Pirates and Traders

[Burnzee Boyee]

Its is funny seeing these same threads get reproduced for the Xbox version. The same pirate/trader dynamics get played out as they did in the PC/Mac versions. I would suggest this. Pirates should value any trader that braves Open. I hope I can get some pirates from PC/Mac back me up on this. As a pirate, be careful how heavy handed you are against traders. Too much and you will just drive them to solo where they can't be touched...and then what do you have left? A lot of empty boring space. Destruction is not the only option as you are the more powerful ship. Disabling them is also an easy option for you. Just saying.

Yup, I've had this from a foolish Pirate (back story in the NOVA FLEET section).

I only play open space, to me it still carries the same excitement as when I first played it weeks ago on the XBONE now.

A few CMDR pirates have asked me to drop cargo, which I point blank refuse( depending on the scenario lol)...that's my prerogative...I'm a Bounty Hunter...I love seeing those messages. My replies are always straight and to the point, if I have cargo and I know I can take the pirate I will offer him a chance to run for his life, If I have no cargo, I will ask him to scan and leave. It's surprising how many wanna be Pirates don't scan first before asking you to drop cargo, these are the ones I take pleasure in destroying. it's a lesson they must learn.

If you're going to ask someone to drop cargo as a pirate, at least scan your target first lol Oh and make sure they aren't a Bounty Hunter.

 

[Distance]

Yes... all true and congrats for you both being a higher level pirate but when silent running you can't target subsystems for those traders that don't know.

If you've hit silent running and you've not stopped then I'm not worrying about hitting your subsystems

 

[mavrac]

There's no other way to take cargo as the mechanics for piracy are broken.

Shoot out drives and the ship carries on at the last speed spinning wildly so it's impossible to get a hatch breaker to connect. If it did connect it takes 18 seconds to work whilst it takes 15 seconds to log out via the menu, quicker if players kill the process. Shooting the cargo hatch of a wildly spinning ship causes more damage. Both methods only drop like 8t of cargo and due to the spinning ship it's spread over a wide area.

Due to high waking and combat logging you have a few seconds to work out what your target is going to so that's why piracy is what it is today. Being nice doesn't work, even giving people time doesn't work as I've had the "tell me how to drop cargo" and then the guy combat logs whilst I'm typing.

There's no legitimate way to stop a trader and siphon more than 8t of cargo before they combat log so the only option for piracy since release has been extortion. 99% of the time if you stop for a cargo scan when asked you won't die. What's better losing a few tons of cargo or your entire rebuy and cargo cost? Most of the time if you stop for a scan and you have low quality cargo a pirate will even let you go without firing a shot.

Go grab a cheap ship and try piracy for yourself and then come back and show us how easy it is before commenting on a profession you don't know anything about.

I've traded for about 3-400 hrs and pirated for about 1-200 hrs so I'm speaking from experience of both sides of the coin.

Too many ppl keep misplacing the term combat logging. Its only.combat when two or more parties are of their own free will engage each other. What pirates do is not combat, its called bullying, picking on a child, and then bully cries cause the child ran away, and bully didn't get to beat on the child anymore. That is not combat nor combat logging.

Also its funny how humanity makes excuses for anything it does, no matter what it is. Some will convince them selves that due to "this" I have a right to do "this"

Ok bub, sure if you think its ok to murder because you didn't get your way, and they didn't give your their hard earned cash. And you think that is just. But your actions push many to solo, and more to private when its launched leaving no one left to pirate. If its a matter of wanting pvp get together with others here and join the many conflicts pick a side and fight. Or so you rather killing those who can't fight back..

 

[Slvrsurfer]

Too many ppl keep misplacing the term combat logging. Its only.combat when two or more parties are of their own free will engage each other. What pirates do is not combat, its called bullying, picking on a child, and then bully cries cause the child ran away, and bully didn't get to beat on the child anymore. That is not combat nor combat logging.

