they ALWAYS just say "ha ha!".