Should have just combat logged.

[jacozilla]

This game has pvp flagging it's called "playing in open."

Declaring one thing that means 180 degree opposite to be equivalent to something just doesnt make it so, no matter how much you prefer it is.

your statement has as much logical analogy as 'this green crayon is really a red crayon, so when you color with it, the lines are actually red'

the most basic precedent every game with pvp that uses a "pvp flagging" or "flag to enable pvp" system has two absolute core requirements - that both parties consent and if either party does not, there is no pvp possible between the two - and that both flagged and non-flagged parties exist within the same game world.

equating merely playing in open to be the same thing as flagging for pvp has the same logic as any crime described as 'you were doing / wearing X, so you were asking for it'

 

[rckstr]

This is rubbish. Playing in Open doesn't mean flagging yourself up as someone else's plaything. It means you want to see other REAL players & maybe have some kind of non-hostile interaction with them. And as long as this kind of attitude persists there is no hope for co-operative play.

Well but it is a part of open and since you are hostile after pledging to a power you can only expect non hostile actions from your powers cmdrs. If you meet cmdrs that chitchat with you though you are hostile to each other it is just luck and mostly happens when both are bored. I had them a couple of times already but always with people that also have been hostile to the current system (2 powers undermining another). I don't expect to be treated nice from ALD cmdrs while i am roaming their space. People should try to understand that a game where you take part in a small RP character has nothing to do with real world ooc interaction.
What happened to him is just "daily business" and not worth a thread here.

 

[deathmagnet]

I've always been against the idea of combat logging. It feels a bit of a cheap win.

So I lost an interdiction battle for the first time ever the other day to some schmuck pirate. No matter.
I try and talk to the guy. Ask what he wants. Nothing on me anyway aside from some supplies which are worthless.
No reply other than lasers to the face. Yay another griefer.

I'm not kitted out for a fight this time so I have no choice other than to run. But somehow this oter clipper is faster than mine even with 4 pips to Engines and repeated boosting. He's able to stay right on my tail and non stop firing. Which is obv nonsense anyway.

So I die.
And yes I'm peeved.
And yes I'm going to stick to Solo for doing Power Play since its a lot easier to do what you want there to screw over the idiots who seem to love KoS like its some sort of ePeen.

That said...
I'll be back for that guy with my vulture when i'm done. Nobody cheap shots my ass without payback. Fancy clipper? Fancy spacedust soon...

When outfitted correctly Clippers are faster than even Cobras because they can boost more often than the Cobra

 

[Chaodiurn]

The only thing I ever think when such a threads spawns is 'If I was a griefer I would try to track down and collect whine threads as substitution for skulls'.

 

[scorpyon]

.
What happened to him is just "daily business" and not worth a thread here.

Yet you deemed it "worthy" of replying to and throwing in your own point of view on.
If only there was a place where folks could raise issue and topics of discussion to bring up with other people in similar places of interest.
Some sort of... Bulletin board I guess ... Where you can make a point about something like this and others can have their say.

someone should really get on that...

 

[Asp Explorer]

Some sort of... Bulletin board I guess ... Where you can make a point about something like this and others can have their say.

someone should really get on that...

An interesting idea. Perhaps we could implement it with some kind of code running on a secure computer with remote access to it available through phone lines or something? Some kind of device running on the remote machines to enable signals to be sent through the phone lines - I dunno a pulse modulation or something, and software to code and decode those pulses into machine-readable data, and further convert that into human-readable data? Could there be a need for this type of futuristic tech?

 

[scorpyon]

An interesting idea. Perhaps we could implement it with some kind of code running on a secure computer with remote access to it available through phone lines or something? Some kind of device running on the remote machines to enable signals to be sent through the phone lines - I dunno a pulse modulation or something, and software to code and decode those pulses into machine-readable data, and further convert that into human-readable data? Could there be a need for this type of futuristic tech?

Yes... YES! Ye gads! I think we're onto something.
this will be big!
i'm talking Space Whale big!!

 

[rckstr]

Yet you deemed it "worthy" of replying to and throwing in your own point of view on.
If only there was a place where folks could raise issue and topics of discussion to bring up with other people in similar places of interest.
Some sort of... Bulletin board I guess ... Where you can make a point about something like this and others can have their say.

someone should really get on that...