Also its funny how humanity makes excuses for anything it does, no matter what it is. Some will convince them selves that due to "this" I have a right to do "this"

Ok bub, sure if you think its ok to murder because you didn't get your way, and they didn't give your their hard earned cash. And you think that is just. But your actions push many to solo, and more to private when its launched leaving no one left to pirate. If its a matter of wanting pvp get together with others here and join the many conflicts pick a side and fight. Or so you rather killing those who can't fight back..

I don't know how you feel bounty hunters are any better than pirates honestly. I myself have not killed a single live cmdr yet, but I do have some hefty bounties on my head in some systems from doing assassin missions given by the game and from robbing type 9's of palladium in anarchy res zones. With that being said, you bounty hunters aren't going to ask me if I killed a player or not, you will just attack. But that's okay right? I just don't get the whole 'wanted' pirate equals notorious murderer thing going on. The last time I was interdiction was by someone in my own faction when part of the federation over a ridiculous low bounty for accidentally shooting police in an res zone. Really? I mean bounty hunters ask even less questions than pirates in my book so far.

 

[ocflyer]

I
Bounty hunters are always threat to pirate so love dealing with them. But to the traders with millions in their hold why do you run when you can't outrun the person pirating you when your masslocked?

Pirates are too concerned that a trader can't outrun them. As a trader, I don't have to outrun. I only have to survive long enough to jump to another system. My ship is well armed so I either fight back and win or jump to supercruise if not locked or jump to another system if locked. Short story - whether a pirate has a big ship is meaningless to me as a trader.

 

[ChaoticGenious]

I don't know how you feel bounty hunters are any better than pirates honestly. I myself have not killed a single live cmdr yet, but I do have some hefty bounties on my head in some systems from doing assassin missions given by the game and from robbing type 9's of palladium in anarchy res zones. With that being said, you bounty hunters aren't going to ask me if I killed a player or not, you will just attack. But that's okay right? I just don't get the whole 'wanted' pirate equals notorious murderer thing going on. The last time I was interdiction was by someone in my own faction when part of the federation over a ridiculous low bounty for accidentally shooting police in an res zone. Really? I mean bounty hunters ask even less questions than pirates in my book so far.

well you have a bounty for a reason, we have kill warrant scanner to check the sze of the bounty, 400cr isn't going to cover ammo costs, so personally i'm not going to go for those unless fired upon.

Other than that some authority in the black that you've off wants you dusted - Consider us The Hand of Karma. and be prepared for a 3 fold return.

In fact if any Bounty Hunters feel like joining me in The Hand of Karma I'll set up a thread

 

[Distance]

Too many ppl keep misplacing the term combat logging. Its only.combat when two or more parties are of their own free will engage each other. What pirates do is not combat, its called bullying, picking on a child, and then bully cries cause the child ran away, and bully didn't get to beat on the child anymore. That is not combat nor combat logging.

Also its funny how humanity makes excuses for anything it does, no matter what it is. Some will convince them selves that due to "this" I have a right to do "this"

Ok bub, sure if you think its ok to murder because you didn't get your way, and they didn't give your their hard earned cash. And you think that is just. But your actions push many to solo, and more to private when its launched leaving no one left to pirate. If its a matter of wanting pvp get together with others here and join the many conflicts pick a side and fight. Or so you rather killing those who can't fight back..

Man could you be any more wrong. It's a video game where piracy has been advertised as one of the main professions. NPCs do it and they don't even say how much cargo they want they just drop in guns blazing.

Piracy is bullying that's the point of it. Just because someone does something in a video game it doesn't mean they're a bad person. I've just been playing batman so by your logic I'm a psychopathic billionaire vigilante. Get some perspective m8.

If you don't want to risk seeing another player that could possibly shoot you then don't go in to open. It's not about being "pushed to solo" solo and group exist so you can play without that risk.

Read the sales page some time :

Take control of your own starship in a cutthroat galaxy. In the year 3300, across the vast expanse of an epic, full-scale recreation of our Milky Way, interstellar rivalries flare as galactic superpowers fight proxy wars.

