Weren't the engineers ment to bring diversity?
- Thread starter Comrade Error
- Start date
Quite the ostrich response - e.g. head in sand ignoring plain evidence.
If you want to debate whether it is now 90% identical, 60%, or even 99% - right or wrong, those are possible debate points based on whatever merit of argument you wish to present.
But 100% is a mathematical concept and can be proven or disproven. Pre-Engineers, with 0% chance to have differing components -vs- post-Engineers with -some- chance to have differing components at the custom level.
Unless you are stating literally every single ED player -100%- takes a 6A shield build for their Anaconda with exact same thermal, resist, etc version as every other player, then no - you are simply quite wrong. There are now more choices, more diversity.
As I've stated, whether that increase is 'good enough' is worth debating. But denying increased choices exist moves this from realm of opinion to denying physical fact.
For certain combat ships that maximise the limited power available, FSD boot time mods will be a godsend.
My interdictor is bigger.
Perhaps at some day, far in the future, we might be able to convince FD to "fix" Engineers this way:
Rather than simply insert coin, pull lever, pray to RNGesus and hope for a "jackpot", we get this - Pick a Module, Pick a Mod type, Move the first slider left or right. Other linked sliders move along with that slider - so if we want to, for example, push our level 1 FSB upgrade all the way to 10%, the Integrity Slider drops down to -5%, and the Power Draw goes up to 10%. Then we decide that's too much Power Draw, so we grab the Power Draw slider, and pull it back down to 5%. Integrity drops down another 5%.
We say "Ok, I can live with that, and click "Apply". Then RNGesus steps in and throws some random modifiers to these stats. Maybe we get a bonus 1% Optimized Mass, but -2% Power Draw, and -1% Fuel Usage.
And so on and so on.. let us give our Engineers some idea of what we want them do try to do, then apply an after-the-fact random modifier. I'd even be willing to see some variable materials requirements based on the modification specified.
I kind of look at The Engineers right now like this:
I take my car to a mechanic and say "I'd like to go faster."
The mechanic says "Ok, give me a couple hours and I'll see what I can do."
I come back in a couple hours, there's a racing stripe painted on my car, a spoiler on the back, and my rear wheels are now 21 inches instead of the stock 18's.
The mechanic then says "There you go, I really worked hard on this."
I say "Does it go faster?"
The mechanic says "Well, it looks like it could go 200."
I take it out to test and find it goes only 2 miles an hour faster.
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Stop playing with your interdictor before you require a doctor.
Rather than simply insert coin, pull lever, pray to RNGesus and hope for a "jackpot", we get this - Pick a Module, Pick a Mod type, Move the first slider left or right. Other linked sliders move along with that slider - so if we want to, for example, push our level 1 FSB upgrade all the way to 10%, the Integrity Slider drops down to -5%, and the Power Draw goes up to 10%. Then we decide that's too much Power Draw, so we grab the Power Draw slider, and pull it back down to 5%. Integrity drops down another 5%.
We say "Ok, I can live with that, and click "Apply". Then RNGesus steps in and throws some random modifiers to these stats. Maybe we get a bonus 1% Optimized Mass, but -2% Power Draw, and -1% Fuel Usage.
And so on and so on.. let us give our Engineers some idea of what we want them do try to do, then apply an after-the-fact random modifier. I'd even be willing to see some variable materials requirements based on the modification specified.
I kind of look at The Engineers right now like this:
I take my car to a mechanic and say "I'd like to go faster."
The mechanic says "Ok, give me a couple hours and I'll see what I can do."
I come back in a couple hours, there's a racing stripe painted on my car, a spoiler on the back, and my rear wheels are now 21 inches instead of the stock 18's.
The mechanic then says "There you go, I really worked hard on this."
I say "Does it go faster?"
The mechanic says "Well, it looks like it could go 200."
I take it out to test and find it goes only 2 miles an hour faster.
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Stop playing with your interdictor before you require a doctor.
