The Star Citizen Thread v 3.0

[MaxLexandre]

Whether it's the shocking lack of progress given their time and funding, the bizarre behavior of Roberts and his wife, the fixation on making a movie-game instead of the MMO people want, or the scurrilous intensity with which they push more and more potentially larcenous "concept sales," I have lost confidence.

This is actually a wrong view, the MMO wasn't the focus of the original Kickstarter, who did Kickstart this project wanted the Squadron 42 Singleplayer campaign. And even today, there's a lot of people who are not interested on the MMO still, however after the scope increase, the MMO became a huge part of the whole project.

 

[master_xean]

This is actually a wrong view, the MMO wasn't the focus of the original Kickstarter, who did Kickstart this project wanted the Squadron 42 Singleplayer campaign. And even today, there's a lot of people who are not interested on the MMO still, however after the scope increase, the MMO became a huge part of the whole project.

Every single "ship" they've sold has been for use in the Star Citizen MMO. Every single one of them.

 

[MaxLexandre]

Rumors says that they are now paying (with backers money) a private investigator to avoid/supress information of been leaked, so the backers know about them.
Interesting paradigm.
lol

lol, so you're saying that a Company has no right to investigate the employees that are leaking Information about the project / company internal affairs? Not only that, that breaches the employment contract of the persons who did so, they can not only be fired, they can get sued for it (happens more frequently than you can imagine).

On companies like Blizzard, the silence about everything that happens is pretty much religious/secretive, that's just how it goes.

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Every single "ship" they've sold has been for use in the Star Citizen MMO. Every single one of them.

Yup exactly, i'm talking about how it all started, on the Kickstarter, before the Crowdfunding, if they would had stick to it, the game would be pretty much the SP Campaign, the PU was still there by very far from what is currently being developed. I mean even Elite had to do its own scope adjustments before release, being realistic, it couldn't happen.

 

[Khavi]

lol, so you're saying that a Company has no right to investigate the employees that are leaking Information about the project / company internal affairs? Not only that, that breaches the employment contract of the persons who did so, they can not only be fired, they can get sued for it (happens more frequently than you can imagine).

On companies like Blizzard, the silence about everything that happens is pretty much religious/secretive, that's just how it goes.

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This guy goes around various forums and Twitter posting rumors and innuendo as if they are facts. He is totally fixated on Chris Roberts and CIG. Also, if he doesn't think most major corps don't have someone keeping an eye on their employees - just proves my point.

 

[MaxLexandre]

This guy goes around various forums and Twitter posting rumors and innuendo as if they are facts. He is totally fixated on Chris Roberts and CIG. Also, if he doesn't think most major corps don't have someone keeping an eye on their employees - just proves my point.

Yes unfortunately i'm aware.

Far i know he was already banned from many places, forums/media websites, etc... He just preaches the same thing over and over again on every place he can, i was impressed, to see him doing the same thing here, on Frontier forums.
It's just sad.

I'm here as i'm hyping around for Planet Coaster! (after Atari finally ruin the freaking tycoon series)

 

[Leper Messiah]

Because its against the law a lot of the things that CIG is doing to convince people to give them more money. It's against the recommended practices for crowdfunding, as publicized by the consumer protection entities. It sets a bad standard that opens more space to fraud: "Wait! If CIG can deceive people, been high profile and nobody bother, why the hell shouldn't I do the same... I just have to keep been paid for optional subs to "release information", "fancy tech demos", giving the excuse that happens, regardless been my own decisions, supposedly with the "support of the community", and that's it"

So, yes, who cares with the future of crowdfunding, with its grow should combat such things, not waiting more and more people be let down and disappointed and never funding anything again, specially when is the biggest crowd-funded project of all times, setting a bad standard in how to treat consumers.

Sorry but I really think that this is all making a mountain out of a molehill, I see no real evidence of fraud or "lies" that are not beyond the logical additions that arose from Chris getting enough money to think about scaleing things up.

