Why should I pay 150$ to play beta now? Question from a 'Star Citizenite'

[ubermick]

You'd have to find me first. Space is big. You'd have to beat me in combat and that's just not going to happen.

On a separate note and for anyone reading please pass this question on to the developers, can a heat signature of a ship be suppressed if you are "sun up" to a target? If my ship was as close as I dared to be in proximity to a star and my target was further away, can my heat signature disappear, irrespective of the usual cloaking stuff? After all, the radiation and heat from a nearby star would be immensely greater.

Sort of yes, sort of no. The fact that space is a vacuum means that there is actually nothing to conduct heat. So if you were bobbing about outside the atmosphere, armed with the biggest IR heat reader imaginable, and pointed it at the sun, you'd get the sun's temperature (really bloody hot... um, about 5,000c if I remember off the top of my head) but direct it to a point about 1,000km away, you'd read nothing. Now if there was SOMETHING there, and you hit it with your temperature sensor, then that something would be rapidly absorbing heat (and would quickly vapourize).

So the short answer is that absolutely any tactile object in space will give off a heat signature, regardless of where it is, since it's measured against the actual temperature of space, which is absolute zero.

That said, you then get into whether or not a sensor would be able to differentiate small fluctuations like that. But if you're in a ship, and approach a star, remember that you'd be taking on more and more heat energy compared to the space around you, so you'd actually light up like a Christmas tree.

 

[Memnoch]

IIt mostly seems to be an argument based on wishes and unicorns...

SC will have Unicorns!? <runs to get credit card>

 

[Alric]

I've seen lots of SC fans claim that, but as a backer of both (I've actually sunk twice as much money into SC as I have ED) I've yet to see any evidence of that at all. It mostly seems to be an argument based on wishes and unicorns...

I think we can see already that the level of graphical detail that SC is putting in to ships is exceptional. I think they will score highly on this front. For me though, the beauty of Elite is in the universe, not just the ships. Every time I go somewhere I get a different view of the stars, planets, and ships dancing around them. Different lighting, different stars - each trip is unique. It may not always win the screenshot competition with an artist created scene - but to fly in it has a scale and majesty that never gets old.

Secondly there's the obvious point - E : D is a 2014 game, SC is likely to be 2016+.

 

[Memnoch]

It may not always win the screenshot competition with an artist created scene...

I guess this is relating to the notion that SC will have "handcrafted" content. You are no doubt aware that they will be using procedural generation for their systems in SC?

 

[Alric]

I guess this is relating to the notion that SC will have "handcrafted" content. You are no doubt aware that they will be using procedural generation for their systems in SC?

It is my belief that there will be more direct artist control over what a typical Star Citizen player is looking at most of the time compared with what a typical Elite : Dangerous player is looking at most of the time. It's not my belief that that is a good thing (or a bad thing, for that matter).

 

[ICDP]

I think there was a slight misunderstanding, it's not the amount itself that gives me pause, but the high "buy in" price. Over at Star Citizen I started with a humble 40$ payment and got a ship, alpha,beta access, and the single player and mp games. I then later pledged more and more as I gradually found out more and wanted to contribute more to help make it happen (and get lots of amazing goodies like professional grade physical blueprints of the ships in game)

Please excuse my cutting most of your well thought out post and focusing on this one paragraph.

I feel it is unfair to claim ED is $150 to play while SC is only $40. The fair comparison would be to compare the cheapest buy in price for the early access in both games.

The cheapest early access price for the ED second round beta is $80. By comparison the SC buy in price is $55, $40 for one ship + $5 for the AC module. Both are unavailable to play right now but will be soon for those who pledged at those levels. In essence ED early access is only $25 more expensive than the basic SC pledge.

$150 gets you something tangible to play right now. If you feel it is to expensive, wait until the second round beta starts in a few months and get on board then for $80.

 

[Dr Wookie]

Please excuse my cutting most of your well thought out post and focusing on this one paragraph.

I feel it is unfair to claim ED is $150 to play while SC is only $40. The fair comparison would be to compare the cheapest buy in price for the early access in both games.