Some may know you as an ally; others will call you a pirate, a bounty hunter, a smuggler, an explorer, an assassin, a hero... Fly alone or with friends, fight for a cause or go it alone; your actions change the galaxy around you in an ever unfolding story.

Start with a small starship and a few credits, and do whatever it takes to get the skill, knowledge, wealth and power to stand among the ranks of the Elite.

What part of cut throat galaxy don't you understand?

This is a game with consequences. At any minute you could be blown away by a player or an npc, players are just a lot better at it. If you don't want to take the risks then stay in solo and group and don't combat log or cry about being shot in open.

Man, if players pirated like the npcs did there would be a hell of a lot more trader tears. The fact that most pirates make the effort to do things properly should mean you should have some respect for one of the hardest professions in the game.

 

[Alpha Wolfe]

There are a lot of confident bounty hunters and traders out there it would seem... Lots of confident pirates as well. Just remember there are a lot of variables that could have effected why you "totally owned that guy" outfitting, skill, experience etc... Can't wait to put PVP to the test in CQC. Can start sharpening our skills. Offensively and Defensively.. Hope its a good game mode.

 

[Hungry Shoggoth]

I've never killed a trader that didon't open fire first, and even then it's only been once and because while trying to disable his drives his hull popped.

My process goes something like this:
Interdict, scan cargo, ask for 10 tons if they have anything worth my time, release. If at any point the trader attempts to flee I will target their drives and attempt to disable their ship and use limpets to hack their cargo and take a full load of 32 tons for being a pain in my butt, if they become hostile and open fire on me I will still attempt to disable them but if that fails i feel no remorse for killing a player as stupid as to pick a fight with a superior fighting vessel just because they wanted to be stubborn.

There are ways around all of these scenarios of course, but a good pirate is always prepared, trader jumps to supercruise while you're typing? No problem just interdict them again, they jump out of system? Again no problem, wake scan and interdict again. Trader activates silent running? Again, not a problem simply close the distance, silent running doesn't make it impossible to lock a target it simply shortens the auto-resolve distance of the lock, even the smallest ships can be locked onto within 500m with silent running on. What becomes a problem is when the trader combat logs (yes it IS combat logging) as there is literally no way to counter this, bounty hunters would be hollaring 'coward' at any pirate that logged during combat and a trader that simply logs off because they refuse to play the game the way it's been designed is no different.

If the popo or a bounty hunter shows up i have to make a decision, if it's a ship I think I can handle ill give you a hell of a fight and even if I lose I'll have made you earn every credit of that bounty, if I know I'm outmatched I'll flee as best I can (and in a cobra 98% of the time i get away) and for all of you bounty hunters out there deluding yourselves into thinking your more honorable than a 'lowlife pirate', you're no better than a pirate, I've never once been communicated to by a bounty hunter before they opened fire, at least a good pirate will attempt to make a peaceful transaction.

As for the traders, there's a reason you have chosen the most lucrative profession in the game, and every profession has risks otherwise the game wouldn't literally be called Dangerous. IMHO solo and private modes shouldn't even exist, or at the very least should only be accessible to beginners. But if you think playing a space truck simulator in solo is fun knock yourselves out, I'll keep playing Elite: DANGEROUS the way it was intended.

 

[Technoraze]

I must be the worst pirate ever, forgot to install any cargo bays.
Maybe I'm a bounty hunter then. Don't think this deadly vulture is a pirating vessel.

For all the pirates out there which is your ship of choice?

 

[your everyday pirate]

I must be the worst pirate ever, forgot to install any cargo bays.
Maybe I'm a bounty hunter then. Don't think this deadly vulture is a pirating vessel.

For all the pirates out there which is your ship of choice?

If your cheap go for a cobra its a good pirate starting vessel. Once you have the money and rank go for a imperial clipper. If you want something even more heavy duty for pirating buy a python.

