Depth and Motivation in E:D - the case for corporations

[NeilF]

The multiplayer part of ED is weak currently. Update 2.3 will add multicrew, but this is only up to 4 players in one ship...... It would be cooler to have multiple wings fly under the same banner and be able to do stuff together on a large scale.



This is done exclusively by the NPC powers which you can align with. I'd prefer more of this being done by player guilds as well.

Join togethor to do what? The gameplay, mechanics and depth haven't really moved in 12-18 months?

Can a group of players go out and escort a VIP from A-->B? Can another group of CMDRs undertake a missions to attack said VIP? Can a station fall under famine conditions and lose control/security and go under a blockade mechanic? With groups of CMDRs trying to enforce, break and run it?

The answer is basically no. For all the new 25% more powerful weapons, onboard fighters and multi-crew Season 2 is giving us, alas, all we have to do with these new toys is the same as we've been doing for the past 12-18 months

 

[MadDogMurdock]

In terms of guild names, it's not very hard to have a naming policy in placed - it worked like a charm on WoW RP servers - anyone with a stupid character or guild name had it changed by a GM. No LeetShadowBlade2000 from <Pwners> existed at all.

As far as stations go, initial construction should basically start with just a basic landing pad where landing you get to see what materials are missing for construction and your faction would then need to donate the tons of materials and money needed to build it. When the station/outpost is completed only basic repair/refuel services should be avainable and other functionality would have to be built up. Station would require food, minerals and money in upkeep - the quantity of each depending on how many services it has. At the same time usage of the services would kickback anywhere from 5-10% to station income so it'd be possible for a station to become profitable. You could invite NPC factions or player factions that you have good standing with to the station to make them be able to issue BGS missions and so on.

You could take it a step further and create synergies between stations that can be built. For example building a mining outpost on the surface of a planet would create minerals that would be made available to a refining outpost that could then be used to produce machinery sold at a discount to the faction and maybe getting it that far would also create a discount on outfitting and shipyard prices at the main station.

If you are a die hard solo player - you need not take part in any of the above and none of it will affect you as this would happen in previously empty space.

You're describing a different game. I'd prefer FD to keep on developing this space pilot game thanks.
I'm pretty sure there are games that do what you describe.

 

[Modgier]

You're describing a different game. I'd prefer FD to keep on developing this space pilot game thanks.
I'm pretty sure there are games that do what you describe.

What exactly do you want? You're shooting down ideas with "I DO NOT LIKE THIS!" - what do you want elite to be? "Space Pilot" game?

There are games that do similar things but that doesn't mean ED shouldn't do it.

Just because "other" games do it doesn't mean it's a bad idea for ED to do it.

 

[Tiamat]

Wow, that was a long post to say "please remake Eve".

 

[Mc80]

This sounds great to thb. Great example of how to make the galaxy more dynamic and player driven.

 

[Modgier]

Wow, that was a long post to say "please remake Eve".

If you had played EVE you'd know full well that it's totally not what I'm asking for....

Much of EVE is about player vs player conflict in 0.0. I have ZERO interest in that. I made that clear over and over but some people just don't get it....

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

The moment I can be bossed around by some pillocky player with a Napoleon complex is the moment I stop playing.

 

[c48113]

The moment I can be bossed around by some pillocky player with a Napoleon complex is the moment I stop playing.

Bingo

 

[Modgier]

The moment I can be bossed around by some pillocky player with a Napoleon complex is the moment I stop playing.

How does anything I suggest do any of that?

These knee-jerk reactions are tiresome.

A group of players building a bunch of stations where none previously existed does not impact you at all.

 

[lefty1117]

I think extending and adding functionality into the existing minor factions would be enough. Allow players to "join" minor factions, have them be tagged with the name, make them hostile/friendly with other factions depending on faction state, implement a faction-wide chat channel and maybe a UI and/or galmap filters to show info about the faction, such as what systems they're in, what their state is, and other important faction-specific info. Maybe use the in-flight mission generation system to create faction-specific missions for players that are based on BGS dynamics.

We don't need guildmasters and player-owned corps, but enhancing what already exists would add immensely to gameplay.

 

[Mc80]

The moment I can be bossed around by some pillocky player with a Napoleon complex is the moment I stop playing.

