You could keep logging out and in again and hope that eventually you would not be instanced with any of the blockaders, and/or you could run a lot of other downloads on your connection to try to force the instancing to put you alone. However if you have a good internet connection, no router issues, and you are not doing that, chances are that you would end up being instanced with at least some of them.
Anyway your point does raise an issue that's also been discussed on this thread, which is that if there was an inherent scoring advantage just from being in open mode, anybody with a dodgy internet connection, or who tweaks their router to interfere with the instancing code, would then be at an advantage. That's why if they did go down this route, it would probably have to be based on something that really shows you were with other players, like wing bonuses, or additional rewards for killing players versus NPC, for example, the later of which will cause a right old ruckus.
The thing is you don't need to logout - once you get into SC you can always throttle back drop out - or in an emergency drop at speed taking damage and a longer cool down - you can then scoot off or re-enter and drop again before anyone gets near you.
There is no need to logout to try to make your own instance.
I've had this idea floating through my head for quite a while... Might be it fits here best :
Since there's various areas of Gameplay where running Solo does offer far less risk (more predictable and much easier, simply due to the complete lack of chaos one can witness in busy Open Play Systems) - but Solo Players still kinda connect to the very same Servers and background Galaxy for the entire time...
Wouldn't it be an interesting idea to :
- take coarse snapshots of System conditions (traffic, crime etc.) of Open Play and emulate those Situations to some extent with NPCs in Solo play ?
So basically what I would expect from such a "loose, soft mirroring" of Open Play System conditions into Solo :
Systems rampant with Crime/Action/Combat in Open become at least a bit similar in Solo.
Same with i.e. Community Goal Systems full of combat action/blockades etc. That way, Solo Players would encounter at least a somewhat increased challenge while working for the identical rewards (normally under very low-risk conditions and a very high degree of pure predictability).
That would require one major change to the existing Solo System generation (Initial Spawn of a new Instance).
As opposed to jumping into any instance and see everything spawn from scratch - the Solo Player would now jump into a busy System of NPCs doing their thing instead.
And what Spawn-Scenarios would be running (incl. risk levels, number of Interdictors, number of Wings etc.) depending roughly on what was going on in that very System during i.e. the last 6-24hrs in Open Play.
If the Devs were able to at least generally emulate something of the Open Play action into the NPC-populated Solo world - I think that would spice things up quite a bit and add the needed variation (that IMHO Solo play simply lacks right now).
And the way around - Players creating their own Instance while on Open Play would also see a similar scenario, even with no other Player except them in there.
That would remove the very obvious "looks like I'm alone here" moment whenever you jump into another System in your own Instance.
So in turn, it would make Open Play as well somewhat more interesting - as only a look at i.e. the Network Bandwidth would reveal if you're truly alone or not.
I'd appreciate something like that. And I don't think it would require too much work by the Devs to make something like that happen.
Wouldn't it be an interesting idea to :
- take coarse snapshots of System conditions (traffic, crime etc.) of Open Play and emulate those Situations to some extent with NPCs in Solo play ?
I'd like this too - I read it somewhere around the forums and expressed it as an existing idea that might go some way to improving the comparative risks between open and solo when I posted in the Vox Populi thread.
It all depends how instances are generated. Are they server side? (doubtful on that!) Then it might be possible.
A better idea would be removing the hollow and make CMDRs work for their supper instead of making it easy for them in Open to spot rich pickings. Poor CMDRs in Solo have no choice but to turn away perfectly good canisters of bio-waste. Never going to happen though.
How about having the security status of the system depend on activity taking place in the system, whether it be Solo CMDRs hunting down Trader NPCs or Open CMDRs being idiots with other CMDRs. As the security decreases more NPCs on both sides of the divide join the fun.
I've had this idea floating through my head for quite a while... Might be it fits here best :
Since there's various areas of Gameplay where running Solo does offer far less risk (more predictable and much easier, simply due to the complete lack of chaos one can witness in busy Open Play Systems) - but Solo Players still kinda connect to the very same Servers and background Galaxy for the entire time...
Wouldn't it be an interesting idea to :
- take coarse snapshots of System conditions (traffic, crime etc.) of Open Play and emulate those Situations to some extent with NPCs in Solo play ?
So basically what I would expect from such a "loose, soft mirroring" of Open Play System conditions into Solo :
Systems rampant with Crime/Action/Combat in Open become at least a bit similar in Solo.
Same with i.e. Community Goal Systems full of combat action/blockades etc. That way, Solo Players would encounter at least a somewhat increased challenge while working for the identical rewards (normally under very low-risk conditions and a very high degree of pure predictability).
