The Majestic class interdictor Imperial capital ship is weak

[lordg]

With the current community goal i tried to stay close to the Capital ship to help with the vipers and cobras (they are small and annoying to shoot) while i can handle the Anaconda/python ships, but its completely powerless. During that 2 hours i was there i dont think it actually killed anything. Maybe some novice eagles, but seriously it continously missed the targets and couldnt even get their shields down. Got bored and went back to the capital-less high intensity instead.

Maybe FD nerfed them so they cant help players with the kills.

 

[Poy]

Poor choice of words on my part -- I suppose I meant I've seen the same sort of 'call for change' on these forums over and over.

For example, the OP didn't notice that the guy more or less flew quite well, and hit with precision -- he didn't just fly at it like a dart at a bullseye, shooting uncontrollably. Yet the OP expects him to die all the same because 'his ship isn't big'.

What ? Excuse me ? I don't remember giving you permission to speak for me, especially on things that I didn't say.


An Anaconda shouldn't last more than 2 minutes within 1 km of the capital ship, so a Viper shouldn't last 30sec

And NO, the Viper shouldn't be bewst fighter, it's 140K for the base, it shouldn't be able to take Elite Anacondas without some serious skill and damage, so I don't see why it should be able to take down A ' CAPITAL SHIP ARMED WITH HUGE RAILGUN TURRETS !

And if you call that flying well, I'm sorry but that's rubbish compared to what this ship can do, he's slowly turning and often stops, this is not good flying as far as I'm concerned, and anything with half a good aim (let's say, for exemple, 3300 targeting computers) should have been able to swat it down with ease !


I've seen an imperial fighter take 6 SHOTS from those railguns before being destroyed !
Do you realise how easy to kill those things are...


I am sick (actually I am but that's not the point) and tired of Viper fanboys who keep saying that it needs a buff or other nonsense like that, the Viper is 140K for the base ship, it should be as weak as its price tag, and it's already not, so stop making excuses to justify this kind of [REDACTED]

 

[EAGLE 5]

If I recall correctly it only two proton torpedoes to destroy the Death Star.

Just sayin'

 

[Khan]

If I recall correctly it only two proton torpedoes to destroy the Death Star.

Just sayin'

If I recall correctly, the same man that wrote that scene did Episode 1-3 as well.
We know how that turned out no?

 

[kilted]

What ? Excuse me ? I don't remember giving you permission to speak for me, especially on things that I didn't say.


An Anaconda shouldn't last more than 2 minutes within 1 km of the capital ship, so a Viper shouldn't last 30sec

And NO, the Viper shouldn't be bewst fighter, it's 140K for the base, it shouldn't be able to take Elite Anacondas without some serious skill and damage, so I don't see why it should be able to take down A ' CAPITAL SHIP ARMED WITH HUGE RAILGUN TURRETS !

And if you call that flying well, I'm sorry but that's rubbish compared to what this ship can do, he's slowly turning and often stops, this is not good flying as far as I'm concerned, and anything with half a good aim (let's say, for exemple, 3300 targeting computers) should have been able to swat it down with ease !


I've seen an imperial fighter take 6 SHOTS from those railguns before being destroyed !
Do you realise how easy to kill those things are...


I am sick (actually I am but that's not the point) and tired of Viper fanboys who keep saying that it needs a buff or other nonsense like that, the Viper is 140K for the base ship, it should be as weak as its price tag, and it's already not, so stop making excuses to justify this kind of [REDACTED]

Remind me again what makes you qualified to determine how long a ship should last vs another ship? The advantage of the bigger ship is that it can carry bigger guns. The smaller ship is more versatile. I for one am not surprised that one can last longer than you think.

I'm not a Viper fanboy, but it is a good fighter. I also wouldnt go fighting in a T9 - but thats the biggest ship, right? According to your logic, it should be the best?

kthxbye.

 

[Lustan]

If anything - this Viper should see "Eject Eject" within 30 Seconds after receiving 2-3 direct hits...