What I can do is understand people who put money in early and see the game evolve "away" from a vision they invested in. That is not lies though, think about what the meaning of the word "development" really means. Do you think a game is started with a complete vision of the end game in it's entirety? I mean look at the development of halflife 2 and the countless hours spent on parts of the game...only for Valve to dump it all. Did that effect the end result? No, it's one of the best games ever made. What if HL2 was crowdfunded and valve showed a level being developed, people backed the game because of this level, then valve dumped it. Would we be saying valve were crappy liars? It's not that CiG are developing the game wrong, it's the fact that it's so open, warts and all.

Just because "8" happens doesn't necessarily mean it was caused by "4+4". it could be "2+4+2" or "6+2".

SC could easily fail, i don't think that will effect crowdfunding at all. The game maybe the biggest crowdfunded "thing" but it's failure won't be big news outside of space sim fan pages and tech pages. The importance of SC is not that high IMO. Then again I don't listen to the hype anyways.

also I thought it's a known thing that crowdfunding is a "risk" and there's no guarantee of an end product?

 

[jcrg99]

This is actually a wrong view, the MMO wasn't the focus of the original Kickstarter, who did Kickstart this project wanted the Squadron 42 Singleplayer campaign. And even today, there's a lot of people who are not interested on the MMO still, however after the scope increase, the MMO became a huge part of the whole project.

Nope. Your view is wrong.

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/cig/star-citizen/description

There is 1 or 2 paragraphs there who mention Squadron 42. All the rest is about the MMO side of the game.

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lol, so you're saying that a Company has no right to investigate the employees that are leaking Information about the project / company internal affairs? Not only that, that breaches the employment contract of the persons who did so, they can not only be fired, they can get sued for it (happens more frequently than you can imagine).

On companies like Blizzard, the silence about everything that happens is pretty much religious/secretive, that's just how it goes.

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Nope. I was not saying anything like that. I am just saying that its an interesting paradigm. Specially for someone who claims to be transparent and "having nothing to hide". So, why to spend BACKERS money to hide from backers, if he has nothing to hide? By the way... Blizzard was not a company built with crowdfunded money to built a project. There is a different treatment that crowdfunded companies gets from consumer protection authorities due that. They can't spend backers money on es and cocaine (or pet movies, unrelated SC stuff, marketing) for example. Blizzard can spend the money of their pre-orders in how many es and cocaine that they prefer.

 

[MaxLexandre]

also I thought it's a known thing that crowdfunding is a "risk" and there's no guarantee of an end product?

Not only Crowdfunding, as well Kickstarter. A thing people need to put on their heads when backing anything, is the risk that when you support any project, the delivery might be as good as expected, mediocre, bad, or just failure to delivery at all. It's just how it is, at the end of the day all CIG needs to deliver is a space sim with the main features promised on the campaign, those very same ones can play well, or just awfully, but at the end of the day those features are there, and to any legal talk surrounding it, such promised feature was delivered. What we can do is wait and hope that delivery is good.

 

[jcrg99]

Sorry but I really think that this is all making a mountain out of a molehill, I see no real evidence of fraud or "lies" that are not beyond the logical additions that arose from Chris getting enough money to think about scaleing things up.

What I can do is understand people who put money in early and see the game evolve "away" from a vision they invested in. That is not lies though, think about what the meaning of the word "development" really means. Do you think a game is started with a complete vision of the end game in it's entirety? I mean look at the development of halflife 2 and the countless hours spent on parts of the game...only for Valve to dump it all. Did that effect the end result? No, it's one of the best games ever made. What if HL2 was crowdfunded and valve showed a level being developed, people backed the game because of this level, then valve dumped it. Would we be saying valve were crappy liars? It's not that CiG are developing the game wrong, it's the fact that it's so open, warts and all.

Just because "8" happens doesn't necessarily mean it was caused by "4+4". it could be "2+4+2" or "6+2".

SC could easily fail, i don't think that will effect crowdfunding at all. The game maybe the biggest crowdfunded "thing" but it's failure won't be big news outside of space sim fan pages and tech pages. The importance of SC is not that high IMO. Then again I don't listen to the hype anyways.

also I thought it's a known thing that crowdfunding is a "risk" and there's no guarantee of an end product?