 

[mavrac]

Man could you be any more wrong. It's a video game where piracy has been advertised as one of the main professions. NPCs do it and they don't even say how much cargo they want they just drop in guns blazing.

Piracy is bullying that's the point of it. Just because someone does something in a video game it doesn't mean they're a bad person. I've just been playing batman so by your logic I'm a psychopathic billionaire vigilante. Get some perspective m8.

If you don't want to risk seeing another player that could possibly shoot you then don't go in to open. It's not about being "pushed to solo" solo and group exist so you can play without that risk.

Read the sales page some time :



What part of cut throat galaxy don't you understand?

This is a game with consequences. At any minute you could be blown away by a player or an npc, players are just a lot better at it. If you don't want to take the risks then stay in solo and group and don't combat log or cry about being shot in open.

Man, if players pirated like the npcs did there would be a hell of a lot more trader tears. The fact that most pirates make the effort to do things properly should mean you should have some respect for one of the hardest professions in the game.

Its not that I am worried. In fact if you have ever read my posts I out right hunt pirates. Just cause you can do something doesn't mean you have to. Its what it is. But def not afraid to go head to head, still waiting on a pirate that says he is better to prove it. Been playing this since PC beta release very well versed in pvp combat. I'm just trying to get pirates to see there are better ways than murder. But it seems that's what many turn to which is immature. Oh that hauler didn't give me what I wanted Tim to throw a fit and kill him and enjoy the fact he can't fight back.

Yes its a game. But there is something psychologically different different about one person who gravitates to the murderous side vs the many ppl that naturally and always choose the good. Take car no need to get angry bub


Funny all you said and still fact remains coming from experience its not combat when your attacking a civilian that is unarmed. That's being a brute/bully. Crying that the unarmed civilian ran away shows immaturity. Oh brute didn't get his way...

 

[Slvrsurfer]

I must be the worst pirate ever, forgot to install any cargo bays.
Maybe I'm a bounty hunter then. Don't think this deadly vulture is a pirating vessel.

For all the pirates out there which is your ship of choice?

From the recommendation of forum member 'distance' I have been making use of the asp. I like it. Not as speedy as a cobra but the extra utility slots and extra class one hard points help out. I also like that you got more internal slots, allowing the use of shield cells while having more cargo space than a cobra. I think the asp is a great ship and would recommend it. Also works great for me for assassin missions, can take out those npc pythons and anaconda's without too much trouble, even when they are in a wing.

 

[Technoraze]

From the recommendation of forum member 'distance' I have been making use of the asp. I like it. Not as speedy as a cobra but the extra utility slots and extra class one hard points help out. I also like that you got more internal slots, allowing the use of shield cells while having more cargo space than a cobra. I think the asp is a great ship and would recommend it. Also works great for me for assassin missions, can take out those npc pythons and anaconda's without too much trouble, even when they are in a wing.

Just flown 200ly in my Vulture back to Diaguandri to collect my asp again.time to try some piracy I think.

 

[Evasive Agent]

Too many ppl keep misplacing the term combat logging. Its only.combat when two or more parties are of their own free will engage each other. What pirates do is not combat, its called bullying, picking on a child, and then bully cries cause the child ran away, and bully didn't get to beat on the child anymore. That is not combat nor combat logging.

Also its funny how humanity makes excuses for anything it does, no matter what it is. Some will convince them selves that due to "this" I have a right to do "this"

Ok bub, sure if you think its ok to murder because you didn't get your way, and they didn't give your their hard earned cash. And you think that is just. But your actions push many to solo, and more to private when its launched leaving no one left to pirate. If its a matter of wanting pvp get together with others here and join the many conflicts pick a side and fight. Or so you rather killing those who can't fight back..

You sure do have a lot of whine, where's the cheese?

 

[Slvrsurfer]

Just flown 200ly in my Vulture back to Diaguandri to collect my asp again.time to try some piracy I think.

Lol. Cool man, hope you like it.