Looks just like some mini-game to the tune of "Rebel Assault" (Interactive Movie) to satisfy the needs of casual Console players.

OMG nailed it. Rebel Assault was the worst "on-rails" game ever made.

 

[Surly_Badger]

Apparently designed by the same guys who designed HMS Hood and USS Maine.

So what?

An Anaconda shouldn't last more than 2 minutes within 1 km of the capital ship, so a Viper shouldn't last 30sec

That's kind of like saying "an airplane shouldn't last more than 2 minutes within 1km of an aircraft carrier" There are a lot of WWII pilots on both sides, and some Argentinian pilots in the Falklands, as well as a bunch of arabs in speedboats full of explosives who would disagree with that.

To actually make a sensible comment about what should and shouldn't happen in war ... is difficult. In a full-up fight, the ability of a capital ship to defend itself is going to depend more on its command/control and fire discipline than anything else. Nowadays a lot of that is robotic but even robots make mistakes.

If your presumption is that the close-in weapons systems of a capital ship are too accurate to evade, then the same would apply to small ship to small ship combat - a turret on an anaconda ought to clear the skies (more or less like a US Phalanx CIWS would do) it's just a matter of money. But that wouldn't make for very interesting gameplay, would it? (Edit: the HMS Sheffield had the Brit equivalent of a Phalanx CIWS and apparently it didn't stop Exocet missiles so well. These things always look more reliable on paper)

Advocating for increased realism in space war inevitably results in a scenario like Joe Haldeman's "Forever War" of CJ Cherryh's "Downbelow Station" world -- You program your ship with what it's supposed to do, jump into a system, the computers fight and in 1/1000 of a second you're either an expanding cloud of dust or you've won a great victory. Woohoo! Great gameplay that would be!!

I'm not saying you're wrong. I'm saying your pronouncement is ignorant. It's not quite the same thing.

 

[Sim Maker]

From Wiki:
.
During World War II, about 3,860 kamikaze pilots were killed, and about 19% of kamikaze attacks managed to hit a ship........
.
So, fighters, with no other intention than crashing in to a ship.......failed to even contact a ship 8 out of 10 times...........so much AA was in the air.............Attacking a battle ship or other should be HAAAAAARD!!!!..........How many went out to the Death Star.....how many came back, 3?...........

 

[Khan]

Remind me again what makes you qualified to determine how long a ship should last vs another ship? The advantage of the bigger ship is that it can carry bigger guns. The smaller ship is more versatile. I for one am not surprised that one can last longer than you think.

I'm not a Viper fanboy, but it is a good fighter. I also wouldnt go fighting in a T9 - but thats the biggest ship, right? According to your logic, it should be the best?

kthxbye.

Kek.

So according to you, a Viper should be able to sit and relax in front of these "Large guns" you spoke of, and not have to fear damage, because its a versatile fighter?

Get off it man.

Its a trash tier craft thats outclassed by everything past it.

For the record, in the example you provided, the word you where looking for was "Anaconda" and its, ironically enough get this, the best ship in the game both statistically and in practice. Who would have knew?

 

[Loskene]

The problem is the capital ships have no support craft besides their fighter wings. Where are the destroyers, frigates, tenders, etc. that sustain an aircraft carrier through long duration combat missions. I wouldn't expect any spaceship, even something that big, to be able to put up with a solid week of fighting by itself. Can it constantly manufacture new fighters and pilots when theirs get destroyed? Does it have to warp away to a friendly starport to resupply every few hours?
And how come they just sit in one place instead of circling the battlefield attacking high priority targets? I understand it's a necessary thing for the fighter launch (and presumably retrieval, although I've never seen it happen) code to work, but you can just make it stop when it's doing that.
There's just too much about capital ships that don't make sense right now, not for lack of thought, but lack of completion. Unfortunately it's not as high on the priority list as all of the other major features that need more development time to flesh them out. This is why I hated the early release, all of the big fish are meant to be taken care of by version 1.0 so we can focus our attention on issues like this without having to put them on the backburner for who knows how long.