Sorry to disappoint your wrong notions. I don't care with how development is or should be. Who should care with that, is who is advertising the campaign. It's crowdfunding.
It comes with risk to the campaign's owner too. Specially if they mess things up.

https://www.ftc.gov/news-events/blogs/business-blog/2015/06/dont-let-crowdfunding-be-your-doom

Here’s what you or your business can learn from this case, so that crowdfunding does not become your “Doom:”

1-) Keep your promises when crowdfunding. If you promise rewards, give them. If you promise refunds, provide them.
2-) Use the money raised from crowdfunding only for the purpose represented. If you collect money for a specified project, like creating a board game, use the money only for that purpose. Don’t use it for personal purposes or to start another project.

Maybe now, having the minimum understanding of that, or maybe you can spend some time and check about consumer laws/advertising laws in United States (repeatedly ignored by Cloud Imperium Games and even disrespected in public speech of Chris Roberts), you will start to see some things that you claim not have seen yet.

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Not only Crowdfunding, as well Kickstarter. A thing people need to put on their heads when backing anything, is the risk that when you support any project

Misleading information not corroborated by the precedences already set by FTC and Washington State cases, and several public/official clarifications from FTC, all them based on basic consumer protection/advertising laws, that what is cover the matter, in the lack of a specific law for crowdfunding. The risk is indeed in who gives money, but its not like they don't have resources or that campaign owners have no risks too, of been hold accountable by consumers or gov. authorities by promises not fullfilled.

 

[MaxLexandre]

Nope. Your view is wrong.

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/cig/star-citizen/description

There is 1 or 2 paragraphs there who mention Squadron 42. All the rest is about the MMO side of the game.

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Nope. I was not saying anything like that. I am just saying that its an interesting paradigm. Specially for someone who claims to be transparent and "having nothing to hide". So, why to spend BACKERS money to hide from backers, if he has nothing to hide? By the way... Blizzard was not a company built with crowdfunded money to built a project. There is a different treatment that crowdfunded companies gets from consumer protection authorities due that. They can't spend backers money on es and cocaine (or pet movies, unrelated SC stuff, marketing) for example. Blizzard can spend the money of their pre-orders in how many es and cocaine that they prefer.

I was meaning, the original supporters of the game were more focused on the Wing Commander like Squadron 42, the MMO was the part of the game that expanded greatly towards the Crowdfund, and then it's all about the MMO. But honestly i'm still part of the group who wants SQ42 more than the MMO, for example, if they deliver SQ42, the money i put on it, is paid. The thing is, you can't buy SQ42 without buy the MMO as well, it's part of the same game.

First, who says they are spending backer money on that? You should be aware that CIG is not 100% backer money on its income, but independent of that, if they were to hire someone for such using company money, it would be backer money, that's obvious.

Side of that, you are again going on the conspiracy surrounding the money they spent on "es and drugs", Words are not Evidence, evidence is what you back your words with, and you sir, only have words to show for it.

 

[Mr.Nowak]

Star Citizen 1.3.0 goes to PTU. If you wonder what the PTU is.

What is the Public Test Universe ?

The PTU is a replica environment of all servers needed to operate the game and the platform. This environment exists to allow public testing phases of unreleased patches of the game and platform. This environment will be publicly available to players, but under our tight access control. This way we can, if we want, have an internal playtest of a patch in a release environment without needing to expose it to the public. https://robertsspaceindustries.com/faq/faq-ptu

Hi everyone!

We're excited to push 1.3.0 to PTU today for testing!

No downtime today since PTU is not up, and we expect to bring up the PTU servers around 3pm CDT/8pm GMT.

There's quite a lot of content in this one, both for Arena Commander and for Social Module. We'll have full Patch Notes later today, but in the meantime, here's a short preview of what you can expect!

PLEASE NOTE: This is only a small partial list of Patch Notes. We'll update this page with the link to the complete Patch Notes as soon as they're ready!

