Am I the only one who hates crafting?
- Thread starter CMDR Cosmic Spacehead
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I'm only against the way that it's been implemented.
The way I see it, you're either crafting, or you're not. In Minecraft, or even Fallout 4, you gather the materials, and if you have the skill, you craft it. Not something that looks like it, or is kind of like it, you craft it.
In Elite, you go talk to the 'engineer' who's going to try and do it for you, then you gather the materials, and then they might get it done for you, or they might ruin it trying. [wacky]
If I don't like the odds of my time being spent doing something I don't want to do in the first place, to getting what I want, forget about it.
Grind to goal is one thing, grind to gamble on goal is another.
Anyway, that's my personal criticism, and I'm not asking for the process to be changed or altered on my behalf. I'm just not going to do it. I think it's fair to share why I won't be participating.
The way I see it, you're either crafting, or you're not. In Minecraft, or even Fallout 4, you gather the materials, and if you have the skill, you craft it. Not something that looks like it, or is kind of like it, you craft it.
In Elite, you go talk to the 'engineer' who's going to try and do it for you, then you gather the materials, and then they might get it done for you, or they might ruin it trying. [wacky]
If I don't like the odds of my time being spent doing something I don't want to do in the first place, to getting what I want, forget about it.
Grind to goal is one thing, grind to gamble on goal is another.
Anyway, that's my personal criticism, and I'm not asking for the process to be changed or altered on my behalf. I'm just not going to do it. I think it's fair to share why I won't be participating.
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Jane Turner
Volunteer Moderator
I've not gone for any significant engineers mods yet, but am collecting bits and pieces and storing them in my second account.
Having way too much fun in a souped up eagle to worry about grinding for anything
Having way too much fun in a souped up eagle to worry about grinding for anything
![[DOOK] Droogie](https://forums-cdn.zaonce.net/data/avatars/m/124/124078.jpg?1553527149){kind=avatar}
Not a good solution. Upgrading your ship is a great concept and I love the idea of customizing.
This system we have for doing it is extremely clunky, grindy, and isn't very intuitive. It's another power play.
It is a much better solution to ask them to fix the issues it has. We paid extra for this.
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That's what people said about power play. How's that working out?
That's what people said about CQC. How's that working out?
We'll end up with a bunch of major patches that a small minority of the players engage in with a huge majority of Dev time sunk into like has happened so far. I bought a season pass for a game still in development so I care where Dev time is spent and how the product I've paid for comes out.
What people DO like to do is make money and upgrade their ships...I would have enjoyed simply adding all the special effects/weapons/modules as new modules themselves purchased by Cr, and have engineers upgrades have no RNG...just guaranteed upgrade some part of a module a small amount with a max number of upgrades per module. It's simple, easy, and fun.
This ridiculous number of materials behind a wall of RNG after RNG to get the upgrade you want is a terribly unfun crafting system.
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I don't do any crafting in any game that has it. I've never seen the attraction of finding x number of crushed dragons balls to enable me to make a super special set of armour, sword or mega health potion...
It does make me wonder what FD's plan is with ED. I don't seem to remember anyone asking for engineers, crafting or powerplay. Yet we got engineers, crafting and powerplay... But the stuff that players have been asking for for ages (more missions types, storage, more than one commander slot, more things to do on planets, ability to walk about in ships/stations, etc) seems to be constantly on the "soon" list.
It does make me wonder what FD's plan is with ED. I don't seem to remember anyone asking for engineers, crafting or powerplay. Yet we got engineers, crafting and powerplay... But the stuff that players have been asking for for ages (more missions types, storage, more than one commander slot, more things to do on planets, ability to walk about in ships/stations, etc) seems to be constantly on the "soon" list.
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Ok. Then let me track down stations that have the materials... rather than waiting on the best street corners to see if one falls off a truck.Bad example, because that's kind of how it works sometimes: A month of scrounging around for some Skyline injectors on-line, waiting for some bits to turn up from Japan, going and getting the stainless steel fabricated somewhere, checking around to see how other people have done their mapping... Proper race shops don't have time to mess around sourcing or stocking parts. There's no good turning up at the garage with nothing but a full wallet.
Anyhow: These aren't 'standard' tune-ups, where the engineer puts on some known go-faster parts because he likes making money and has a kid to feed. The Engineers are beyond the leading edge of design and on the bleeding edge. This isn't crafting proverbial iron daggers in Skyrim, but more akin to performance tuning a F-30, and the Engineers are doing it because it's what they want to do.