That would require one major change to the existing Solo System generation (Initial Spawn of a new Instance).
As opposed to jumping into any instance and see everything spawn from scratch - the Solo Player would now jump into a busy System of NPCs doing their thing instead.
And what Spawn-Scenarios would be running (incl. risk levels, number of Interdictors, number of Wings etc.) would depend roughly on what was going on in that very System during i.e. the last 6-24hrs in Open Play.
If the Devs were able to at least generally emulate something of the Open Play action into the NPC-populated Solo world - I think that would spice things up quite a bit and add the needed variation (that IMHO Solo play simply lacks right now).
And the way around - Players creating their own Instance while on Open Play would also see a similar scenario, even with no other Player except them in there.
That would remove the very obvious "looks like I'm alone here" moment whenever you jump into another System in your own Instance.
So in turn, it would make Open Play as well somewhat more interesting - as only a look at i.e. the Network Bandwidth would reveal if you're truly alone or not.
I'd appreciate something like that. And I don't think it would require too much work by the Devs to make something like that happen.
This is quite a good idea in principle. However I'm not sure about your very last comment. I think only the devs know how much work it would be to achieve that, but I doubt that it would be easy.
This is quite a good idea in principle. However I'm not sure about your very last comment. I think only the devs know how much work it would be to achieve that, but I doubt that it would be easy.
Don't know how much trouble it would be to poll a small number of very basic statistics off Open Play systems inside civilization.
Crime and total Traffic stats would be all that's needed IMHO - with Traffic already being tracked. The rest could be randomly scriped with all needed freedom of flexibility.
Systems running below a certain threshold would likely remain basically unchanged.
IMHO the key part would be to modify the spawn script when an Instance is initialized (Player jumps in).
Then, all it would take would be to generate a certain number of starting sets with appropriate parameters to generate somewhat similar conditions.
A bit like a USS-type scenario - only bigger as it's the whole System in SuperCruise and with a higher random component to it. All tailored to what roughly occured recently in that System in Open Play.
If the Station instances get the same (basically fast-forwarding the event scripts anything between 30sec and 2min), it'd all look much more alive and authentic.
Don't know how much trouble it would be to poll a small number of very basic statistics off Open Play systems inside civilization.
Crime and total Traffic stats would be all that's needed IMHO - with Traffic already being tracked.
Systems running below a certain threshold would likely remain basically unchanged.
IMHO the key part would be to modify the spawn script when an Instance is initialized (Player jumps in).
Then, all it would take would be to generate a certain number of starting sets with appropriate parameters to generate somewhat similar conditions.
A bit like a USS-type scenario - only bigger as it's the whole System in SuperCruise and with a higher random component to it. All tailored to what roughly occured recently in that System in Open Play.
It could be simpler than that - the stats could be pulled from open for the same location as the player in solo / private group and used to influence the NPC population, roles and combat ratings.
In this way, systems that are empty of players in open would remain unmodified in solo.
Offline single-player mode was also a standard feature of the game... until it wasn't. Things can and should change when they're pointed out to be flawed or damaging to the game's integrity or mechanics, as FD seems to believe the current structure with CGs are. Rather than focusing specifically on CGs, they should be looking at the bigger picture. The problem with CGs is a symptom of the larger disease that stems from using a character save and multiplayer structure that allows people to avoid risk in a game where part of the draw is that it is risky.
Aww for cryan out loud. Mode switching is here to stay! Just because some of us feel a little balancing might be in order for open in regards to CG's, doesn't mean we want the mode switching to go away!! Mode switch keeps the game balanced! It's a balancing feature to ensure every player has the chance to enjoy themselves, get it? Remove it and a storm will ensure.
Mode switching isn't a mistake, or a bad design, it is the intended design.
You mean, like anyone can do in WoW, permanently (until done again) by paying $25, and temporarily (but for free) by just grouping with another player that has a character on the server you want to play on?
Like in DCUO, where you just port to your faction's home base, use the phase shifter, and move from the PvP to the PvE server instantly and for free?
Like in Rift, where not only you can change in a similar way to WoW, every character gets a free server change every month?
Like in Runescape, where the character is not tied to server and you choose at login time if you will be playing in a PvP or PvE server?
Like in UO, where back in 2000 the game added a PvE world, and from them on players can jump back and forth between the PvP and PvE worlds by just using a moongate?
Allowing players to jump back and forth seems to be more common nowadays than the alternative. And that if the game even allows PvP in the open world; nowadays, restricting PvP to just dedicated battleground zones seems to be more common.