HANGAR

Additions/Balance/Tweaks/Fixes:

- The Greycat Buggy has received an appearance, animation and handling overhaul.
- The elevator to Area 18 will now show all available instances of ArcCorp, how many people are present in each one, and how many people from your contact list are present.
- There is now a "Loadout Selector" located in all player hangar's that will allow players to select what load out they will move around the Hangar and ArcCorp with.
- The Selfland Hangar is in the process of receiving a full relighting pass to improve the overall look and atmosphere. Not 100% implemented yet.
- Camera free-look can now be activated by "Shift+G".
- "Ctrl+F" is now the hotkey to disembark a ship.
- Fixed seating in Retaliator and Gladiator and visual shaking inside Vanduul Scythe.

ARENA COMMANDER

Additions/Balance/Tweaks/Fixes:

- The Behring C-788 Ballistic Cannon has been added to the game. This gun uses a S4 mount and fires at 2.2 shots per second.
- Size 4 fixed mounts for the Hornet and Cutlass Turrets have been added to accommodate the Ballistic Cannon.
- Apocalypse Arms WarSeries SZ4 Mass Driver has been added to the game. This gun uses a S2 mount and fires at 0.7 shots per second.
- Increased the health of all ships.
- Increased overall shield strength of all ships to reduce alpha damage and bring up survival.
- Missile damage has been increased slightly to keep pace with health and improve effectiveness.
- Missile lock time has been adjusted.
- Energy weapon velocities have been buffed across the board to be faster then ballistics. Our philosophy here is that as energy weapons do no damage until shields are down, it takes more hits by energy weapons to do real damage and accuracy is thus more important.
- Damage of energy weapons has been reduced slightly to compensate.
- Ballistic weapons have received a corresponding buff to their potential range so that they can potentially hit targets that are farther away.
- Plasma bolt range decreased by 30% for the Vanduul "Wrath" Plasma Cannon.
- Neutron bolt speed increased by 20% for the Vanduul "War" Neutron Cannon.
- Cutlass has received a minor tweak to its thruster gimbals to improve maneuverability.
- The following ships and all variants have received an update to their shield meshes and animations to better align with their ship models.
Avenger, Gladius, Mustang, Cutlass, Freelancer, 300 Series, M50, Gladiator, Glaive
- Increased the power draw of the M50's engine. Decreased the strength of the M50's power plant. These two changes are to ensure that the choice of mounting a weapon with high power drain vs one with low power drain on the m50 will have a meaningful affect on performance and speed.
- Interacting character animations have been updated for all flight-ready ships.
- "Look Ahead" mode is now turned on by default. It can be toggled on and off by "Right-ALT+M".
- Weapon Gimbal Lock is now "Left-CTRL+G".

- Fixed an issue where players would not be removed from Arena Commander for being idle unless all players in the match were idle.
- Fixed Tutorial - Chapter 3 where the missiles would sometimes not track the target correctly.
- Fixed an issue where weapons fire could appear offset from the weapon muzzle, when the ship was firing while moving.
- Fixed an issue where a ships target could be lost when increasing distance from target, despite target still being in sensor range.#
- Fixed an issue where projectiles fired from ship weapons would sometimes remain protruding out of the weapon they had been shot from causing damage or display issues.
- Fixed a black screen that would occur when joining a Lobby when GIM services are down.
- Added the ability for the Lobby to return an error if a client attempts to join while GIM is down.
- Fixed an issue where clients would sometimes get stuck on a loading screen, if they are connected to a instance that no longer exists.
- Fixed an issue where the client could black screen if the lobby service was not able to communicate with the instance manager.
- Fixed one lobby issue where the player Host would see a different map and rule for a match in the UI then the players would. This would happen when a host created a game, left, and entered or created a new lobby.

