What went wrong with Elite Dangerous

[frostypaw]

I never wanted Elite to be EVE, that's why I'm playing Elite in the first place. To get away from the "click in space" mechanics of EVE.

You have been missing the point though: People want more content. They want to find an abandoned pirate station in middle of space. They want to see stations built in asteroids. They want -variety- (Stuff like Freelancer had, man I love that game! )

I know it's not gonna be added just in a week. I've made few games of my own and I'm making another project right now, and it's taking LOTS of time.

It seems most of the people in that thread are feeling "deceived." They expected more than the game had to offer.

The first impressions didn't come out in the right way, and people are biased because of that. I'm not blaming anyone for that.

And the "what went wrong with X?" is a common title in that subreddit, but I understand if you didn't know this. Yes, very sensationalist, I don't really like that subreddit personally because of that.

But those things ARE in game.

But unlike Freelancer or the upcoming SC it's not a handful of locations and one player so you can go find each of these things yourself - it's a shared galaxy and Only One Person will encounter the Thargoids first.... probably. Maybe one very scared wing. But either way the space hulks of the Generation Ships or the lost colonies or any escaped AI's are going to have to be hard to find - there are thousands looking for them with thousands of systems visited each day. To make enough unique and interesting for you personally to be finding stuff all the time the galaxy would be littered like a child's playpen.

Just how many individually hand-crafted environments did you want - and are you actually genuinely willing to pay for them?

 

[Axel Deathrage]

Just how many individually hand-crafted environments did you want - and are you actually genuinely willing to pay for them?

Many, and yes.

But this isn't about me: It's about the people in the thread. They don't know these things you said.

I never said that I personally need everything right here right now.

Edit: I'm adding this here so people know: I love this game. I really do. I want to see it thrive, I want to learn the mystery of barnacles, I love it. These posts I've made here are really about me trying to tell people here, what the reddit-folk have been thinking about the game. I just tried to be a messenger, that's all.

 

[TomP]

Oh brother.

 

[tafkabb]

Am I playing the same game as you lot? I'm going to bed at 1am on a Sunday night because, in Elite, I simply have so much to do.

 

[TomP]

Am I playing the same game as you lot? I'm going to bed at 1am on a Sunday night because, in Elite, I simply have so much to do.

Yeah, you and me both. But clearly we are stupid. It says so on the Internet.

 

[deckroid]

All snarky-Ness aside, I don't think anything went wrong. I point your attention to a critically acclaimed book, The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Universe.

Space," it says, "is big. Really big. You just won't believe how vastly, hugely, mindbogglingly big it is. I mean, you may think it's a long way down the road to the chemist's, but that's just peanuts to space, listen...

Now, I don't know about you, but I bought this game knowing full well what I was getting myself into: a 10 year project that encompasses 400 billion visitable star systems on a 1:1 ratio. Freelancer, Freespace, SC or EVE and so on don't have this kind of scope. NMS is the closest thing and it still not out.

While a lifeless universe isnt ideal, it has been a LONG dry spell for a space flight Sim that isn't point n click.

As Angry Joe once said, This is a Joyyyyy.... Sssstick....

Again, I like my game. It suits me. You don't like it? I'm sorry. There are other games out there.

 

[DaveB]

Ultimately we're all different and want different things from the games we play, often different things at different times. For some folks the presence or absence of a particular feature set is a deal-breaker and they either don;t buy the game or quit playing it. For one friend of mine the nerfed yaw axis in the flight model was the "one thing" he couldn't tolerate and made him quit the game. He and folks like him, who do quit the game tend to not post repeatedly on the forums, they walk away and play something else and that's fine.

Most of the folks posting criticism threads it hasn't risen to the level of a deal-breaker for them, they still enjoy playing it but they miss features from other games they've played. So they ask for them. This is, in itself, not unreasonable but all too often the feature they miss has at least the potential for turning ED into something that's only recognizable as a game in the Elite series by the shape of the coriolis stations and ship type names.

It's also unsurprising that lots of the folks suggesting ED include features from other games are drawing from EvE. Pretty much all of us that played any of the earlier Elite games have spent at least some time playing EvE after all. However, the EvE community has one feature that makes them more vocal on these forums. They are very used to the forum metagame. You want EvE-style corps? Start by suggesting "better social tools" or "proper clan features". You want to be able to control territory? You're going to be one of the most vehement opponents of mode switching and instancing because that's the fundamental game feature that means you can't. At the very least you're going to want a predictable entry point to every system so that you have choke points you can camp. Once FD start listening, the theory goes, you make the next incremental suggestion to keep the games development slanting in the direction you want.