Never gonna happen, and I wouldnt want it myself either. While I agree the randomness is too much, I do want randomness to stay. Otherwise you'll end up in the same situation as pre-2.1, but with a higher wall to scale to get there. Random (minor!) variation is what I like about 2.1. The idea of a ship with minor quirks and deviations.
Sorry to dissapoint you, but I made the same mistake with that mod. It has no effect whatsoever on the time it takes your FSD to cool down or charge up to jump again.
All this modification does, is to reduce the time it takes for the FSD to turn on when it has been switched off. So if your power priorities mean that your FSD turns off while you are fighting, or if your FSD is taken out by an experimental effect that causes it to reboot, this is a useful modification to have. But for speeding up escapes from an interdictio this is of no use to you at all.
Any notion that introducing a set of new tools will introduce diversity in gaming is severely misplaced. As with 2.1, players will use it to find a more effective meta build.
Without extensive balancing, the only way RNGineers could have increased diversity is implement true sidegrading. Not necessarily that any stat gains are matched by an equal stat decrease, but that the stats you forced to lose would cripple your module as much as empower it, meaning any modifications you implement need to be specific to your build and tactic.
And of course even then people will find the most effective combo. But other loadouts would be far more viable compared to the remarkably one-sided affair we have now.
2.1 isn't getting rolled back though, so...all aboard the balance train!
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And this is the negative result of the meta being fussed over so much.
Most CMDRs have enough mats spare from missions/surface recon etc. to waltz into an RNGineer base whenever they happen to pass the region and net a couple of low-grade mods.
The right ones will seriously augment a ship without bothering with the min/max grind.
Without extensive balancing, the only way RNGineers could have increased diversity is implement true sidegrading. Not necessarily that any stat gains are matched by an equal stat decrease, but that the stats you forced to lose would cripple your module as much as empower it, meaning any modifications you implement need to be specific to your build and tactic.
And of course even then people will find the most effective combo. But other loadouts would be far more viable compared to the remarkably one-sided affair we have now.
2.1 isn't getting rolled back though, so...all aboard the balance train!
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And this is the negative result of the meta being fussed over so much.
Most CMDRs have enough mats spare from missions/surface recon etc. to waltz into an RNGineer base whenever they happen to pass the region and net a couple of low-grade mods.
The right ones will seriously augment a ship without bothering with the min/max grind.
Ammo capacity is so last millennium. We have auto reloading guns now.
See, here's the thing, if we had control of the sliders ourselves, and sliding one up meant all the others slide down, and thus we can fine tune to our own needs...
Now that would be interesting.
Z...
A two second cool down means that you can submit, boost low wake in under 10 sec total. The attacker is basically just dropping into the instance as you leave. Very effective.
I suggest you test this with two ships, one with the supposed faster FSD cooldown and the other without.
Prepare to be dissapointed.
Hush your logic and good game design! That's heresy 'round these parts!
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Yea I know what the FSD charge does. I think it could be useful but either it's not powerful enough or I guess people don't feel like they need it.
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Yea I was really shocked to see that the scanner and limpet mods are just useless filler. The only useful one is the increased ammo capacity for heat sinks and chaff (which doesn't that undermine the heatsink nerf?
But more importantly, diversity in how ships run away from combat was not what I had mind when "diverse modifications" were put forward...
Fair enough but I'll go out on a limb and say you are probably the minority in that case.
Before Engineers there was only one T-6 called "Dilbert", after engineers there's only one T-6 called "Dilbert".
What do you excpect?
Min-maxing is the alpha and the omega.
Max FSD range is always king.
Overcharge rank5 has no Jitter for no reason.
Heat modding is still very effective.
Resistances are more effective than pure MJ due to reload times.
Only some small ships have power\ weight issues.
All the new utility and limpet mods are boring and lack of imagination.
The natural consequence is that there is one perfect build since forever.
Min-maxing is the alpha and the omega.
Max FSD range is always king.
Overcharge rank5 has no Jitter for no reason.
Heat modding is still very effective.
Resistances are more effective than pure MJ due to reload times.
Only some small ships have power\ weight issues.
All the new utility and limpet mods are boring and lack of imagination.
The natural consequence is that there is one perfect build since forever.