What I would really like to see is Open PvE. I worry about what happens when Mobius quits or decides to move on to another game, or even just goes on vacation. It's a horrible single point of failure for a gameplay style that is now standard, and has been embraced from day one by many online games and MMOs. The omission of Open PvE in a world where Solo and Group are a thing just screams amateur hour for multiplayer game design.
Solo is easy mode? The whole idea that Solo is easy has been debunked many times over in the thread in the first 5000 posts. Try stopping by a SSS in solo mode, or jumping in to a HICZ? Try combat with one hand tied behind your back, or when you have the shakes. I'm not joking about this, try it and see whether that's the case, because for some people that's the reality. You have the ability to choose Solo mode. Some people do NOT have the ability to choose Open.
Just because one (unsubstantiated in size) part of the player base sees Open as the dog's doo daas and treats Solo like a dirty wash bag fdev should listen and give advantage to that (unsubstantiated in size) group. Especially at the expense of the disabled (no matter how large or small that group is)?
All this time people are saying it's about equality. What they mean is equality for them, having cussed Solo to the point they'd feel shame in going there. So to cover their shame they want FDev to give them the Turkey wing so they don't have to back down. Give over guys...
It is "easy mode" for me, if I want to make credits - it is easier, if you want to complete community goals - it is easier, even if you want to explore - it is easier, no risk when coming back to a station that someone may interdict you and that you may have to fight for your life to cash those credits in. It is easier to fight the AI than other players.
Easier in that way, not in the way that you play against groups of winged AI in SSS or with one hand tied behind your back.
Ultimately it is about what FD thinks is a more viable mode for long term health of the playerbase, easy mode or not - on one hand there is only so much fun you can have against AI, on the other there are certainly a lot less ship paints or other virtual goods that FD will sell to players whose ship colours can only be appreciated by themselves and by the AI.
Given that we have the shop as part of the whole "experience" it is only natural to expect that in the future, FD will cater towards an experience where they encourage more people to interact and which will drive more sales of virtual goods as this is a large potential revenue stream that they seem to be interested in exploiting.
Given that we have the shop as part of the whole "experience" it is only natural to expect that in the future, FD will cater towards an experience where they encourage more people to interact and which will drive more sales of virtual goods as this is a large potential revenue stream that they seem to be interested in exploiting.
For the shop it's of little matter if people "interact". More important is to keep them playing the game, as customers.
Chasing off solo interested players doesn't really help with that.
The Titan Blacks are a rare good available in unlimited supply, and the first five players to retrieve and sell a canister of the Titan Black prototypes at Godel Ring in the Ededleen system will be rewarded with a real Titan Black, with an RRP of £899.
Crucially, the entire objective, from collection to sale of the canisters MUST happen in Open Play. That means the collection must be made in Open Play, the journey to Godel Ring must be made in Open Play, and the sale must be made in Open Play.
Remember: you don't have to BUY the canister, only retrieve and SELL the canister. And so the question is: will you go hunting across the galaxy for the one starport selling Titan Blacks? Or will you blockade Godel Ring and lie in wait?
It is "easy mode" for me, if I want to make credits - it is easier, if you want to complete community goals - it is easier, even if you want to explore - it is easier, no risk when coming back to a station that someone may interdict you and that you may have to fight for your life to cash those credits in. It is easier to fight the AI than other players.
Easier in that way, not in the way that you play against groups of winged AI in SSS or with one hand tied behind your back.
Ultimately it is about what FD thinks is a more viable mode for long term health of the playerbase, easy mode or not - on one hand there is only so much fun you can have against AI, on the other there are certainly a lot less ship paints or other virtual goods that FD will sell to players whose ship colours can only be appreciated by themselves and by the AI.
Given that we have the shop as part of the whole "experience" it is only natural to expect that in the future, FD will cater towards an experience where they encourage more people to interact and which will drive more sales of virtual goods as this is a large potential revenue stream that they seem to be interested in exploiting.
The idea of thinking about doing it with one hand behind your back was to try and get you to think about something other than "me, me, me!" You are not the centre of the universe and you are right - there's more to the player-base than PvP centric players with time on their hands and FDev will take that into account if they know what's sensible for them.
Solo is there. You can do it if you want. You can also bring your exploration data to a remote outpost in Open with no fear that anyone will interdict you. The differences really are exaggerated. The same thing about the store. It's there if you want to buy them. You don't have to use them in any particular mode. There's no warning on skins that says "Can only be used in Open" and many a High Def beauty shot can only come from Solo as it's the only mode that produces them.
There are different advantages to each mode and none it better than the other at the moment, just different. That's how it's going to stay if FDev have any sense. Banging on about it is only going to give you a headache.