Just because i think it is not worth creating a thread the way you did doesn't make it unworthy to reply to. What happened to you is happening to many cmdr's daily and is thus daily business and not real worth creating a thread because of this. Imagine everyone who got killed in hostile territory would create a thread like you did. The reason why i replied here was the "how" you described your experience. It is ok to have a black book with people to hunt down in revenge.
But it not really sportsmanlike to switch to Solo and grind till you can afford a revenge. But it is allowed, it will stay that way and make such incidents even more meaningless.
Also i haven't seen any insight on your side that the guy who killed you maybe had every right to do so since you and him where marked as hostile to each other.
If you'd been in a cobra or something different small and he'd attacked you i would partially agree to the sportsmanship though you'd been hostile.
I for my part stick to open only because of reasons. If i see a smaller ship in "my" territory marked as hostile i'll interdict him and tell him he is in the wrong place. If he starts to shoot, i'll take him down. If he jumps to SC and continues shooting NPC's, i'll take him down as well. If he notes my name, fine. But grinding in solo until you can afford fights or even revenge is just, meh...

 

[scorpyon]

Just because i think it is not worth creating a thread the way you did doesn't make it unworthy to reply to. What happened to you is happening to many cmdr's daily and is thus daily business and not real worth creating a thread because of this. Imagine everyone who got killed in hostile territory would create a thread like you did. The reason why i replied here was the "how" you described your experience. It is ok to have a black book with people to hunt down in revenge.
But it not really sportsmanlike to switch to Solo and grind till you can afford a revenge. But it is allowed, it will stay that way and make such incidents even more meaningless.
Also i haven't seen any insight on your side that the guy who killed you maybe had every right to do so since you and him where marked as hostile to each other.
If you'd been in a cobra or something different small and he'd attacked you i would partially agree to the sportsmanship though you'd been hostile.
I for my part stick to open only because of reasons. If i see a smaller ship in "my" territory marked as hostile i'll interdict him and tell him he is in the wrong place. If he starts to shoot, i'll take him down. If he jumps to SC and continues shooting NPC's, i'll take him down as well. If he notes my name, fine. But grinding in solo until you can afford fights or even revenge is just, meh...

Woah woah woah. Hold on there hoss!
Let's first of all ignore the comment about sportsmanship, since that is the worst contradiction I have read on this thread so far. You can't call going Solo being unsportsmanslike in the same breath as trying to claim killing on sight for no reason against an obviously inferior vessel is.
But let's ignore that for now.

Instead, let's focus on the huge assumption you've just made.
You claimed I was hostile.
Not possible. I was in my own faction territory. I can't be hostile in that area.
No hostile warning flag on the scanner.
No Wanted bounties or anything like that.
The guy himself was in fact the hostile one in terms of the game mechanics / faction stuff. He was in my system trying to... well do whatever he was trying to do... undermine? I guess thats what you do in other people's systems? I dont know. I seriously dont get the whole PP thing since its been bugged for me from the moment I started trying to use it.

So, in short. No. I wasn't hostile. Not in the slightest. Not even in action - obviously considering my request for communication with the guy and not even firing a weapon.

 

[stocko1111]

Woah woah woah. Hold on there hoss!
Let's first of all ignore the comment about sportsmanship, since that is the worst contradiction I have read on this thread so far. You can't call going Solo being unsportsmanslike in the same breath as trying to claim killing on sight for no reason against an obviously inferior vessel is.
But let's ignore that for now.

Instead, let's focus on the huge assumption you've just made.
You claimed I was hostile.
Not possible. I was in my own faction territory. I can't be hostile in that area.
No hostile warning flag on the scanner.
No Wanted bounties or anything like that.
The guy himself was in fact the hostile one in terms of the game mechanics / faction stuff. He was in my system trying to... well do whatever he was trying to do... undermine? I guess thats what you do in other people's systems? I dont know. I seriously dont get the whole PP thing since its been bugged for me from the moment I started trying to use it.

So, in short. No. I wasn't hostile. Not in the slightest. Not even in action - obviously considering my request for communication with the guy and not even firing a weapon.

Not sure if I've read all this properly, just skimmed it, but if you were assigned to a power and in your own power's space, and the other commander was assigned to another power but in your space, then you may well have been hostile to him, making you a valid target to be shot at. You don't need to be wanted, have a bounty on your head or even have him show up as hostile to you (although he probably should show as hostile), for him to be able to class you as an enemy and shoot your face off. The other commander'll even get rewarded for it by his/hers own power in the form of 15 cc points.

 

[Mr_Blastman]

This is a good reason to not join a faction, OP. If you are a trader or a pirate, once you join one, you significantly limit your mobility. That's kind of counterproductive.

