Isnt it somehow lame that Multicannons are so much better than Railguns and Cannons?

[ChubbyBunneh]

Used a Python with 3 rail guns all weekend at Igorodimos. Nothing like blowing up those juicy Anacondas' power plants in 2 salvos with 60% of their hull remaining.

True there is no gimbaled version, so you need to know how to aim to get the most out of them.

If they upped the ammo count I wouldn't complain but 31 shots is plenty for an hour's worth of fighting if you save them for big threats.

 

[Ancipital]

"Hey, isn't that a General Electrics..." etc. etc.

 

[Quineloe]

Cannons and Railguns are meant to be able to deal more damage against larger ships than the ship you're firing from than a same sized multicannon would. If you're attacking smaller or same sized ships then multicannons may do better because of the amount of damage you can still do when missing a few shots where cannons and railguns are punishing if you miss.

So Class 4 Cannon on Anaconda is meant to be used against what ship?

 

[Derath]

I can't believe how many times some of these discussions go round its a frontload or alpha strike issue it goes like this

Alpha/Frontload = Railgun > Cannon > Multicannon

Dps (Sustained) = Multicannon > Cannon > Railgun

Occasionally cannons will outperform railguns and vice versa, to be completely honest i wouldn't classify railguns in the same category anyway as instant hit is too important for balance purposes.

Again if lets say you are flying an asp vs a viper, you have 0.5s for a shot, which does best?

Cannon > Multi > Rail

you have 2s for a shot which does best?

Rail > Multi=Cannon

you have 20s for a shot

(clone of the dps series above)

Edit: TLDR = breakdown weapon stats to usage scenarios before claiming one wep is flat better than another.

 

[Lupin]

Reading all the reply's to the topic, where does range come into this MC vs Cannon or Rail Gun?

These are from a topic on dealing with large ships and seem to tell a different story:

 

[ChubbyBunneh]

So Class 4 Cannon on Anaconda is meant to be used against what ship?

Federal Corvette?

 

[Distance]

Reading all the reply's to the topic, where does range come into this MC vs Cannon or Rail Gun?

These are from a topic on dealing with large ships and seem to tell a different story:

Spoiler

View attachment 16746View attachment 16747View attachment 16748

Great to see some stats.

The only problems with these are :

Missiles have been changed against shields.

Most people are talking more about hull damage than shield damage. I'd like to see some stats on hull damage with rail/cannon/mc.

 

[Drakkir]

I just think we should be able to buy ammo "by the ton" and keep in our cargo bays. Have a seperate keybind to "Reload weapons" from Cargo bay. To engage that ammo to the guns. So we can stay at RES/NAV sites longer.

 

[Lazerus Artificial]

All the post about the pure damage alone and alpha strikes...
Thats fine, thats ok
still, there is no real downside to Muticannons, or not a real advantage for Cannons and Rails.
The first hit may deal more damage in a shorter time, sure, but how often can you kill a target with just one hit?
So, sustained dps would be better then, sustained dps that costs almost no credits is even better than alpha strikes who make you poor.

so again the question: would you use a Railgun for PVE?

 

[Mr_Blastman]

Railguns need more ammo... a LOT more ammo. They're exceptionally cost ineffective to run.

The most perplexing thing for rails is damage falloff. There should be zero damage falloff. There's no friction and if there were, their trajectory would be altered, thus, rails should do maximum damage at maximum range in space.

 

[ViciousMink]

There aren't even large or huge Multicannons

... I'm suddenly picturing an Anaconda kitted out like an A-10 Warthog....

And it would be awesome.

 

[bassman]

I didn't try Rails, as I'm running gimballed weapons because otherwise it can be hard to get on target vs. a Viper or Eagle.

With its excellent thermal and power headroom the asp is a great rail platform IMO, never had trouble getting line of sight on smaller ships even using D grade thrusters.

 

[Surround]

I wish that I could make railgun and heatseeking missiles combo agaisnt pve. But you can probably kill 1 Cobra when youre already out of missiles.

The game feels that there isnt really point using anything else than MC or beam. Unless youre going after conda.

All i wish that cannon projictle would be faster. Railgun had 40 ammo. Class 1 heatseeking would have triple the ammo. Torpedos would be visually bigger and putted under the wings.
Really! The torpedos look so lame!