 

[Poy]

Remind me again what makes you qualified to determine how long a ship should last vs another ship? The advantage of the bigger ship is that it can carry bigger guns. The smaller ship is more versatile. I for one am not surprised that one can last longer than you think.

I'm not a Viper fanboy, but it is a good fighter. I also wouldnt go fighting in a T9 - but thats the biggest ship, right? According to your logic, it should be the best?

kthxbye.

What makes me qualified to determine how long a ship should last vs another ship ?
Oh I don't know, common sense...

But also its price tag and its type.
Viper is a 140k "light" fighter, T9 is a 60 M (?) heavy freighter..., that's a stupid comparison between two completely different ships... You can't compare an assault speedboat and a tanker, these are just two different things

I don't care how agile your ship is, if you get hit by a railgun this size, you should say goodbye to atleast your shields, as seen in the video, they barely dent it, and he had only one pip in his shields
Again I didn't say "biggest = better", for exemple, a Python is smaller than a Clipper but can kick its butt because its price and outfitting capability are better than the Clipper
"kthxbye" <- this say a lot of things about you, and none of them are good...


Can you provide ANY exemple of a speedboat that can take more of a beating than a Battleship ?
Sure a torpedo boat could sink a battleship, after reloading several time and if the battleship did not return fire, said fire having more range than the torpedoes...

 

[kilted]

Kek.

So according to you, a Viper should be able to sit and relax in front of these "Large guns" you spoke of, and not have to fear damage, because its a versatile fighter?

Get off it man.

Its a trash tier craft thats outclassed by everything past it.

For the record, in the example you provided, the word you where looking for was "Anaconda" and its, ironically enough get this, the best ship in the game both statistically and in practice. Who would have knew?

Explain to me then why Anaconda's are just 'tricky' to take down in a viper, but nonetheless certainly doable. I know this, I have taken many Anacondas in a Viper.

I think your logic is flawed. Bigger does not equal Better. Bigger = Bigger. The Viper's are very flexible, and can sit behind bigger ships and lay them to waste. Maybe the reason the Capital ship got taken down so easily was that it was using your logic and prioritizing the Anacondas for its weapons, not the small fighter that swings around it with ease.

 

[Poy]

Explain to me then why Anaconda's are just 'tricky' to take down in a viper, but nonetheless certainly doable. I know this, I have taken many Anacondas in a Viper.

I think your logic is flawed. Bigger does not equal Better. Bigger = Bigger. The Viper's are very flexible, and can sit behind bigger ships and lay them to waste. Maybe the reason the Capital ship got taken down so easily was that it was using your logic and prioritizing the Anacondas for its weapons, not the small fighter that swings around it with ease.

It fired several shots on the Viper, none of them did anything noticeable...

 

[Defacto]

Explain to me then why Anaconda's are just 'tricky' to take down in a viper, but nonetheless certainly doable. I know this, I have taken many Anacondas in a Viper.

I think your logic is flawed. Bigger does not equal Better. Bigger = Bigger. The Viper's are very flexible, and can sit behind bigger ships and lay them to waste. Maybe the reason the Capital ship got taken down so easily was that it was using your logic and prioritizing the Anacondas for its weapons, not the small fighter that swings around it with ease.

It was taken down so easily because it has less firepower than a Cobra III.

 

[Khan]

Explain to me then why Anaconda's are just 'tricky' to take down in a viper, but nonetheless certainly doable. I know this, I have taken many Anacondas in a Viper.

I think your logic is flawed. Bigger does not equal Better. Bigger = Bigger. The Viper's are very flexible, and can sit behind bigger ships and lay them to waste. Maybe the reason the Capital ship got taken down so easily was that it was using your logic and prioritizing the Anacondas for its weapons, not the small fighter that swings around it with ease.

I believe your logic is flawed for bringing NPCs to the discussion.

They have a hard time hitting a stationary target. The AI for the Condas just flop around uselessly once you get behind them.

