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General / Off-Topic Blair, Iraq, War.
- Thread starter Surfinjo
- Start date
"Crimes against peace", as described by the Nuremberg Tribunal in 1946, are “the supreme international crime, differing only from other war crimes in that it contains within itself the accumulated evil of the whole.”
A crime against peace, in international law, refers to "planning, preparation, initiation, or waging of wars of aggression, or a war in violation of international treaties, agreements or assurances, or participation in a common plan or conspiracy for the accomplishment of any of the foregoing".
It is far from a "ridiculous idea" and is in fact a part of the United Nations Charter.
Launching an aggressive war against another nation and using the lies of WMD to fabricate a threat is a war crime and many consider it to be "supreme" trumping all others.
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http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-36756878
We can only hope that these admissions are used for additional charges of gross negligence against Blair's cabinet and Prescott in particular.
That war was a lie and a crime agains humanity and the population of Iraq, there was no weapons of mass destruction, it was all a fabricated lie to do whatever the agenda was \ is to conquer the country. Same goes with Libya, and now Syria.
We the West should stay the heck out of these countries.
We in the west should stay out ? We created Iraq, that was the crime, what we should have done after 2003 is split the country up correctly as per it's demographic differences, starting with freeing Iraqi Kurdistan and helping it become an independant nation.
Let me clarify my opinion, yes, i think Islam is bad (not all Muslims by any means) i also think religious Judaism is bad (i support the heavily secular Israel proper) i also think Christianity is bad (even though i celebrate the now secular christmas). But yes, Islam is the worlds biggest danger, in terms of war and peace, because even the secular experiments in Turkey and Bangladesh have failed, Pakistan is a huge mess, Iraq and Syria and Afghanistan are messes, we didn't even touch Syria and Libya with ground troops, Saudi Arabia is a disgrace, Blair and Bush's biggest crime is the alliance with Saudi Arabia. The second biggest threat to the world comes from the christian right in the USA, climate change deniers, anti gay sentiment and yes the NRA, i blame the christian religious right for the problems in the US, i blame the Israeli religious right and Hamas for the problems over there, and i blame the Islamic sects, tribes and terror groups for their obvious efforts to ruin the rebuilding of Iraq, the biggest victims of Islam are Muslims themselves, and i feel sorry that the world lets them get away with it by siding with the "insurgents" in Iraq and Taliban in Afghanistan. The Iraq war became a failed liberation of Muslim people, not an attack on Muslim people, but the problem was a book, be it mein kampf, the bible, the torah or the koran. (religion is simply ancient politics for brainwashing masses) End of Antitheist rant, fellow forum members, i mean to offend only religious faiths as an ideological and political enity, i'm sure you are all good people regardless of said faith and in no way do i discriminate against individuals based on that faith.
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Antitheist, the problem with your viewpoint about Islam is that it doesn't put anything into political context. Islam has been around for centuries, and the current issues associated with certain Islamic cultures are incredibly modern. Indeed the most populous majority Muslim states have not only had democracies but also elected female leaders - though you won't read that in the pages of the Daily Mail or in an op-ed rant by Sam Harris.
As I pointed out (click the links) studies show that religion is a negative predictor of involvement in terrorism.
Islamic nations gave us the scientific method, public health, the numerical system (algebra - Al Jabr), astronomy, and, most importantly of all, coffee. As recently as the 1950s Iran had a secular government with an elected leader. But what happened to that? Try to bear in mind that within the lifetimes of people alive today these nations were at peace when Europe was tearing itself apart with the most bloody war in history - a secular war at that.
To believe that Islamic nations are sort of "lagging" western cultures is to be ignorant of history. To believe that the west couldn't regress back into a less enlightened culture naive.
As I pointed out (click the links) studies show that religion is a negative predictor of involvement in terrorism.
Islamic nations gave us the scientific method, public health, the numerical system (algebra - Al Jabr), astronomy, and, most importantly of all, coffee. As recently as the 1950s Iran had a secular government with an elected leader. But what happened to that? Try to bear in mind that within the lifetimes of people alive today these nations were at peace when Europe was tearing itself apart with the most bloody war in history - a secular war at that.
To believe that Islamic nations are sort of "lagging" western cultures is to be ignorant of history. To believe that the west couldn't regress back into a less enlightened culture naive.
verminstar
Banned
There never were any WMD in Iraq...those 400 UN inspectors were nothing more than a PR stunt because some had already confirmed this in reports that won't be declassified for about 30 years or so, hence there is absolutely no way of providing any evidence. And even if someone did, they would be thrown into a very dark place for the rest of their natural lives. The entire fiasco had a few causes and none of them were of a humanitarian nature, that was always ever just a convenient excuse to fool the population and the voters...partly because one of the factors here was a certain US politician hoping to win votes and needing something just like this to garner support.
Tragically, the reasons didn't stop, or even start there. Almost a year before any official troops landed on Iraq soil, there were teams of non official forces tasked with sourcing and removing certain trails of physical evidence that linked british and american weapons manufacturers to the Saddam regime. Had some of that evidence come to light after being unearthed by a UN inspector, it would have raised some very awkward questions at the time on both sides of the atlantic.
While I hold no particular love for Blair, he simply was not directly responsible for that war and nor was Bush. Those who are directly responsible will never face trial...they will never be investigated or even named. I doubt that even Blair or Bush know who they are but those two would make excellent scapegoats.
This is the way the world works...good people get to live good lives because men who are skilled in violence do the things necessary for this life to exist. They are spared the details of how something is achieved because deep down, they don't want to know...they are happy with the status quo as it were and carry on with their comfortable life safe in the knowledge that there will be another state sponsored scapegoat along in due course for them to blame, not realizing that they are simply following the script which was written for them. This is all a part of something bigger...it's all connected by a nearly invisible web and here's the best bit that very few realize, although more and more are beginning to suspect...this isn't the culmination of a plan which was laid out decades ago by the faceless and nameless...we are merely still in the preparation stages.