There are way fewer folks playing this metagame now than there were in the earlier days - at least in terms of the number of active forum posters. However we did get a lot of it back then and that is why suggesting features from EvE tends to get a rather robust response. We're not letting that camels nose into the tent.

 

[Roberto]

Yeah, you and me both. But clearly we are stupid. It says so on the Internet.

Same here. Today I managed to fit in some smuggling, bounty hunting, exploring, some unexpected PvP (got my *** handed to me, but the odds were against me, and I learnt something!) and a fair bit of chat with other CMDRs (including the PvP guy). Also bought a skin for my new Cobra.

To paraphrase Max Bialystock, where did they go right?!

 

[lysan]

All snarky-Ness aside, I don't think anything went wrong. I point your attention to a critically acclaimed book, The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Universe.

Space," it says, "is big. Really big. You just won't believe how vastly, hugely, mindbogglingly big it is. I mean, you may think it's a long way down the road to the chemist's, but that's just peanuts to space, listen...

Now, I don't know about you, but I bought this game knowing full well what I was getting myself into: a 10 year project that encompasses 400 billion visitable star systems on a 1:1 ratio. Freelancer, Freespace, SC or EVE and so on don't have this kind of scope. NMS is the closest thing and it still not out.

While a lifeless universe isnt ideal, it has been a LONG dry spell for a space flight Sim that isn't point n click.

As Angry Joe once said, This is a Joyyyyy.... Sssstick....

Again, I like my game. It suits me. You don't like it? I'm sorry. There are other games out there.

I would just make a short note regarding NMS, and that is that yes its PG, billions of stars, however they are not made like in ED.
Here we have something unique. A 1:1 simulation of our milky way galaxy. With 160.000 know stars plotted in. You can see all the constellations in the night sky, and you can travel to every star you see out there. The whole thing is made with science as a guide of reference. To me that is a heck of a differences and I like it that way.

 

[Cyrgon]

I did read it. That's why I said "a lot" and not "all", because a lot of it IS eve players whining that it's not eve. And what sort of response do you expect when a thread is started by a player known for whining that ed isn't eve and demanding eve-esque features be added "or the game.will be doomed", and who titles provocativley "what went wrong with ed", and simply links to an "it's not eve" rant on reddit? At what point do eve players accept that it's a different game and is gonna remain that way? Not coz I say so, not coz the majority of players want it that way, but because fdev want it that way and have always said it was gonna be that way.

Elite aint Eve, and that's just fine.

+1 rep for telling it like it is without sugarcoating.

 

[Vasious]

Seems a lot of it is that it isn't a 4x game with Industry, and fleets and such
but it was never that so, I guess it is kinda like saying the problem with Call of Duty is a lack of Large scale War economy simulation, needs more HoI 4 like features

 

[frostypaw]

Many, and yes.

But this isn't about me: It's about the people in the thread. They don't know these things you said.

I never said that I personally need everything right here right now.

Edit: I'm adding this here so people know: I love this game. I really do. I want to see it thrive, I want to learn the mystery of barnacles, I love it. These posts I've made here are really about me trying to tell people here, what the reddit-folk have been thinking about the game. I just tried to be a messenger, that's all.

You did it very well! Sorry if I got the wrong end, please don't feel bad

I think you've hit on something that really bugs me though - these detractors put people off unfairly. The top Steam reviews are a total case in point. They focus mostly on what it's not, or the things they can't get their heads around (scale mostly) and cracking jokes about a few missions where they can't find people. It makes me kinda sad

 

[Sandmann]

I never wanted Elite to be EVE, that's why I'm playing Elite in the first place. To get away from the "click in space" mechanics of EVE.

You have been missing the point though: People want more content. They want to find an abandoned pirate station in middle of space. They want to see stations built in asteroids. They want -variety- (Stuff like Freelancer had, man I love that game! )

I think you're the one missing the point here. -I- want more content too. But breaking the game by turning it into eve with cockpits isn't good content. More content = good, but keep it "man in a spaceship content", not fleet management, raids, player owned space, spreadsheets, and management content. That's a whole 'nother, non-elite type game.

 

[R3DB3RD]

I read a lot of people whinging. Constructive criticism? No not really. Just a lot of whinging.

Hey, want to play chess with me.

Yeah sure, is it like Monopoly?

No it's chess.

Pieces on the board, coloured squares, move stuff around, it's like monopoly right.

No, it's chess.

Ok, so I'll move this here and I'll do that there, where's the community chest cards?

There aren't any, it's chess.

Omfg... Ok, can I get a get out of jail free card?

Well there's no jail, so no card, it's chess

   ..   ! I'm seriously, where's the dice?