Seriously, do you really think the AI is able to prioritize the highest threat around it? It cant, funny enough. Its unable to stay on one single target without constantly swapping and disengaging even when you are alone with it , let alone target the highest threat and prioritize it.

However, this does not matter, as the demonstration was that the amount of damage to route the Interdictor, and the power of its guns, are weaker than William Shatner's ability to sing. This can be considered humorous, when considering Frontier buffing the Farragut recently. As I stated previously, looks like they forgot to buff the Interdictor as well.

 

[kellakind]

idea ....

i sit in a assault boat behind a battleship and fire at the . imagine nothing really bad would happen to me and the will run or blow up.
its the year 3301. it should be possible. doesnt it?

/irony off

 

[kilted]

I'm not saying that the ship is not underpowered or whatever, or that its target prioritization is good. I am simply pointing out that the smaller more agile fighters are more advantageous than simply 'bigger', and that the 'bigger is better' maxim is horribly flawed when it pertains to this game.

Also, the NPC argument is more relevant than you are making it out to be, since their flying skill is directly related to the combat rating. Similarly, putting an inexperienced human into an Anaconda does not magically make the human a better pilot. It still takes degrees of skill to manage the environment, and that comes most typically with experience.

 

[jp josh]

they need to fix the cap ship so it hits the target first.... then we can see if they need buffed or nerfed...

i say buff to the point where if you get hit with more than one shot your ship will explode if your in a viper that is fully upgraded.

to take on cap ships you should at least need 10 fighters.....

 

[kilted]

What makes me qualified to determine how long a ship should last vs another ship ?
Oh I don't know, common sense...

But also its price tag and its type.
Viper is a 140k "light" fighter, T9 is a 60 M (?) heavy freighter..., that's a stupid comparison between two completely different ships... You can't compare an assault speedboat and a tanker, these are just two different things

I don't care how agile your ship is, if you get hit by a railgun this size, you should say goodbye to atleast your shields, as seen in the video, they barely dent it, and he had only one pip in his shields
Again I didn't say "biggest = better", for exemple, a Python is smaller than a Clipper but can kick its butt because its price and outfitting capability are better than the Clipper
"kthxbye" <- this say a lot of things about you, and none of them are good...


Can you provide ANY exemple of a speedboat that can take more of a beating than a Battleship ?
Sure a torpedo boat could sink a battleship, after reloading several time and if the battleship did not return fire, said fire having more range than the torpedoes...

So, you are saying a Viper is the equivalent of a speed boat, and the Capital ship is the equivalent of a battleship here? I disagree with your parallel. And you are right about the torpedo. It only takes one to sink a ship of any size, simply by hitting it in the right place. Just because the Capital ship has bigger guns doesn't mean that its manouverable (spelling?) enough to be able to hit the Viper. Think of a fly. You can swat at it all you like, but most often you will miss.

I would agree that the hits this Viper took should have done more damage than they did - provided the shots were coming from substantial weapons.

As for "kthxbye", you are taking it all wrong. It doesn't say anything about me at all.

I think its unreasonable to be so dismissive of the agility. I also think that the Capital ship needs to be fixed at least a little. Also, price tag has nothing do with it. Back in the day (the 80s), a Mini Cooper could beat a Ferrari from standstill to 40 or so. Price tag was significantly different for both cars.

Your common sense is flawed for this argument. You think you are applying reasonable logic, but in the combat realm it isn't the same, especially when you are applying a scale of this size. I think a better way to look at it would be as a small fighter jet taking on a B52 bomber - the bomber's weapons are bigger, but the jet is far more agile and a difficult target to hit.

 

[Quineloe]

same as 12 lowly dive bombers sank 3 aircraft carriers at battle of midway poo poo happens and if it can happen it will happen at the inopertune moment ( sods law)

Just like your Graf Spee reference, this is equally oversimplifying history and flat out wrong.



The problem with copitol shops right now is that they only carry roughly twice the firepower of an Anaconda, yet they're a hundred times as big. That is seriously inefficient.