Anyway...believe what you wish...hang blair and co from the tree on the hill and let his corpse swing in the breeze if it makes ye feel any better...if it does, then the distraction has worked like a charm. In some ways, ye may actually be doing them a favor because these guys are pretty much shafted anyway...and they know it...and now that the general public have gotten a whiff of the wounded fox blood, they will run with it...everything going to plan again ^^
Tragically, the reasons didn't stop, or even start there. Almost a year before any official troops landed on Iraq soil, there were teams of non official forces tasked with sourcing and removing certain trails of physical evidence that linked british and american weapons manufacturers to the Saddam regime. Had some of that evidence come to light after being unearthed by a UN inspector, it would have raised some very awkward questions at the time on both sides of the atlantic.
While I hold no particular love for Blair, he simply was not directly responsible for that war and nor was Bush. Those who are directly responsible will never face trial...they will never be investigated or even named. I doubt that even Blair or Bush know who they are but those two would make excellent scapegoats.
This is the way the world works...good people get to live good lives because men who are skilled in violence do the things necessary for this life to exist. They are spared the details of how something is achieved because deep down, they don't want to know...they are happy with the status quo as it were and carry on with their comfortable life safe in the knowledge that there will be another state sponsored scapegoat along in due course for them to blame, not realizing that they are simply following the script which was written for them. This is all a part of something bigger...it's all connected by a nearly invisible web and here's the best bit that very few realize, although more and more are beginning to suspect...this isn't the culmination of a plan which was laid out decades ago by the faceless and nameless...we are merely still in the preparation stages.
Anyway...believe what you wish...hang blair and co from the tree on the hill and let his corpse swing in the breeze if it makes ye feel any better...if it does, then the distraction has worked like a charm. In some ways, ye may actually be doing them a favor because these guys are pretty much shafted anyway...and they know it...and now that the general public have gotten a whiff of the wounded fox blood, they will run with it...everything going to plan again ^^
I hear you fuzzy, i'm aware of the history, including the female elected leaders, however in the current context, there is zero doubt in my mind that most Muslim majority countries are proving me right, by the way i'm not a paper reader, i try to multi source my news, i'm a TYT fan, and they would probably side with you, perhaps i'm just a stubborn contrarian like the late great Christopher Hitchens, but i'm sticking to my guns, secularism post WW2 beats religion post WW2, to me it's clear as day.
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Most wars are constructed by those who benefit, in reason times CIA, Mossad, MI6 have been the worst kind, they are the threat here not some brown people somewhere looking at goats.
All the false flags to start a war comes from these so called organisations, they do not protect you, they are the root cause to the problem.
Creating all this instability are by design, to push people around, the refugees coming to Europe is by design, why you ask? well to make it unstable, why you ask? because a nation that is unstable are more easy to manipulate. Just look at WW1 and WW2 and then you got your answer.
Humans need guidelines upon which to form their beliefs, attitudes, opinions and behaviours.
That is the function of all religion and why any form of secular attitudes are just religions by another name.
That is why your 'rant' (sic) is little different to a rant promoting Islam, Catholicism, or any other religion.
Atheism is just another religion. Dawkins.
Just what the world needs.
It seems we disagree again, no surprise there lol. However i won't reply, i will bite my tounge to avoid going off topic.
Sounds like you would be happy for Israel to deal with their Arab neighbours? That issue has kept us, 5 minutes away from WW3 for the last 60 years.
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I agree with this, but not on the grounds for peace. They should stay out because as soon as the dust starts to settle, the in fighting stops and the west, becomes the enemy. The western troops become the targets themselves, by all of the locals.
The Israeli's can handle conventional threats, but if Saddam had used the WMDs he once had on Israel, the Israelis would have had little choice but to nuke Iraq, then it would have escelated into a problem much bigger than the one we have now, people should keep that in mind with regards to Iran, allthough i think the recent deals reached were enough for now, the bottom line is that you just can't trust dictators with WMDs, Saddams and Assads can't be trusted around WMDs as proven, and North Korea are terrifying, we can't stop them now and we couldn't before because of China, but at least we know Gadaffi, Saddam and Assad will never be able to bother their people or Israel with WMDs ever again.
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Not sure where you got that idea from.
The situation in Palestine is really fait accompli. Like it or not, that is reality. The real question is, when will the Israelis stop. They seem content to confine themselves to the borders of Palestine, but many seem to be inspired by their view of ancient history. The territory of Ancient Israel extended quite far at some points.
In any case, it is not our problem. We should keep out of it or get our fingers very burnt.
Well i think even the right wing politicians in Israel are secular enough not to try to become ancient Israel, and the question is not when will they stop expanding, it's when will the religious and conservative nutjobs on the Israeli side agree to pull back from the west bank ? theres no way they will try to go beyond the west bank, and we know they are willing to give up occupied land after Sinai and Gaza, eventually the west bank will be free of occupation and the only post 67 land left occupied will be the Golan heights, which is an entirely different matter, in any case the situation is made worse by external forces, whether it be American money or Islamic hatred of Israel.
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Mordant.
Mordant ? I know you don't agree, but i fail to see what was mordant about that post.
Israel will continue to exist in its present form with almost no changes whatsoever until the oil runs out.
When the oil runs out, Saudi Arabia will be the England of the ME.
The only good thing that comes out of oil is sardines. And judging by the way they pack themselves in, the fish seem to agree.
Boo Boom!
Israel is not an oil rich country.