You won´t be. That has been stated several times already. The whole point is to implement this kind of thing without impacting people who want no part in it.

 

[Toumal]

The moment I can be bossed around by some pillocky player with a Napoleon complex is the moment I stop playing.

Good, we don't want that either. So we're on the same page after all

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

Good, we don't want that either. So we're on the same page after all

Cool. So in Open, no restrictions.

I'm glad to hear that

 

[Cosmos]

I understand where the OP is coming from. The problem with the present setup, BGS, and player named factions is that it always benefits larger groups, whilst protecting them from any direct adversarial play, and the gameplay is all too boring and predictable. Ordinarily larger groups would likely have more influence but there is no way for a smaller one to contest what others do via skillful gameplay, its all based upon numbers, who trucks what etc..

This is not emergent gameplay as far as I am concerned but ultimately the issue comes down to the elaborate lengths FD have gone to in order to give the impression of conflict but making it all indirect. It caters to the lowest common demoninator and stunts the potential of the game.

And rather than having dynamic and sponaneous gameplay we instead are forced to grind the BGS to achieve meangful things.

If thats not bad enough FD then goes a head and god mods the game for the 'majority'...

 

[halo jones 101]

The moment I can be bossed around by some pillocky player with a Napoleon complex is the moment I stop playing.

Bingo

Bingo Bongo, for those that want some EVE style game play in ED the BGS does all this without the ability of player groups to form unplayable areas where it is able to gank storm players who dont want to be involved with that particular area of the BGS out of the game.

How does anything I suggest do any of that?

These knee-jerk reactions are tiresome.

A group of players building a bunch of stations where none previously existed does not impact you at all.

I have disagree with your premise that a group of players able to build and control a station or stations will not impact players who dont wish to be part of their "game". Clearly the mechanics that Frontier have in place allow you to join a group, or pledge to power play but with the inability too have the, "out of game meta" that EVE Online has, you cannot play the role of spy or 5th columnist, to undermine powers from within.

Clearly this is what always happens in any game that allows players to form corporations or guilds that can then be manipulated too change the core game mechanics... I have to say that if that is what some people want then they would be better served by seeking out and buying those games rather than constantly asking for changes to Elite Dangerous, game play mechanics.

Personally I want different games to have differing elements themes and game mechanics and thus buy accordingly, at the risk of straw manning I dont buy a Car racing game them ask for it too have a platform game mechanic.

 

[the100thmonkey]

I think extending and adding functionality into the existing minor factions would be enough. Allow players to "join" minor factions, have them be tagged with the name, make them hostile/friendly with other factions depending on faction state, implement a faction-wide chat channel and maybe a UI and/or galmap filters to show info about the faction, such as what systems they're in, what their state is, and other important faction-specific info. Maybe use the in-flight mission generation system to create faction-specific missions for players that are based on BGS dynamics.

We don't need guildmasters and player-owned corps, but enhancing what already exists would add immensely to gameplay.

This is spot on.

The people asking for guildlulz just don't understand the system that's already there.

With regard to colonisation, I suggest that everyone interested take a close look at what's going on around Jaques. I'm pretty confident that the factions that end up colonising that area will be player factions, and I wouldn't be surprised if FD tried something new out there. Personally, I'd like to see a colonistaion mechanic built into the core of the BGS and not requiring developer-injected events. I hope it happens eventually, but I'm not holding my breath for it happening any time soon.

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

This is spot on.

The people asking for guildlulz just don't understand the system that's already there.

With regard to colonisation, I suggest that everyone interested take a close look at what's going on around Jaques. I'm pretty confident that the factions that end up colonising that area will be player factions, and I wouldn't be surprised if FD tried something new out there. Personally, I'd like to see a colonistaion mechanic built into the core of the BGS and not requiring developer-injected events. I hope it happens eventually, but I'm not holding my breath for it happening any time soon.

I hope they won't be players factions. At the moment people are putting a lot of effort into the rebuilding ecause it's for 'the community'. When it starts to benefit certain players and not others, that would be lost and the end of that community feeling.

 

[Modgier]

Bingo Bongo, for those that want some EVE style game play in ED the BGS does all this without the ability of player groups to form unplayable areas where it is able to gank storm players who dont want to be involved with that particular area of the BGS out of the game.