 

[Colonel North]

Well we can both toss around the word flawed but of course only I am right,

Unfortunately forum rules prohibit any appropriate response.

 

[CMDR Malkov]

Woah woah woah. Hold on there hoss!
Let's first of all ignore the comment about sportsmanship, since that is the worst contradiction I have read on this thread so far. You can't call going Solo being unsportsmanslike in the same breath as trying to claim killing on sight for no reason against an obviously inferior vessel is.
But let's ignore that for now.

Instead, let's focus on the huge assumption you've just made.
You claimed I was hostile.
Not possible. I was in my own faction territory. I can't be hostile in that area.
No hostile warning flag on the scanner.
No Wanted bounties or anything like that.
The guy himself was in fact the hostile one in terms of the game mechanics / faction stuff. He was in my system trying to... well do whatever he was trying to do... undermine? I guess thats what you do in other people's systems? I dont know. I seriously dont get the whole PP thing since its been bugged for me from the moment I started trying to use it.

So, in short. No. I wasn't hostile. Not in the slightest. Not even in action - obviously considering my request for communication with the guy and not even firing a weapon.

To be fair you can be hostile regardless of whether you are labelled so by the tags of the game mechanics. That is more an indication that you can be attacked without consequences from the authorities as I understand it.

What faction are you? What faction was he? Maybe he thought you might be carrying cargo for fortification. There are lots of valid reasons he may have had to attack you.

You say he was a pirate and your signature describes you as a bounty hunter, piloting "Venom" with a mission to "rid the pirate scum from civilized space".
You don't sound terribly friendly

 

[rckstr]

Woah woah woah. Hold on there hoss!
Let's first of all ignore the comment about sportsmanship, since that is the worst contradiction I have read on this thread so far. You can't call going Solo being unsportsmanslike in the same breath as trying to claim killing on sight for no reason against an obviously inferior vessel is.
But let's ignore that for now.

Instead, let's focus on the huge assumption you've just made.
You claimed I was hostile.
Not possible. I was in my own faction territory. I can't be hostile in that area.
No hostile warning flag on the scanner.
No Wanted bounties or anything like that.
The guy himself was in fact the hostile one in terms of the game mechanics / faction stuff. He was in my system trying to... well do whatever he was trying to do... undermine? I guess thats what you do in other people's systems? I dont know. I seriously dont get the whole PP thing since its been bugged for me from the moment I started trying to use it.

So, in short. No. I wasn't hostile. Not in the slightest. Not even in action - obviously considering my request for communication with the guy and not even firing a weapon.

Oh come on. You say you haven't been hostile? Maybe you did no hostile action against him. But you are marked as hostile for him and vice versa. He took his opportunity to take down a fortifying cmdr in the same vessel he has. It doesn't matter if you have been in your territory and he was the intruder. That is part of the game.

Well there have been some people quicker then me. I hope you'll start to understand what happened to you and why it is not really worth opening a thread about such incidents.

 

[Ian Skippy]

Woah woah woah. Hold on there hoss!
Let's first of all ignore the comment about sportsmanship, since that is the worst contradiction I have read on this thread so far. You can't call going Solo being unsportsmanslike in the same breath as trying to claim killing on sight for no reason against an obviously inferior vessel is.
But let's ignore that for now.

Instead, let's focus on the huge assumption you've just made.
You claimed I was hostile.
Not possible. I was in my own faction territory. I can't be hostile in that area.
No hostile warning flag on the scanner.
No Wanted bounties or anything like that.
The guy himself was in fact the hostile one in terms of the game mechanics / faction stuff. He was in my system trying to... well do whatever he was trying to do... undermine? I guess thats what you do in other people's systems? I dont know. I seriously dont get the whole PP thing since its been bugged for me from the moment I started trying to use it.

So, in short. No. I wasn't hostile. Not in the slightest. Not even in action - obviously considering my request for communication with the guy and not even firing a weapon.

Good sir, hostile is a relative condition. You are hostile to systems and players. You may have been 'not hostile' in your current system, but you're still every bit as hostile to any hostile faction and their players. As you were in your own system, he would have gotten a bounty for it (and potentially a cc reward, if it was a control system), but what he did was perfectly legit. Apart from that, combat logging would have been extremely pathetic, and going solo is just a personal choice you have to decide for yourself.

Basically your point is that you dont like it when other soldiers shoot at you after you joined a different army. I get the sentiment, but it kinda comes with the job...