There aren't any, take turns, one move.

Oh really! That's absurd... Stupid ducking game, how about we change this and change that and draw this in there and add some dice.

No. It's chess. If you don't want to play chess, go over there, they are playing monopoly...

No but I want to play chess omg it's so awesome... If we just do this and do that and stick that on there and colour this in and add that and it will be ducking awesome...

*sigh*

 

[Axel Deathrage]

I think you're the one missing the point here. -I- want more content too. But breaking the game by turning it into eve with cockpits isn't good content. More content = good, but keep it "man in a spaceship content", not fleet management, raids, player owned space, spreadsheets, and management content. That's a whole 'nother, non-elite type game.

Then I'm sorry, I actually did miss your point, I thought you were against everything in the thread, such as group chat or group tags.

I -personally- don't need fleet management, raids etc. etc. either. Man in spaceship content is fine by me! But I personally wouldn't also mind if fleet management would be added in game. I just wouldn't use it.

 

[diddycarter]

The thing with Ed is that you can interact with the galaxy in only 3 ways. Shoot stuff, Scoop stuff, buy and sell stuff. This is really on point considering when the barnacles where first discovered, what did we do? We shot it , scooped it up and sold it in a station. That's it. I really hope for FD sake that we are patient enough for them to add Space legs cause i swear if next season isn't space legs i will not be returning to this game. I am still excited for the rest of horizons but then i also realized that no matter what they add, we will still be only able to interact with the galaxy in just that 3 ways.

Exploration in this game is basically a loading screen simulator. Trading is well...trading. Then you come to combat which is probably the best thing going for this game. I am just tired of the combat logging cause of the hprrible network model and then i'm bored of shooting npcs. We really need space legs asap. I really like this game and want it to succeed.

 

[frostypaw]

That's it. I really hope for FD sake that we are patient enough for them to add Space legs cause i swear if next season isn't space legs i will not be returning to this game.

What is it you imagine you will be able to do that will completely change the game for you?

ps. you forgot scanned it

 

[Sandmann]

Then I'm sorry, I actually did miss your point, I thought you were against everything in the thread, such as group chat or group tags.

I -personally- don't need fleet management, raids etc. etc. either. Man in spaceship content is fine by me! But I personally wouldn't also mind if fleet management would be added in game. I just wouldn't use it.

Group tags would annoy me, but that's just because I'm a grumpy old fart. Having some sort of geoup identifier would be fine, I just don't want to put up with seeing Cmdr SpaceL0rd[DukezOfAllYorBaseAreBel0ngToMe] etc flying around. Put it in the contact info or somewhere like that. Group chat... yeah sure... within the context of the space you're in... or your wing.

The problem with fleet management etc (as Braben said many times) is it takes you out of the cockpit and into a spreadsheet. It also would then require an npc equivalent or suddenly you've got open-only content. It's also technically problematic with ED's current networking and instancing.

 

[lysan]

I read a lot of people whinging. Constructive criticism? No not really. Just a lot of whinging.

Hey, want to play chess with me.

Yeah sure, is it like Monopoly?

No it's chess.

Pieces on the board, coloured squares, move stuff around, it's like monopoly right.

No, it's chess.

Ok, so I'll move this here and I'll do that there, where's the community chest cards?

There aren't any, it's chess.

Omfg... Ok, can I get a get out of jail free card?

Well there's no jail, so no card, it's chess

   ..   ! I'm seriously, where's the dice?

There aren't any, take turns, one move.

Oh really! That's absurd... Stupid ducking game, how about we change this and change that and draw this in there and add some dice.

No. It's chess. If you don't want to play chess, go over there, they are playing monopoly...

No but I want to play chess omg it's so awesome... If we just do this and do that and stick that on there and colour this in and add that and it will be ducking awesome...

*sigh*

Can't rep you more need to spread around, so here are some visual REP +1

 

[Sandmann]

The thing with Ed is that you can interact with the galaxy in only 3 ways. Shoot stuff, Scoop stuff, buy and sell stuff. This is really on point considering when the barnacles where first discovered, what did we do? We shot it , scooped it up and sold it in a station. That's it.

This was my main critisism of Horizons actually... that the planetary game was just a repeat of the space game in a buggy instead of a ship, and that all it does is allow you to shoot it, scoop it, or sell it on a planet. It doesn't actually add any new content, just a new place to do the same old three things. Admitedly, the driving game is about as much fun as the flying game... both have fun moments and a learning curve followed by long periods of "are we there yet?". I'm hoping atmospheric planets and "space legs" will fill in the gaps... but I've learned to moderate my levels of FDev-based hope.