I don't know about you, but if I was a top chef, I'd send someone to do my shopping for me, too.
Analogies aside: The main issue is that it forces me to completely stop playing the game I was playing to play a different one. I was bounty-hunting; but I can't get in my Vulture because I need to hold on to all this cargo that I'll need for future recopies and that's very rare. In fact: It's not easy in my DBX; better get that ASP setup.
Not only am I forced to play this new game; but because there's no cargo storage, I can't switch back and forth with my old one.
At least give me in-game trading.
You don't need cargo space for materials..
Engineers require commodities as well..
X-Terminator
Banned
You're not "The Only One" - we all hate it and did not ask for it.
[video=youtube;7FEUG4sp-34]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7FEUG4sp-34[/video]
[video=youtube;7FEUG4sp-34]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7FEUG4sp-34[/video]
It's not for me, but then nor was Power Play or even driving around large, empty rocks in a dune buggy. Engineers is just FD catering to MMORPG type players who like hunting rares, getting exasperated at drop rates and crafting their Uber Something of Awesomeness so they can pew-pew harder or go faster or... whatever. Which is kind of who I was in WoW for a couple of years, so who am I to criticise?
But in WoW there was a place to store assorted materials so you didn't have to carry them around, and that was in a game where being killed didn't mean losing anything. In ED, you have to carry the lot and can lose the lot, too. Also, WoW offered an auction house where a lot of more powerful items could be sold after a player had found them or made them. Not all (some couldn't be transferred) but enough that there was a genuine player driven economy in WoW, with supply and demand, price fluctuations and the like.
And none of that is in ED.
In ED, crafting isn't crafting because you, the player, don't craft anything. You just find materials, give it to an NPC and have them make something that hopefully meets or exceeds your hopes. And while you're driving around trying to find whatever is on the list of mats, you have to carry everything with you and you can't sell anything you find that you might not want, even if there is a huge demand in-game due to rarity, because whilst the 'blaze your own trail' career of Engineer's Dogsbody is there, the occupation of Specialist Rares Trader is not.
It's just a time-sink, a paper-thin update that's was so well thought out, FD basically had to entirely rethink it soon after release and then gimp all the NPCs who suddenly pew-pewed a lot harder and went a lot faster. And, as many people point out whenever someone goes off about a part of the game they don't like, you don't have to play it. Power Play was the same; it didn't affect the core game and thus could be seen as entirely irrelevant.
Personally I'm hoping FD introduce something that's absolutely integral to the ED experience, that can be experienced by committed players with hours to spare as well as occasional gamers who get on just a few hours a week alike, and is woven into the fabric of the game and not just a self-contained little add-on that might as well have the tag-line 'take it or leave it'.
But in WoW there was a place to store assorted materials so you didn't have to carry them around, and that was in a game where being killed didn't mean losing anything. In ED, you have to carry the lot and can lose the lot, too. Also, WoW offered an auction house where a lot of more powerful items could be sold after a player had found them or made them. Not all (some couldn't be transferred) but enough that there was a genuine player driven economy in WoW, with supply and demand, price fluctuations and the like.
And none of that is in ED.
In ED, crafting isn't crafting because you, the player, don't craft anything. You just find materials, give it to an NPC and have them make something that hopefully meets or exceeds your hopes. And while you're driving around trying to find whatever is on the list of mats, you have to carry everything with you and you can't sell anything you find that you might not want, even if there is a huge demand in-game due to rarity, because whilst the 'blaze your own trail' career of Engineer's Dogsbody is there, the occupation of Specialist Rares Trader is not.
It's just a time-sink, a paper-thin update that's was so well thought out, FD basically had to entirely rethink it soon after release and then gimp all the NPCs who suddenly pew-pewed a lot harder and went a lot faster. And, as many people point out whenever someone goes off about a part of the game they don't like, you don't have to play it. Power Play was the same; it didn't affect the core game and thus could be seen as entirely irrelevant.
Personally I'm hoping FD introduce something that's absolutely integral to the ED experience, that can be experienced by committed players with hours to spare as well as occasional gamers who get on just a few hours a week alike, and is woven into the fabric of the game and not just a self-contained little add-on that might as well have the tag-line 'take it or leave it'.
Not touched Engineers yet, the idea of spending my gaming time searching the galaxy to find things does not appeal to me. Loving the missions and AI so very happy. When/if Frontier start giving the NPC's their toys back again then I might not have a choice �� .