 

[drkaii]

Almost seems like a debate of good vs. evil. One side is rigorously trying to defend the ability to kill other players with as few restrictions as possible, the other side trying to come up with as many restrictions as possible.


Both sides feel so passionate about it. I just wonder what it's like to be the other side. The side that is getting angry at people for being upset that they were killed by players under dodgy circumstances. You know...the dark side.

What is your deep seated value you are trying to protect here? Why is it you really really want to make sure it's ok to kill other players with as few limiting conditions as possible? What's your deep rooted motivation?

That's a serious question by the way.


I'm willing to admit that from my side, the deep seated root value is that I don't like the idea of people praying on people. I don't think it's nice, healthy, fun, a good atmosphere. I'm just not that kind of guy. I do like a good fight, with clear rules, with both sides in agreement - nothing vague or ambiguous. Nothing like "well if he didn't want to be killed he shouldn't have been flying in open in that sector where there is a power" or "he has no right to be upset that I killed him and made him lose 2 months of exploration data - he should have paid that 200cr bounty". I don't think you can justify that just because it's "allowed". It's fundamentally wrong, nasty behaviour in my opinion. Call me a softie, a goodie two shoes, a tree hugging hippie. Whatever you like.

I'll also admit that I've been killed by a couple of pirates for absolutely no reason other than I was weak and I'm angry and I overreact and am biased.

But what's YOUR motivation. Why do you want to defend this so passionately? Let's be honest here. Is it simply because one time you were called a greifer and you got so offended you are on a campaign, or is it because deep down you actually like hurting people? Or something I haven't thought of.

 

[rckstr]

Almost seems like a debate of good vs. evil. One side is rigorously trying to defend the ability to kill other players with as few restrictions as possible, the other side trying to come up with as many restrictions as possible.


Both sides feel so passionate about it. I just wonder what it's like to be the other side. The side that is getting angry at people for being upset that they were killed by players under dodgy circumstances. You know...the dark side.

What is your deep seated value you are trying to protect here? Why is it you really really want to make sure it's ok to kill other players with as few limiting conditions as possible? What's your deep rooted motivation?

That's a serious question by the way.

Let me ask you. Do you play PP and know the mechanics? If not:
You have 10 powers, each with a different (one of 4) major faction behind. The Feds have 2 powers, Alliance has 1, Empire has 4 and the indi's have 3. As soon as you join one of those powers you are marked as hostile for every other power.
Hostile means you are the enemy and you are allowed to strike down other enemys. It is not a thing in between or something. As soon as i see someone who is hostile, i'll check his faction and prepare myself.
But joining a power and ranting about getting killed by a hostile cmdr- with or without any kind of chitchat, announcement, parole or something else is unnecessary. And telling others that you'd been griefed is beyond my imagination.
People should begin to understand that some small actions might have repercussions. And if he wants to participate in PP but without any hostile incidents i am sure Solo will welcome him. But switching to solo until you can afford a revenge is just silly.

 

[Tepescovir]

I got grifed by a human commander twice last night, first time i didnt react quick enough after the interdiction as i was gob smacked to actually see a human player, never mind been interdicted by one( I always submit for fun). went back and he got me again, but i wasnt setup properly for combat.
So re geared and went looking, but couldnt find him. I was that i lost a million on insurance, but never occoured to me to logout to save the little cash i had . I was more intrested in actually fighting a human.

 

[rckstr]

I got grifed by a human commander twice last night, first time i didnt react quick enough after the interdiction as i was gob smacked to actually see a human player, never mind been interdicted by one( I always submit for fun). went back and he got me again, but i wasnt setup properly for combat.
So re geared and went looking, but couldnt find him. I was that i lost a million on insurance, but never occoured to me to logout to save the little cash i had . I was more intrested in actually fighting a human.

That's how you do it. I know it is a pain if you don't have that many credits to take a couple of losses. But staying strong and taking the loss if it occurs is the way to go. I like that and more people should have such an attitude.

 

[Mr_Blastman]

I got grifed by a human commander twice last night, first time i didnt react quick enough after the interdiction as i was gob smacked to actually see a human player, never mind been interdicted by one( I always submit for fun). went back and he got me again, but i wasnt setup properly for combat.
So re geared and went looking, but couldnt find him. I was that i lost a million on insurance, but never occoured to me to logout to save the little cash i had . I was more intrested in actually fighting a human.

This is how the game is supposed to be played.