We are what we pretend to be... Really?

Bran Tse Mallory

Bran Tse Mallory
Welcome CMDR's!

Time to put a torch to the fire and light the flames of debate once more...

We see a lot of threads regarding the whole PvP v PvE debate, players getting killed while others combat log - you get the picture. A typical response that comes up regularly in these types of thread is to do with role playing a psycho or killer. Morals shouldn't hinder you in a video game is another along with the all encompassing its only a game.

Many studies have shown there is no link between violent video games and violence in the real world and that is not what I want to look at in this thread, it's how it reflects on you as a real person living in the real world. You see, no matter how much we try to trick ourselves into thinking we are role playing we are still the human being we were before we sat down to play.

To this end I looked up a study that I had read a couple of years ago as I think it pointed out some very relevant research to be considered when playing Elite and in fact many other games. I couldn't find the whole study but at least found the summary.

You can find the article here:- http://now.dartmouth.edu/2014/08/new-study-video-games-and-teens-behavior
Full report is here:- https://www.apa.org/pubs/journals/releases/ppm-1-4-244.pdf

It is only one page and I would appreciate it if you are going to reply to this thread please take the time to read the document.

I am interested in your thoughts on this as Elite is a game that crosses a large age range of players, as such many of us are possibly quite set in our ways and would like to think nothing can change us... or can it?

As always keep it clean and fun!


EDIT: Sorry I could not find the full study which is almost 300 pages long. The second link is to a PDF which has a detailed summary of the data sets used and the criteria for collection as well as the conclusion.

I make no claim that this in anyway a definitive study nor is it a slant on any ones play style.
 
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digitalscream

Banned
D
Well...I know that I have mild sociopathic tendencies, and I sit slightly north of "normal" on the autism spectrum, so it's possible that's influenced my style of play somewhat.

As it is, my character started off as a fairly innocent trader and fell into alignment with the Empire's ideals pretty quickly. After spending a lot of time with ALD and trying to root out the corrupt, he became disillusioned with the political structure and came to the conclusion that the desperate pursuit of power was causing far too much destruction and now actively hunts down anybody involved in Power Play. He's not a good man, and has no place in a better galaxy, but he's content to work to get there.

What comes next? I have no idea. We'll see where the galaxy takes him.

My point? Normally I play good guys in all games. It's quite interesting to be able to give my character a story without restriction or the usual "white hat" ideals. It's most definitely a role, but it's probably not something I'd ever entertain doing in real life even if given the opportunity.
 

Riktar

Riktar
I think any teenager who does not have proper support from his or her family might be affected by the video game they play.

I would like to know if the study took into account the family background of the subjects.

At my age (WAAAY closer to 60 than 50) the game has absolutely no effect on who I am as a person.

As to the rest: Does the game change who they are? or does it allow them to become what they would be without consequences?

No idea on that one.
 
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Jex =TE=

Banned
J
I question these articles, especially when they can't even link their own study. What was their methodology? When it comes to playing games, if I am playing a FPS and go around murdering the opposite team I do not then think about going out to do anything violent. If I RP a murdering space prate, that is not going to reflect on reality. With a brain I can distinguish between a game and real life. Maybe some people out there can't but I would suspect that without video games, they might get into real trouble whereas video games might placate them.

I'd never go and blast someone to smithereens in reality, if I did have a space ship though in ED I might give it a go. Separating a virtual life to a real life is obvious and if you aren't able to do that, you are crazy and need to seek help.
 

CharlusMagnus

C
I find this study doubtful, if it was slightly serious, it would have shown the good side of video games (thinking process, ability to learn things faster, social interactions (yes, yes), strategy, relaxation effect etc...) and not just "video games are bad and if your kid plays he'll not only fail in our glorious society but also become a junkie with HIV and personality troubles"....

Behavior comes from perception. If people perceives the game they play as another perception of their reality and do it too often, of course it will change the way they behave. As would do watching too many horror movies or reading too many studies from people who claim themselves to be experts...

Everything around us can change our way of behaving, sometimes we choose, sometimes not but regarding video games and a big majority of other stuff, the key to stay yourself is to find balance between all activities and therefore, find balance in your life.

Amen & Fly safe
 

John Xenir

John Xenir
I always take any articles like that with a pinch of salt, at the minimum.

It's clear that different people are differently susceptible to suggestion.
Taking above into consideration, IMHO no research can be flagged opinion-worthy until influence of game on one's personality is measured over time, with psychological evaluation not only focusing on "after", but also on "before".
In other words, determining how susceptible to suggestion the patient is BEFORE exposed to 3-4 years of playing brutal games, is more than important, and should precede studying the effects of brutal games exposure.

Without that, the image is incomplete and simply cannot be treated as representative.

I have been exposed to brutal games my entire life.
And yet I find it hard to role-play brutal, ruthless characters (never had Mass Effect 3 clearly bad character, always found choosing ass-hat responses leaving bad taste in my mouth).
And yet I find real-life violence unacceptable, and even when attacked, I try to minimize my self-defense to the least necessary use of violence in return. And even then, I feel guilty I actually kicked someone's ass.
I am who I am, and my conscious is what it is, I can't change that.

How dose that stack up in regards to article?
Just like I said: these studies should analyze one's psyche before long-time exposure to brutal games, and evaluate them equally thoroughly afterwards.
 