The cheapest early access price for the ED second round beta is $80. By comparison the SC buy in price is $55, $40 for one ship + $5 for the AC module. Both are unavailable to play right now but will be soon for those who pledged at those levels. In essence ED early access is only $25 more expensive than the basic SC pledge.

$150 gets you something tangible to play right now. If you feel it is to expensive, wait until the second round beta starts in a few months and get on board then for $80.

Technically, preordering the game at $50 gives you access to gamma, which is the last stage before general release; FD are hoping that we will be able to keep gamma progress with no wipe at launch

 

[LuxAngel7]

I guess this is relating to the notion that SC will have "handcrafted" content. You are no doubt aware that they will be using procedural generation for their systems in SC?

I'm not trying to start or imply that one game is better than another, but I would like to clarify for you that they have only just started "researching" procedural generation to enable full planet exploration and seamless space to atmo in game transitions. (at some point, most likely not at launch)

They have started "researching" it specifically because they are firm believers in the superiority of hand crafted content over proc. content, so they want to be able to reach a happy compromise where they can use proc. gen. but also maintain a certain hand crafted quality to it.

Although they will be implementing procedural for stuff like asteroid formations and the like. Hope that clears it up

Please excuse my cutting most of your well thought out post and focusing on this one paragraph.

I feel it is unfair to claim ED is $150 to play while SC is only $40. The fair comparison would be to compare the cheapest buy in price for the early access in both games.

The cheapest early access price for the ED second round beta is $80. By comparison the SC buy in price is $55, $40 for one ship + $5 for the AC module. Both are unavailable to play right now but will be soon for those who pledged at those levels. In essence ED early access is only $25 more expensive than the basic SC pledge.

$150 gets you something tangible to play right now. If you feel it is to expensive, wait until the second round beta starts in a few months and get on board then for $80.

No worries in cutting stuff out, I had to write more than I wanted to because I felt rude not answering when so many had responded so politely!

And I see your point, and building on my last response, it makes more sense to me now that I now the "why" behind their pricing model. And while I don't want to compare apples to oranges, my question was in the "play now sense" and that's why I was mentioning the 150$ price tag, and I didn't mean to mislead with the 40$ tag for Star Citizen, that was actually the price up until a very short while ago, when they introduced the extra 5$ to offset "new arrivals" adding stress to the alpha.

Thanks for breaking it down like that for me though

 

[Severian]

Everyone has pretty much covered the reasons for higher early costs in E, personally I agree it's a filter level to control numbers.

But the best reason to join up is evidenced in this very thread. It could not exist on the SC forum. Reasonable question asked, thoughtful responses offered, in General no less. On SC it would have been trolled, screamed, modded, and deleted by now.

 

[LuxAngel7]

Everyone has pretty much covered the reasons for higher early costs in E, personally I agree it's a filter level to control numbers.

But the best reason to join up is evidenced in this very thread. It could not exist on the SC forum. Reasonable question asked, thoughtful responses offered, in General no less. On SC it would have been trolled, screamed, modded, and deleted by now.

While I agree that this thread has been very pleasant, I wouldn't be so quick to label an entire forum like that, I've posted over there quite a bit, and although I myself have been a victim of "thread pros" that read the title and then rage at you, in general I've found that people over there are just as nice as they are here, including mods. I even made one or two friends among the mods, they're just fans like us after all

 

[Severian]

While I agree that this thread has been very pleasant, I wouldn't be so quick to label an entire forum like that, I've posted over there quite a bit, and although I myself have been a victim of "thread pros" that read the title and then rage at you, in general I've found that people over there are just as nice as they are here, including mods. I even made one or two friends among the mods, they're just fans like us after all

[Redacted]

And for context I'm Premium Beta and I have an Original Backer LTI 350R and an SC t-shirt.

 

[LuxAngel7]

I've seen lots of SC fans claim that, but as a backer of both (I've actually sunk twice as much money into SC as I have ED) I've yet to see any evidence of that at all. It mostly seems to be an argument based on wishes and unicorns...

If you were to come to my house and take a look at my ship which currently crews 4+ people, in max settings running at 60 fps unoptimized, then you would see what the fuss is about. Believe me, the first time I went into my hangar, I couldn't stop giggling like an idiot.