SOCIAL MODULE

Additions/Balance/Tweaks/Fixes:

- ArcCorp, Area 18 is expanding! The new Galleria area is currently under construction, but available for exploration.
- New emotes have been added to the game.
/agree, /angry(1-3), /attention, /blah(1-2), /bored (2), /bow(1-6), /burp, /cheer(1-8), /chicken, /clap (5-7 are new), /come(1-4), /cry, /dance(1-6), /disagree(1-3), /failure, /flex(1-3), /flirt, /gasp(1-5), /gloat(1-4), /greet, /laugh(1-3), /point(1-4), /rude(1-3), /salute(1-2), /sit, /sleep, /smell(1-2), /threaten(1-2), /wait(1-2), /wave(1-2), /whistle(1-2)
- The maximum character capacity for Area 18 has been increased to 36. The limit will expand up to 40, if you are attempting to join an instance with players from your contact list.
- Fully functional Greycat Buggies have been added around ArcCorp and include a functional passenger seat.
- The Greycat Buggies in ArcCorp can explode and be destroyed when they impact at high speed.
- Players will now be removed from Area 18 due to inactivity after 15 minutes. An inactivity warning will be displayed 1 minute prior to removal.
- Falling out of the terrain will now kill players, and revive them in the Area 18 Medical Unit.
- The chat UI has received a graphical overhaul. New features for the chat interface include multiple tabs for conversation management, private conversations, and a contacts list that can be extended or retracted into the UI.
- The new default hotkey for the contact list is now "F11".
- Augmented Reality has been moved to the "F10" hotkey.
- Fixed a number of texture conflicts and lighting bugs in ArcCorp.

Source: https://forums.robertsspaceindustries.com/discussion/290147/publishing-1-3-0-to-ptu

--

Also bad ass Racing gif.

http://gfycat.com/SentimentalCooperativeGermanspitz

 

[MaxLexandre]

Nope. I was not saying anything like that. I am just saying that its an interesting paradigm. Specially for someone who claims to be transparent and "having nothing to hide". So, why to spend BACKERS money to hide from backers, if he has nothing to hide? By the way... Blizzard was not a company built with crowdfunded money to built a project. There is a different treatment that crowdfunded companies gets from consumer protection authorities due that. They can't spend backers money on es and cocaine (or pet movies, unrelated SC stuff, marketing) for example. Blizzard can spend the money of their pre-orders in how many es and cocaine that they prefer.

CIG Promised to be Open Towards the Game Development of Star Citizen NOT Towards its own company Internal Affairs, what would not even be legal go public on things as HR, etc... And please stop going again on the conspiracy theories about money spent on "es and drugs", words are not evidence, evidence is what you back your words with, feel free of doing so.

Misleading information not corroborated by the precedences already set by FTC and Washington State cases, and several public/official clarifications from FTC, all them based on basic consumer protection/advertising laws, that what is cover the matter, in the lack of a specific law for crowdfunding. The risk is indeed in who gives money, but its not like they don't have resources or that campaign owners have no risks too, of been hold accountable by consumers or gov. authorities by promises not fullfilled.

Sorry but that is untrue. One thing is LIE, promise something that you know you WON'T be delivering (that would be a scam). Another thing is FAIL to deliver it while trying to do so, or not reaching the level of expectations for its promise. Star Citizen is developing their promises, almost 300 Employees are not working every day on something that "doesn't exist". FTC would have reasons to investigate if they weren't working to deliver those promises, or working on something that is not what was advertised.

Also, Game Delays are not reasons to do so, it's just part of what happens on the Industry, if AAA titles by EA/Ubisoft, etc... have titles that faced delays of over 1 year (even after selling pre-orders, etc...), wouldn't make a Crowdfunded project immune to the same problems. And as long they Do and Are offering refunds to who isn't willing to accept the delays... that's where the scam claims fall to the ground.

 

[jcrg99]

For those commenting about the Kate vs. Derek drama, the issue is settled:

https://twitter.com/katerussell/status/654352583931371520

 

[Stigbob]

Wait, what...I know you, you're all over twitter, MMORPG.com, MOP, and Reddit and you're one of those conspiracy fanatics that trashes Chris Roberts and CIG in everything you say. It's like you have some kind of weird fetish on this topic. You spout off unfounded facts as if they are facts. It's quite unhealthy I would think to pursue something as you do - in the manner you do.

Also, I back CIG and Elite: Dangerous. Both these games are going to be awesome once they are finally complete. We gamers need people like Chris Roberts and David Braben to push the boundaries of game development. So I'll continue to support them - both.

