Collection of Ideas for Elite 4

Sure they can. But aslo a big reason to drop coop. The problem with most SP games without Coop is. That the story is focused around one character. So if the main story is based on one vessel and its char. Coop is a big feature wich need a lot of adjust ment. Like something happed to the char. Cutscenes etc. having a side kick brakes this. It all must happen in a way to both or all coop players.
To solve this the story isn't about your one char or vessel. but your team or vessel group. This means your not alone. So you have teammate AI In singleplayer mode. Wingman Sister ships escort. The story happends to your team. Instead cutscene you play the story full. Or the Cutscene would happen to your team.
If you are a team the opposing forces are balance to meet and clash with a team.
Extend this to coop is less cumbersome. Not much fiddeling with opposing forces. No large rebalancing isues. And you can do the Full SP campain in Coop.

In FPS shooters its obvious. Ghost recon advance warfighter you go in with a squad. So coop is easy inplemented. Crysis cutscenes something specific happed to main char. MW2 dito cutscenes and special one char scenes. They somehow axe these oneman shows out of it. And put the rest in a Coop mission set.

In my opinion traveling space starting in a fighter make no sense. I don't travel for month on harley davidson or in a car. A camper truck would barley sufice for traveling for month sealed off. It's more like a submarine meets spaceshuttle.
For a few day travel a truck with a sleep cabine and a crew of two doing 2 shifts will do. 3 would be better. In harsh enviorment there would be more redundancy in systems but also crew. So travel alone in a space fighter?. Closest thing for short missions like a few day's would be like a space shuttle.

A fighter with a cargo bay to trade? make no sense.
A fighter as civilian? Because there would be no freebee in military carreer except R&R time. And you leave military hardware at the base.

Of course with nasa tech you won't get far beside orbit and the moon. Further would be a high risk and expensive exploring expedition effort for years. Like a trip to mars.
So for space trading. the tech must be way passed a era of kolonisation. And space drives who are at a techlevel where they are economical efficent and fast to be able to make trading feasable between kolonies. So you jump from science to deep into fiction.

And there you would have something like a firefly vessel. A small longrange low tech for that time multi purpouse cargo personel carrier space vessel. doing FTL. With a crew.

So there you are with your barginbin cargo space craft and a crew. And with that a option for Coop from the start. And the story begins.

Game can have different start. this would be the trading start.
A military carreer could to. You start as part of a group. The story would happen to the group. Minimal you are sent with a wingman. This means easy 2 player solution is posible. But the story could happen to your fighter group.
With bigger ship you both handle the same vessel like a corvette splitting the task over both players.

As a free roam game the focus on big and depth story could be slim. So this wingman or team based story is very plausable. If they go for deep high quality story and have a large need to focus on one char. Coop is axed realy fast.
 
It solves the problem of "lonely" play and also that of people who don't like to come into contact with the more moronic element within MMO player bases.

(...) without relying on MMO model with all it's undesirable parts and hefty limitations

If someone is interested in an opposing viewpoint by someone who actually played MMOGs, you may start reading here.
 
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My ideas are actually pinched from other space games, that could mean that other gamers more familiar with more recent space sims would be able to get into Elite 4.

First of all, have the option when you create a new character in single player or multi to enable newtonian physics, or arcade-style play (keeping the 2 groups on different servers in multi, naturally). This would enable people to dive straight in at the deep end if they liked, or go along a similar method to games such as Tachyon, X-Wing, Starlancer & such.

Next up would be the affiliation identifiers. Pinched directly from Freelancer's discovery mod, have a purchasable "tag", which clearly identifies the player's affiliation, Federation, Empire, Police, Bounty Hunter, Trader, Civilian, Pirate or even Thargoid :D ) Each player starts off as a civilian, and has to earn or purchase the affiliation ID in order to take those missions.