And in relation to the rest of the SC universe, the hangar is the equivalent of the main menu of a "normal" game...for now at least

 

[MentaListo]

Since the kickstarter was available ages ago, could have easily saved up £10 a month and paid to be a backer...

 

[Vasious]

I have a genuine and sincere question, preceded by a brief preface.

but I feel quite..."intimidated" (? don't know if that's the right word) by the 150$ buy in.


However, I find myself very very hesitant to plop down 150$ for a "premium beta"

Then you shouldn't.
If you have to ask for a rationalisation, then you probably shouldn't spend an amount that makes you uncomfortable as you'll likely feel buyers remorse, even if you enjoy the PB, there will always be a doubt that it was not the right idea

 

[warbaby2]

Then you shouldn't.
If you have to ask for a rationalisation, then you probably shouldn't spend an amount that makes you uncomfortable as you'll likely feel buyers remorse, even if you enjoy the PB, there will always be a doubt that it was not the right idea

While I don't understand why you feel hesitant with ED, but did not with SC, I agree with Vasious...

 

[C Wusher]

1) Waited for approx 20 years for this .... 8$ / year.
2) Getting all future expansions. It's like a live time account in LOTRO. I got it and i play when i want to play. No need to hurry for all the new shiny stuff because i payed nn $ for the soandso-expansion.
3) I can afford it

 

[nickq]

I bought premium beta 3 days ago.
Since then:

I've made no progress with cash generation with trading.
I've never bought an upgrade to the ship etc (due to above)
I've not made any cash with fighting (I die or the enemy jumps away)

Despite this, every time I load it up I love it, really enjoy it, can't get enough (even failing).

Meanwhile, I've got all my controls mapped and can practice at the basics and have new content to look forward to along the way.

Would easily blow £100 on a night out with restaurant and drinks and not much to show for it.

Definitely worth it to me, but my wife doesn't agree :smilie:

 

[Mu77ley]

If you were to come to my house and take a look at my ship which currently crews 4+ people, in max settings running at 60 fps unoptimized, then you would see what the fuss is about. Believe me, the first time I went into my hangar, I couldn't stop giggling like an idiot.

Thanks all the same, but I can quite happily look round my own Constellation, 325A and Aurora at about 90fps max settings in the hangar module. They don't look that great.

 

[Ajiro]

I'm an original SC backer, with a total pledge of over 320 Euro's and ongoing 10 euro subscription.

I also was pretty weary about spending 120 euro's on E: D, but after watching alot of scot manly video's and nagging from a canadian friend named malicar, i made the jump.

Truth be told, it is worth it and as someone who loves Sci-Fi i will be getting the best of both worlds.

I guess it all comes down to your enthousiasm of both games.

 

[Erik Marcaigh]

I bought into both Elite and SC.

Elite is where my heart is though, because I've warped right back into 1985 on my Commodore 64. I initially pledged through the Backers App as Beta with benefits & extras. I didn't go with Alpha at the time (July last year) because of the estimated timetable, and I wouldn't have been able to handle work (tax season to April 15th) and the excitement of ED at the same time. But by early April, I went ahead and bumped myself up to Alpha level as I had a good handle on my workload by that time. And I love it.

I enjoyed Freelancer, CR's most recent space sim, but it was limited. Once the story was done, that was it. There was no where else to explore, no better ship to acquire. And the big ships didn't handle the way I thought they should. They didn't seem to have the mass.

So I tossed $40 into SC so I could play the game, but once I saw they were charging for MORE ships that may or may not handle the way I'd expect them to... forget it. So if I get into SC and the Aurora is the only ship I'll be able to fly unless I shell out actual US$$, then CR can take my $40 and we'll call it even.

So should you pay $150? At this point, what's another $150 to you? I expect you make good money being in marketing. If you ever played the original Elite and want to at least see DB along with this latest ride, then yeah, I'd toss the money in. But know that this isn't a "game" right now. It's testing various parts of a game. A lot of PBetas can't seem to grasp that, and the forums are a hotbed of hate and crying.

I don't regret shelling out for Alpha. I'm enjoying the ride, learning new things (Photoshop and Movie Maker), and making new friends.