I have disagree with your premise that a group of players able to build and control a station or stations will not impact players who dont wish to be part of their "game". Clearly the mechanics that Frontier have in place allow you to join a group, or pledge to power play but with the inability too have the out of game meta that EVE Online has, you cannot play the role of spy or 5th columnist, to undermine powers from within.

Clearly this is what always happens in any game that allows players to form corporations or guilds that can then be manipulated too change the core game mechanics... I have to say that if that is what some people want then they would be better served by seeking out and buying those games rather than constantly asking for changes to Elite Dangerous, game play mechanics.

Personally I want different games to have differing elements themes and game mechanics and thus buy accordingly, at the risk of straw manning I dont buy a Car racing game them ask for it too have a platform game mechanic.

Nothing about current BGS implementation prevents players from ganking everyone they see in a system. What prevents that is solo and private group play. Do not invent problems.

You wrote a lot of words, but not a single example of how exactly players owning stations in previously unclaimed space affects anyone but those players. You could still go there, you could even dock at the stations if they are set to allow docking to all. Or maybe you won't and maybe if you're in open the players there will gank you. They can still gank you in open right now. What's the difference?

All I hear is people saying "I am not interested in this - go back to EVE." despite clearly have no idea that what I am suggesting is totally not what EVE is like.

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This is spot on.

The people asking for guildlulz just don't understand the system that's already there.

With regard to colonisation, I suggest that everyone interested take a close look at what's going on around Jaques. I'm pretty confident that the factions that end up colonising that area will be player factions, and I wouldn't be surprised if FD tried something new out there. Personally, I'd like to see a colonistaion mechanic built into the core of the BGS and not requiring developer-injected events. I hope it happens eventually, but I'm not holding my breath for it happening any time soon.

I thought ED was about controlling your own destiny right? Do what you want in a giant space of infinite possibilities and all that? Here let me quote it for you:

[FONT=&quot]"400 Billion Star Systems. Infinite Freedom. Blaze Your Own Trail. "[/FONT]

Yet you want random events by BGS and FD's injected events to make a path for you to follow?

I don't. I want to do my own thing. I want to control my destiny not FD.

 

[the100thmonkey]

it always benefits larger groups

You'd be surprised. Seriously.

its all based upon numbers, who trucks what etc..

You'd be surprised. Seriously.

This is not emergent gameplay as far as I am concerned but ultimately the issue comes down to the elaborate lengths FD have gone to in order to give the impression of conflict but making it all indirect. It caters to the lowest common demoninator and stunts the potential of the game.

Judging by some of the responses on this thread and my own experience, BGS-oriented gameplay is anything but lowest common denominator - all of the players and player factions seriously engaged with working the BGS that I've had the pleasure of interacting with have, bar none, been populated by really smart, attentive and knowledgeable people. You said "it's all based on numbers," and this is true, but not in the way you think it is. To a certain extent, Powerplay is impacted by the number of people playing for each faction, but this is only true of the small groups like Delaine or Patreus. In the same way, BGS play isn't really determined by who has the most ships.

The game is balanced, at every level, around small groups of players. The maximum wing size of four isn't there purely for technical considerations surrounding networking.

And rather than having dynamic and sponaneous gameplay we instead are forced to grind the BGS to achieve meangful things.

You'd be surprised. Part of the problem with "the grind" is that people think they have to grind! That's all I have to say on the matter.

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I thought ED was about controlling your own destiny right? Do what you want in a giant space of infinite possibilities and all that? Here let me quote it for you:

"400 Billion Star Systems. Infinite Freedom. Blaze Your Own Trail. "

Yet you want random events by BGS and FD's injected events to make a path for you to follow?

I don't. I want to do my own thing. I want to control my destiny not FD.

1. BGS events are not random.
2. I've already stated that I dislike dev-injected events. Community goals are a bodge, in my opinion. I hope they're a stop-gap measure.
3. I've already stated that I think colonisation should be available in the game.
4. You can have your station, as long as you don't mind that I can flip it out from under you (and I can.)

 

[Mc80]

Non arguments much ? If someone wants to make one area in open unplayable there is nothing you can do about it if you are alone. There is no proper response to prevent them from ganking you until you give up, if this is what you all are afraid of every time people bring this up. This is the reason why CGs are notorious killing grounds. Nothing proposed here would change a thing as it is right now.