Apos

Apos
I don't know, as a D&D player, I really don't see how a session is complete without having "that guy" who is a d to everyone and punches you as soon as you try to take away his ale and sausages at the tavern.
 

gravedodger

gravedodger
Like most you here I'm a big sci-fi fan and Elite opens the door to me role-playing a space traveling character ... in essence that's all i really need, a spaceship and galaxy to fly around and do things, the doing things can sometimes become an arguing point that some player says there's not enough, maybe they're right and I would not say no to more content and depth being added to the game but all in all I can still survive and enjoy the game as it is because I have a very good, visual imagination, I can melt into the Elite Cmdr role-play easily and entertain myself.

It's a win win for me each time I play Elite, yes there are some things I'd like to see changed but they're not game-breaking to my role-playing enjoyment.
I enjoy it so much I bought a second account to start from scratch with a friend (my first account is for deep space exploring)
 

lysan

lysan
I like role playing, but that is what it is, role playing. Normally I'm pretty much a dull person who do dull stuff.

I use to live a hectic life, however I'm old now and do not have the time nor the option to do a lot of the crazy stuff I did when I was younger :D

I do not like to be an psychotic personality in the games I play, as that is not something I can even in a distant way relate to.
 

Bran Tse Mallory

Bran Tse Mallory
Sentenza said:
I'm old enough to have seen attempts to link "violent behaviors" to literally anything from hard rock to comics, depending on the "thinking fashion" of the time. I have a definition for all this: .
Click to expand...

While I agree with you what struck me about this is that it is not looking for violent behavior as in going out and mugging people but more at the subtle changes that can be bought about by the games we play.

In no way do I think that shooting people in GTA will encourage me or anyone else to pick up a gun and go on a killing spree however the game reinforces reckless behavior. To me what this study is trying to show is that this could (not will) lead to more reckless choices being made in the real world.

Jex =TE= said:
Where's the data for the people they tested that didn't play video games, is that on this exert? I'd like to see what non-video gamers are getting up to with their drinking, driving and sex habits.
Click to expand...

I think the data you are looking for can be found on a particular well known (Cough)Hub ;)
 
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The Tick

The Tick
First of all, rep to you for bringing up the first real meta discussion about ED in the forum for ages. I like it when my thinking gets challenged now and then!

I have to admit that, after countless Robigo smuggling runs, my commute time is reduced significantly with me driving at insane speed into my hometown to avoid being scanned by the police ;-).

Joke aside, luckily the ED setting is so far from real life that I don't expect any major consequences to player's behaviour. However, on a more abstract level, social behaviour like egoism vs altruism might be more easily affected. We had a wonderful example on these forums last night. A CMDR who is on the Distant Worlds Expedition roster reported that, although suffering from Asperger's, the positive online interaction with other CMDRs made him more confident with people also in real life.
This and many other examples (charity events, players donating a game license to less well off players, Hutton Truckers PwP, not-for-profit radio stations, the DW expedition) make me proud of this (in most parts :) ) wonderful community. It seems as if altruistic behaviour propagates itself when present above a certain level.
Let's contribute actively to it staying like this! I have seen the opposite (= vicious circle of sociopathic behaviour) in other places, and we don't want to see that in this game.
 

Marra Morgan

Marra Morgan
My character Marra is a deeply-flawed, drug-addled criminal with severe daddy-issues!
If you like fanfic, please click on my sig and have a read of her diaries on INARA; they are dark with a good smattering of drug-abuse and naughty words, so give it a miss if those things offend you! :)

I can thankfully say that I'm nothing like her. I'm fortunate enough to have had a good upbringing and I have lots of love and respect in my life. The fiction I write about my character is based loosely on what I do in the game - however, when I interact with other players, I am doing so as me, the player, not Marra the fictional character (I don't think I'd make many friends if I did!). I think I have a healthy separation of fiction and reality - I am not my character, but I enjoy the challenges that writing from her point-of-view presents.

It's similar to why actors like the challenge of playing villainous roles; you are exploring parts of the human psyche that you wouldn't ever entertain for real, but doing so in a safe environment. I hope that makes sense? I'm not going to claim to speak for anyone else, this is just how I see things.
 
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Gidio

Gidio
This is the same thinking as "Listening to rock music will make my child worship the devil and drink the blood of the innocent"

The sentiment has always been brought up by the older generation to explain why the new thing is bad because "think of the children".
If it wasn't the radio, it was the television, if it wasn't the television, it was videogames, now it's not videogames anymore, it's smartphones.

Some people are afraid of change, and because of that the try to ruin innovation for everybody (kind of the subtext to a large part of the ED community)
 
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Riktar

Riktar
Bran Tse Mallory said:
While I agree with you what struck me about this is that it is not looking for violent behavior as in going out and mugging people but more at the subtle changes that can be bought about by the games we play.

In no way do I think that shooting people in GTA will encourage me or anyone else to pick up a gun and go on a killing spree however the game reinforces reckless behavior. To me what this study is trying to show is that this could (not will) lead to more reckless choices being made in the real world.
Click to expand...

As I stated/questioned above: ANYONE who does not have good family support/values will (playing the percentages) develop less than good habits. The ONLY thing a video game might do is get them their quicker.
 

Sentenza

Sentenza
Bran Tse Mallory said:
While I agree with you what struck me about this is that it is not looking for violent behavior as in going out and mugging people but more at the subtle changes that can be bought about by the games we play.

In no way do I think that shooting people in GTA will encourage me or anyone else to pick up a gun and go on a killing spree however the game reinforces reckless behavior. To me what this study is trying to show is that this could (not will) lead to more reckless choices being made in the real world.
Click to expand...

Well, studies also link increased reckless behavior to passive protections (seriously), so let's ban helmets, seat belts and crash cells :)
 
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