Finally, could a sort of "jump-gate" network in the core systems that players could use (for a fee, of course). Again, this would enable newer players to get to grips with the game easily enough. I'm thinking something along the lines of the "Tachyon catapult" thing that appears in Star Trek Voyager's season 5 (The episode where Seven of Nine overloads her brain & goes through loads of consipiracy theories)
 
First of all, have the option when you create a new character in single player or multi to enable newtonian physics, or arcade-style play (keeping the 2 groups on different servers in multi, naturally).

I somehow like this idea but wonder if it would be realistic to expect that for MP. Would mean a big split of the community.

I've played plenty, thanks. Some good, some bad. But i don't think it would be healthy for our beloved Elite.

There are two MMOGs out there that are "twitch"-based space sims like Elite, Jumpgate Classic and Vendetta Online. Did you play one of those?
 
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I somehowe like this idea but wonder if it would be realistic to expect that for MP. Would mean a big split of the community.

Jumpgate Evolution has a toggle which allows you to switch between newtonian physics and non-newtonian physics and I think it can work. By giving pros and cons to using each you can balance out the gameplay quite nicely.
 
There are two MMOGs out there that are "twitch"-based space sims like Elite, Jumpgate Classic and Vendetta Online. Did you play one of those?

No, but i fail to see how a MMO being "twitch"- based has any bearing on a comment which was in regards to the type of players that are commonly encountered in a MMO.
 
The reason I suggested 2 servers, for "arcade" and "Classic" players would be to prevent any problems between the 2 play setups. Naturally, it would be better if there was simply one server, but getting the 2 different playstyles working together may be tricky.
 
Jumpgate Evolution has a toggle which allows you to switch between newtonian physics and non-newtonian physics and I think it can work. By giving pros and cons to using each you can balance out the gameplay quite nicely.

I am not too fond of that. Probably the arcade mode will be an advantage most of the time and one is forced to use it in order to be competitive. In all JGE videos I have seen it is arcade steering in third-person view all the time and I was seriously deterred by that - two huge immersion killers for me.

No, but i fail to see how a MMO being "twitch"- based has any bearing on a comment which was in regards to the type of players that are commonly encountered in a MMO.

Different games attract different players, no matter if singleplayer games or MMOGs. A complex space sim with "twitch"-elements (instead of dice-rolling combat) requires a more serious approach, like practicing. Especially true with Newtonian physics.

I think the fanbase of the previous Elite games would prefer the serious stuff - the more challenge, the more fun on the long term - to a casual gamer's arcade shooter for lunch breaks.
 
Different games attract different players, no matter if singleplayer games or MMOGs. A complex space sim with "twitch"-elements (instead of dice-rolling combat) requires a more serious approach, like practicing. Especially true with Newtonian physics.

I don't think that neccesarily follows. "Twitch" is like FPS for MMO, and FPSs get an even worse bunch than MMOs. Not that MMO crowds are bad, just that you are not able to play without them if they turn out to be bad.
 
Next up would be the affiliation identifiers. Pinched directly from Freelancer's discovery mod, have a purchasable "tag", which clearly identifies the player's affiliation, Federation, Empire, Police, Bounty Hunter, Trader, Civilian, Pirate or even Thargoid :D ) Each player starts off as a civilian, and has to earn or purchase the affiliation ID in order to take those missions.

i kinda like that :D
 
"Twitch" is like FPS for MMO, and FPSs get an even worse bunch than MMOs.

I don't understand this sentence.

You seem to think that people who prefer MMOGs must for whatever reason tend to be "worse" than people who prefer singleplayer-games. So people who like an MMOG with "twitch"-elements like JGC tend to be bad, but people who like a singleplayer-game with "twitch"-elements like Elite tend to be good? The only difference that I can find plausible between those groups is that having intelligent live other than your own in the game is of different importance for them.
 
I don't understand this sentence.

You seem to think that people who prefer MMOGs must for whatever reason tend to be "worse" than people who prefer singleplayer-games.

Not at all. Just that in single player games (by definition) you are not forced to exist in the same world as other players, with all the potential for immersion breakage and crimes against spelling/grammar/e-slang that that entails.
 
Well cool ideas. Love most of them.