 

[Distance]

Its not that I am worried. In fact if you have ever read my posts I out right hunt pirates. Just cause you can do something doesn't mean you have to. Its what it is. But def not afraid to go head to head, still waiting on a pirate that says he is better to prove it. Been playing this since PC beta release very well versed in pvp combat. I'm just trying to get pirates to see there are better ways than murder. But it seems that's what many turn to which is immature. Oh that hauler didn't give me what I wanted Tim to throw a fit and kill him and enjoy the fact he can't fight back.

Yes its a game. But there is something psychologically different different about one person who gravitates to the murderous side vs the many ppl that naturally and always choose the good. Take car no need to get angry bub


Funny all you said and still fact remains coming from experience its not combat when your attacking a civilian that is unarmed. That's being a brute/bully. Crying that the unarmed civilian ran away shows immaturity. Oh brute didn't get his way...

I've been playing from pc beta too and played over a thousand hours. For me piracy is the most challenging and fun profession so that's why I do it.

After a couple of hundred hours of it you'll see that there's no other way to pirate currently if you want to break even.

I don't cry that a trader gets a way I complain about combat loggers as that's exploiting plain and simple. If a trader does get away fair play but until they change high waking and the interdiction cooldown then piracy will be "you run you die" plain and simple.

 

[jlfreelancers]

What ya going to do shoot me ?
Ummmm ya….
I played Eve for more years than I would like to say. I played on both sides of the fence. I used to run Blues into 0.0 all the time, billions in isk. Got shot out of the sky more than once. Eve, you lost your stuff, boom gone. Pod you, boom skills are gone, gear is gone. Hours, days, weeks, months of work gone. You know what you learn from that? Don’t move something you cannot replace. Period. You know what else you learn, who to pay off. I moved around deep in 0.0 (which for those that do not know, is complete lawlessness, pure PVP) BOB owned a system, you paid them off, Swarm owned a system you paid them off.
It was all in good fun. Does it suck to lose everything, sure does, but like I said, rule #1: DON’T FLY SOMETHING YOU CAN NOT AFFORD TO REPLACE.
Now on the other hand, A pirates life for me….
Not so much, my pirating days are over, (yet to begin really here in Elite) I found it got boring waiting. Sure something special in cloaking, than jamming someone while a wingman came in with the guns. I had lots of people beg me not to shoot them out of the sky, I also had lots run their mouth while they floating around in a pod. Again, living my the golden rule, if you’re flying it, you can replace it. But but I worked so hard….yes for me to come and take your stuff.
Don’t cry because you lost your ship, cry because you were dumb enough to fly it and not be able to replace it. I mean things could be completely different here in Elite, you all might have carebare pirates here, they might ask you to come park your ship around the local sun to sing songs and talk about old times....but I am thinking being a pirate is being a pirate just about everywhere.

 

[Robert Maynard]

If a trader does get away fair play but until they change high waking and the interdiction cooldown then piracy will be "you run you die" plain and simple.

Given that both of these game features *could* have been changed relatively simply, why do you think they have not been? In my opinion it is simply because anything that gives pirates more time to practice their craft also gives those who simply PK their targets more time than they need to destroy the interdictee. It seems to me that Frontier are trying to balance the wants of the interdictor and the interdictee - given that not every encounter should either end in ship destruction or a successful booty haul.

 

[Distance]

Given that both of these game features *could* have been changed relatively simply, why do you think they have not been? In my opinion it is simply because anything that gives pirates more time to practice their craft also gives those who simply PK their targets more time than they need to destroy the interdictee. It seems to me that Frontier are trying to balance the wants of the interdictor and the interdictee - given that not every encounter should either end in ship destruction or a successful booty haul.

I don't think they've done much in the way of balancing and have just pressed on with the new features. Pretty much everything is bare bones in this game right now and none of the professions have the tools or game mechanics to support them properly.

As I've said before they can't change them without adding in proper low/high security space and making anarchy systems viable. Pretty much overhauling the whole background sim.

Pretty much until then piracy is always going to be "stop within 5 seconds or die".