But actually i wish there were more different weapons. Why there isnt small overcharged plasma weapon that would shoot more and faster projectiles? Visually i think one of the coolest weapons shooting is point defence turret. But i have only seen them used only in videos.

One thing what elite is lacking are cool looking battle visuals. All you can see in combat are MC and lasers. Only way to see the missiles are that white target reticles. And why cannon fire looks excatly like dumbfire missiles.

Gah, I like this game so much that I want it to be better

 

[Tigga]

The most perplexing thing for rails is damage falloff. There should be zero damage falloff. There's no friction and if there were, their trajectory would be altered, thus, rails should do maximum damage at maximum range in space.

There's friction, otherwise I would be able to go faster than 450m/s.

Why would their trajectory be altered? Why would you get damage falloff on other projectiles if you didn't on rails?

 

[bassman]

The most perplexing thing for rails is damage falloff. There should be zero damage falloff. There's no friction and if there were, their trajectory would be altered, thus, rails should do maximum damage at maximum range in space.

So should every weapon though by that logic but its an artificial game balancing mechanic that applies to everything. Having said that it would be more interesting if different weapons had different range modifiers.

 

[Lyandritz]

For me the problem is simply the ammo cost.
That's an easier way to fix things than a nerf or a boost which often lead into a drama on forum.

There is a difference of use of the weapons;
A price to buy;
A power requirement.

The large difference of the ammo cost isn't really necessary.

All cannons should have nearly the same ammo cost.
All missiles should too.

 

[Lazerus Artificial]

For me the problem is simply the ammo cost.
That's an easier way to fix things than a nerf or a boost which often lead into a drama on forum.

There is a difference of use of the weapons;
A price to buy;
A power requirement.

The large difference of the ammo cost isn't really necessary.

All cannons should have nearly the same ammo cost.
All missiles should too.

thats what i was talking about^^
as i said in my first post: a railgun does not even need a fancy shell made of rare metals...^^

 

[Mr_Blastman]

There's friction, otherwise I would be able to go faster than 450m/s.

Why would their trajectory be altered? Why would you get damage falloff on other projectiles if you didn't on rails?

None of the projectiles should have damage falloff at range. I was just singling out railguns specifically.

Per Newton's first law:

An object at rest stays at rest and an object in motion stays in motion with the same speed and in the same direction unless acted upon by an unbalanced force.

Their trajectory would be altered because if they were to impact an object or particle in space, per newtonian physics their vector state would change depending on the angle of incidence they contacted the foreign object at relative to its stationary mass and their forward momentum.

Lasers will have a damage falloff due to beam divergence. It is really really hard to make a laser have zero divergence. To do so would require great amounts of power and generate a large amount of heat focusing in the weapon. Read up on the inverse square law and you'll start to get the idea.


As for the 450 m/s speed limit, think of that as a governor cap on your engine preventing you from going faster while at the same time having the demon spawn outer-dimensional child of Newton flogging your spacecraft from a higher dimension on the outside preventing it from exceeding this speed even in flight assist off mode.

I know, I know, ED doesn't follow the laws of physics but at times the gigantic nerd inside of me wants to jump out and shout out loud.

 

[CloneWarrior85]

Cannons are without doubt the most glaring weapon imbalance in the game right now (IMO). As I said I would massively increase the projectile speed (damage is OK as it is I think). There just no reason to use them since dumbfires are almost as easy to aim and do much more damage. They were OP in beta 1 but they had a quad nerf - shield damage, speed, ammo amount, ammo cost. The speed nerf was not needed.

Well...cannon are nerfed cuz kids cried too much about cannon vipers.

Next nerf is on the multicannons.

As many said, in the end all you'll have to fight is the mining lasers.

 

[Lyandritz]

thats what i was talking about^^
as i said in my first post: a railgun does not even need a fancy shell made of rare metals...^^

Yea the Railguns need also a lower price on the ammo.
Ammo cost is the main reason why i avoid to use these weapons.

It's not about efficiency, they all have a different use and require a particular ability of the player skill.
That's why Multi-Cannons is, at this moment, the best for efficiency/ammo cost.