Cool would be:
Unlimit dark space (Think we will get that. So dark space, with nebulas only on there specific locations not everywhere and only eye candy things are suns, planets, asteroids and the real stuff. :D)
Landing on Planets
Walking around as Avatar (Would be cool, also the possibility to create your own Charakter with a good charakter editor. Something like this for space would be cool also. Then also some non Space Missions on a planet. But i heard often enough, that u should be a Charakter and not only a space ship in E4. And the Planets and Stations should be alife. Peoples who doing their jobs, animals running around on the planets. A option for playing as avatar without a ship, who have to do some jobs on a station/planet to earn some money to get the first ship would be sweet.)
A good trading system would be cool aswell, a system with fabrices would be awsome.
The multiplayer mode sounds also cool. Up to a dozen Players would be cool already on a local server. Up to 64 would be far better, but sounds a bit difficult by simulating the whole game in multiplayer.

The old cargo and fitting system is something i don't really like in the old elite games. A new system i like was already mentioned. I personally would seperate the ship in different sections like weapon-, engine- or auxiliary room, cannons mounted in the gun carriages and some kind of weapon generator in the weapon room as example. The auxiliary room could carry depending on ship size 1 or few auxillery generators, who boost the normal generators, u can also update to different sizes.
The combat system was also something i don't really liked by the games. Don't think there should be a one shoot weapon ans also smaller ships should have a tiny chance against huge ships. so no 100-150 shieldgenerator ships, who could be killed by 1 shoot from a huge other cruiser and take the fire of some dozen fighters, without any problems. Then also more like MKI - MKX shieldgenerators who fit in different ships.

Well and something what is also very important, i think who has mentioned aswell are editors. A Bethesda Style Editor would be sweetest. Some peoples could see it as cheating with such and huge tool, but the Bethesda games are seaking for themselfs. Don't think they would have been sold so often, without the editor.

ahhh ! i want a personal pet !! so..
Or the possibility to pet some crewmember. :D
 
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"Twitch" is like FPS for MMO, and FPSs get an even worse bunch than MMOs.

I said I didn't understand this sentence beyond the fact that you obviously wanted to say something against MMOG-players. You answered by referring to immersion and spelling/grammar/e-slang in MMOGs. I thought there is a connection to that previous complaint then, but now you say this is a misunderstanding.

So I have to try again: MMOGs have a bad bunch, "twitch"-games have a bad bunch, FPS-games have an even worse bunch. (Wait a minute. Don't all Elite games have "twitch"-elements and first-person view?) So an MMOG with "twitch"-elements and first-person view must have an incredibly bad bunch, is that your message?

By the way, language competence varies everywhere. MMOGs are just a mirror of reality in that respect, so you find people who are well spoken there as well. I always found it easy to ignore the occasional not so important twaddle in the chat bar. For me the stupidity and predictability of AI in singleplayer games is a much bigger immersion killer.
 
I must admit, since starting Star Trek Online (my first entry into MMOs), I do prefer flying around with real people - especially when someone flies over to help me. It's great. But the chat bar is littered with crap or "buy gold here" with some link to a probable virus. That does ruin it - so I turn the chat bar off (which unfortunately means I may miss a legitimate message).

But yep - the worse offender is multiplayer on Call of Duty (Xbox360 version I play). I mute pretty much everyone (who isn't a friend) straight away now.
 
Yea, the chat system in Star Trek Online is crap like hell. But Eve Online as example shows a way to make it far better by seperating the chat in many clear channels. And the chat is important, also for a game with mp mode with only some dozen players.
 
So I have to try again: MMOGs have a bad bunch, "twitch"-games have a bad bunch, FPS-games have an even worse bunch.

No, actually i like MMOs. Just that you didn't understand (now there's a turn up for the books!) another member's comment about why they don't want E4 to be an MMO. So i was trying to help explain it to you. I have since realised that I have more chance of single-handedly bringing about world peace that explaining anything to you though, so i give up!



Multiplayer FPSs tend to attract the "headshot!!!" type gamer, in my experience.
 
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