This jcrg99 guy goes around various forums and Twitter posting rumors and innuendo as if they are facts. He is totally fixated on Chris Roberts and CIG. Also, if he doesn't think most major corps don't have someone keeping an eye on their employees - just proves my point.

This sort of cultist rubbish spouted against the unbelievers is normal over on the RSI forum, it really doesn't help convince me that SC's anything other than vaporware when it's supporters get so personal.

It does make me suspect the community over there may be toxic, which is another reason to wait and see what happens before parting with any cash.

 

[Leper Messiah]

Sorry to disappoint your wrong notions. I don't care with how development is or should be. Who should care with that, is who is advertising the campaign. It's crowdfunding.
It comes with risk to the campaign's owner too. Specially if they mess things up.

https://www.ftc.gov/news-events/blogs/business-blog/2015/06/dont-let-crowdfunding-be-your-doom

Here’s what you or your business can learn from this case, so that crowdfunding does not become your “Doom:”

1-) Keep your promises when crowdfunding. If you promise rewards, give them. If you promise refunds, provide them.
2-) Use the money raised from crowdfunding only for the purpose represented. If you collect money for a specified project, like creating a board game, use the money only for that purpose. Don’t use it for personal purposes or to start another project.

Maybe now, having the minimum understanding of that, or maybe you can spend some time and check about consumer laws/advertising laws in United States (repeatedly ignored by Cloud Imperium Games and even disrespected in public speech of Chris Roberts), you will start to see some things that you claim not have seen yet.

Ummmm, yeah I checked that link and it bears no resemblance AT ALL to what is happening with SC. It is abundantly clear that a massive amount of money is being spent on the game, there's massive studios full of staff working on the game. Yeah the exact figures arn't known but IMO there's very little evidence of actually mass fraud going on.

Your posts are coming across as of a certain type so I think it's best for everyone that I refuse to engage you further.

 

[Toumal]

Star Citizen 1.3.0 goes to PTU. If you wonder what the PTU is.

Mr.Novak, just for the record: I appreciate that you're posting these summaries. I don't frequent the RSI forums anymore myself and this is really convenient for me to keep track of things. Thank you.

 

[Mr.Nowak]

Mr.Novak, just for the record: I appreciate that you're posting these summaries. I don't frequent the RSI forums anymore myself and this is really convenient for me to keep track of things. Thank you.

No worries. I am here not just to discuss but to share information as well. There is a lot going out from Star Citizen. I really care that we have space sims that are informed of each other. For example I follow Limit Theory, Eve Online, E: D too. This is the genre I am extra passionate about.

I am so excited about HORIZONS!!!

--

Update on Alpha Access, Arena Commander Pass and UEC

Hey all,

So, in yesterday's Letter from the Chairman, Chris announced that we're removing access passes and that all backers of Star Citizen with game packages will have access to all aspects of Star Citizen going forward.

With that in mind, I wanted to issue a few clarifications to what was said there.

1) Dedicated Alpha and Beta Access is going away. If you have a game package, you get to play Star Citizen in every stage of development, including Alpha and Beta.

2) Those folks with Alpha Access on their game packages will be awarded 10,000 UEC for each game package you own.

3) Those folks who purchased a $5 Arena Commander Pass will NOT be getting 5000 UEC for that pass, but will instead have that pass automatically exchanged for $5 in store credit, that you can spend on UEC or anything else you'd prefer in Star Citizen.

4) There will be a permanent raise on the UEC cap of 10k to accommodate most of this.

5) For those of you with many game packages and/or lots of stored UEC, you may go over the cap raise to accommodate your increasing wealth, but you will not be able to purchase additional UEC until you have spent the excess and dropped below the new cap.

Thanks everyone,

DL

Source: https://forums.robertsspaceindustries.com/discussion/290152

--

Also neat 2D Star Citizen political map. Damn the Vanduul are too close to SOL! Hope we push them back in Squadron 42 at least up to Orion.

Spoiler

 

[MaxLexandre]

This sort of cultist rubbish spouted against the unbelievers is normal over on the RSI forum, it really doesn't help convince me that SC's anything other than vaporware when it's supporters get so personal.

It does make me suspect the community over there may be toxic, which is another reason to wait and see what happens before parting with any cash.