Of course things can and do change - not everything that was expected to be in the game has proven to be possible within the constraints of game development. The three game modes, however, have been implemented as stated, as has the ability to mode switch.
To compare mode switching to a disease is quite interesting. To say that "part of the draw is that it is risky" is quite correct - however part of the attraction for some players is the ability to self-select the level of risk posed by other players through their free choice of game mode. I realise that this is probably anathema to players who would prefer that everyone was either locked in a single game mode or at least restricted to one game mode but Frontier chose, from the outset, not to restrict players in that manner.
It is not anathema, it is that you are actively encouraged to use Solo with the current rule set.
Why would you trade in the open? Only for the thrill of losing it all.
Why would you mine in the open? -||-
Why would you go to conflict zones in the open? -||-
Why would you do community goals in the open? -||-
Why would you earn credits in the open? -||-
The only reason to do anything in the open which is better than in solo - is to fight other players, assuming you can find them.
If they leave open as it is - it will be dead in a year, and I am sure that many here posting opinions to leave balance as is, will be just fine with that.
The question is whether this is best of FD and for the future of ED? Who will buy all those shiny new ship paints?
Some encouragement to use open other than the thrill of losing your progress and paying extra ship insurance should be there in my view.
For those arguing that Open Play is "tacked on" and not really the focus of the game, here's a little tidbit from today's newsletter:
The Titan Blacks are a rare good available in unlimited supply, and the first five players to retrieve and sell a canister of the Titan Black prototypes at Godel Ring in the Ededleen system will be rewarded with a real Titan Black, with an RRP of £899.
Crucially, the entire objective, from collection to sale of the canisters MUST happen in Open Play. That means the collection must be made in Open Play, the journey to Godel Ring must be made in Open Play, and the sale must be made in Open Play.
Remember: you don't have to BUY the canister, only retrieve and SELL the canister. And so the question is: will you go hunting across the galaxy for the one starport selling Titan Blacks? Or will you blockade Godel Ring and lie in wait?
For the shop it's of little matter if people "interact". More important is to keep them playing the game, as customers.
Chasing off solo interested players doesn't really help with that.
Sigh. Reading this post made me think of a scene from the Matrix:
[video]www.youtube.com/watch?v=zyNyHark4xk[/url]
The idea of thinking about doing it with one hand behind your back was to try and get you to think about something other than "me, me, me!" You are not the centre of the universe and you are right - there's more to the player-base than PvP centric players with time on their hands and FDev will take that into account if they know what's sensible for them.
Solo is there. You can do it if you want. You can also bring your exploration data to a remote outpost in Open with no fear that anyone will interdict you. The differences really are exaggerated. The same thing about the store. It's there if you want to buy them. You don't have to use them in any particular mode. There's no warning on skins that says "Can only be used in Open" and many a High Def beauty shot can only come from Solo as it's the only mode that produces them.
There are different advantages to each mode and none it better than the other at the moment, just different. That's how it's going to stay if FDev have any sense. Banging on about it is only going to give you a headache.
It is also an opinion only - surely this scene applies to both sides of any argument, ever, that is until someone changes their opinion. On my end seeing the conversation I am more open to the idea a new "ironman" mode that would be MP only than I was at the beginning of this conversation.
It is also an opinion only - surely this scene applies to both sides of any argument, ever, that is until someone changes their opinion. On my end seeing the conversation I am more open to the idea a new "ironman" mode that would be MP only than I was at the beginning of this conversation.
Indeed. Or even a 4th "Exclusive Open" or "Contest" mode where mode switching was not allowed (but not going so far as Ironman's 1 life policy). It would be nice if FD didn't have to resort to log analysis every time they want to promote something competitive. I suspect we'd see more contests (even just for skins), if running them wasn't so burdensome.
-- edit --
But maybe, by now, the log analysis is automated...
For me such ironman mode would be that you only do not have insurance coverage, not that every time you die you start with a Sidey and lose everything, as you would have an universe full of Sideys and Eagles, basically you would keep your credits (maybe even stored ships) for the next life making the loss sting a lot, but not be totally crippling. (most variations on this theme would also be fine with me; ie have insurance but no default 200k/600k coverage at minimum, have insurance which is a lot more expensive and so on).
For me this would be E : D to it's full potential, where every interaction mattered, where your group of friends (or not having any) mattered a lot more, and so on. Where it matters who you meet in the MP, what is the skill of your opponent and so on. The base is set, it is only that the options to play that way cannot be selected.
It is the world where when you meet an Elite Eagle player, you tremble in fear (the mode only counts player kills).
edit: regardless, this is a topic for a different thread.