I can appreciate the time, effort and programming skills that went into Engineers, I just wish they had used it putting any one of the things into the game that to me the game needed first (atmospheric planets/walking around/proper careers in bounty hunting or mining).
I can appreciate the time, effort and programming skills that went into Engineers, I just wish they had used it putting any one of the things into the game that to me the game needed first (atmospheric planets/walking around/proper careers in bounty hunting or mining).
Was replying specifically to the bounty hunting quote..
I bounty hunt in a ship with no cargo rack and pick up materials..
When I need to take commodities to an engineer I'll fit a cargo rack and pick them up on the way..
No biggie
Was replying specifically to the bounty hunting quote..
I bounty hunt in a ship with no cargo rack and pick up materials..
When I need to take commodities to an engineer I'll fit a cargo rack and pick them up on the way..
No biggie
Soooo, where are you storing said commodity when you're in your cargo-less fighter?
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Not everything can be obtained this way sometimes you/I will have to change playstyle to gather some of these materials/commodities.
As I understand it some things are specific like mining, srv exploration to find materials doing missions you normally wouldn't do, and for me even landing on a planet is something I've never had any interest in.
So not everyone will just stumble across these thing you require as you say.
I actually like the crafting quite a lot. Before, the only carrot on a stick was credits and rank. Now we have a plethora of upgrades available for our ships, and looking for the right materials is hard but rewarding, and it makes my activities feel more fun and varied.
Before engineers I had a tendency to fall into a rut and grind away for hours getting to Beagle Point/trading/smuggling/farming bounties/repeat, now my gameplay feels more fun and purposeful, and I have to think much further ahead which makes the experience feel more dynamic.
As far as the actual RNG crafting part that so many people take issue with, I don't have a problem with that either. So what if I don't get the best part on the first roll? I haven't seen a roll yet that wasn't an improvement over the base module, and I'm not going to get bent out of shape just because it could have been 'better.' I actually like that part because it means that the process will be lengthy and rewarding for months to come.
In short, the new toys are fun, the new gameplay is dynamic and rewarding, and the process will be relevant way into the future.
Now, could somebody please tell me where to look for pharmaceutical Isolators?
Before engineers I had a tendency to fall into a rut and grind away for hours getting to Beagle Point/trading/smuggling/farming bounties/repeat, now my gameplay feels more fun and purposeful, and I have to think much further ahead which makes the experience feel more dynamic.
As far as the actual RNG crafting part that so many people take issue with, I don't have a problem with that either. So what if I don't get the best part on the first roll? I haven't seen a roll yet that wasn't an improvement over the base module, and I'm not going to get bent out of shape just because it could have been 'better.' I actually like that part because it means that the process will be lengthy and rewarding for months to come.
In short, the new toys are fun, the new gameplay is dynamic and rewarding, and the process will be relevant way into the future.
Now, could somebody please tell me where to look for pharmaceutical Isolators?
Yes, I have to say I find the "don't like it, don't do it" comments particularly unhelpful - that's the road to a dead game.
The loot based RNG I *personally* think (and I've been mulling it over for a few hours) to be a particularly bad decision. The Division got slated for it's RNG and the precise materials you need drop with the core gameplay. Just play the game and within minutes *literally* you'll be able to go craft something, the catch it you might have to do this dozens of times to get the exact set of perks that suit your build.
Having to spend hours to collect the materials between each RNG *AND* putting the roll right on screen doesn't feel like a good choice.
AND engineering doesn't work this way!!!
Rant over. Bottom line, less than impressed, and I wonder if they'd put this to a vote beforehand, how much of the community would have shouted "RNG on Crafting?!? Hell yeah!!"
The loot based RNG I *personally* think (and I've been mulling it over for a few hours) to be a particularly bad decision. The Division got slated for it's RNG and the precise materials you need drop with the core gameplay. Just play the game and within minutes *literally* you'll be able to go craft something, the catch it you might have to do this dozens of times to get the exact set of perks that suit your build.
Having to spend hours to collect the materials between each RNG *AND* putting the roll right on screen doesn't feel like a good choice.
AND engineering doesn't work this way!!!
Rant over. Bottom line, less than impressed, and I wonder if they'd put this to a vote beforehand, how much of the community would have shouted "RNG on Crafting?!? Hell yeah!!"
Which is why I have a material PvE ship to get the commodities, upgrade the weapons then transfer them to my FDL.