The community isn't toxic, you have more "extreme" fans of a game, on any game you may look on, even here on Elite, they do not represent the majority of the communtiy. What insults the backers here is when Smart and others point at one person and say "Oh look at those deluded cultists" putting the whole of the community on the same "box" so then, everyone who doesn't agrees with his/their view of things can be ignored and made fun of on everything they do/say.

On this case, we're talking about someone who is since LAST YEAR dedicated to attack the project on any possible way he can, never showing evidence of arguments to backup his claims, it's pretty much "I'm the word of God, deal with it.", when someone enters a discussion with that attitude, there can't be a discussion. Like when someone counter-arguments a point he makes and he just resorts to call you a "fanboy" or "cultist" to not reply your concrete points, yup. I mean at least, that was my experience.

 

[Voivod]

No worries. I am here not just to discuss but to share information as well. There is a lot going out from Star Citizen. I really care that we have space sims that are informed of each other. For example I follow Limit Theory, Eve Online, E: D too. This is the genre I am extra passionate about.

I am so excited about HORIZONS!!!

Just out of interest.. do you also post as zealous for ED on the SC forums as you do for SC over here?

I don't think I've ever seen a post of yours in the ED thread in the SC forums.

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The community isn't toxic, you have more "extreme" fans of a game, on any game you may look on, even here on Elite, they do not represent the majority of the communtiy. What insults the backers here is when Smart and others point at one person and say "Oh look at those deluded cultists" putting the whole of the community on the same "box" so then, everyone who doesn't agrees with his/their view of things can be ignored and made fun of on everything they do/say.

On this case, we're talking about someone who is since LAST YEAR dedicated to attack the project on any possible way he can, never showing evidence of arguments to backup his claims, it's pretty much "I'm the word of God, deal with it.", when someone enters a discussion with that attitude, there can't be a discussion. Like when someone counter-arguments a point he makes and he just resorts to call you a "fanboy" or "cultist" to not reply your concrete points, yup. I mean at least, that was my experience.

SC fans were very aggressive long before DS came along.
Just go to the SC forums and find some of the first posts critisizing AC flight mechanics.
The subreddit was better in the beginning but since the DS drama, it has also started going downhill as far as fans vs critics is concerned.

It probably has to do with so many people being critical of the project. Fans overreact to overacting critics and vice versa.

I've never seen so much vitriol as far as a game is concerned and I was playing EvE for years and years.

 

[jcrg99]

On this case, we're talking about someone who is since LAST YEAR dedicated to attack the project on any possible way he can, never showing evidence of arguments to backup his claims, it's pretty much "I'm the word of God, deal with it.", when someone enters a discussion with that attitude, there can't be a discussion. Like when someone counter-arguments a point he makes and he just resorts to call you a "fanboy" or "cultist" to not reply your concrete points, yup. I mean at least, that was my experience.

Care to give an example of for what I did not show evidence to backup claims (sometimes you don't need, since its opinion, but I am pretty sure that I brought many evidences about matters that I discussed, ad nauseum), or when I said that "I am God, deal with it", or anything similar, or when you brought any "counter-argument" that I should consider valid enough to change my mind, or any "concrete point" that you brought in any discussion that I ignored? Definitely I never would dismiss a concrete point, a valid argument, replying with a "you are fanboy", "you are a cultist", but with arguments instead. That its just not me. Are you confusing me with some Star Citizen fanboy? Because you are describing their attitude here, not mine.

I mean... "You are hater" or "You this, you that", is not really a concrete point or valid argument that would make me convinced of anything. So, here, you seem in denial, if you don't believe that you are just behaving like people who is called toxic, as referred by the guy, when getting too personal, with comments/critics that are made to the project.

I am a very reasonable guy but not really the type that is convinced by personal offenses or arguments that are just "marketing speech". Give me something to work here, instead just your witch-hunt/sensationalist campaign. Or just move on? I mean. This topic is not about me, if you have an issue with me, let's solve it or clarify it in private messages? Otherwise, I will have to report you for harassment and trolling.

Thank you in advance for your comprehesion.