So you want to know about the Formidine Rift? (Part 3)

[Masheikh Scytale]

Six months and 5,800 posts later, we are still completely clueless

IMHO this game is sort of Asteroids game. When you reach the edge of the screen ...you appear at the opposite side. Leaving for Beagle Point ! After all ... WHY did Salome fly there ??? mmmmh ?

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Worse then that Crush, seems some of us like going backward :/

Watch your six pal !

 

[Jaiotu]

Six months and 5,800 posts later, we are still completely clueless

Six months? Come January 25th I will have been at this for a year...

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How me-poor-english understands it ... IMHO "broadly correct" means Erimus' Rift is too broad and englobes the actual Formidine Rift which is much more narrow. RR line/pipe across these galactical arms draws THE Formidine Rift.

That is the way I read Drew's statement. The Formidine Rift is somewhere inside the area so-marked on Erimus' map but isn't quite as expansive as he has it marked. We're in the right area but still narrowing it down.

 

[The Lonely Astronaut]

+1 Rep to Finn

 

[IliteratSqirel]

Erimus' position for the Formidine Rift is broadly correct as per the map on this thread, so you are in the right area.
The DW expedition has not been associated with the Rift itself as part of their journey to Beagle point. (They are in tangential directions as per the map)
More will follow.

Thanks so much, Lonely Astronaut for retrieving this - very helpful to read the quote again in context (yes, we've been at this and over all of this too long and too many times.
Can someone please explain to me the use of the word 'tangential' here, please?

I don't get it. Would not 'opposite' have been more intuitive?

 

[Jaiotu]

Thanks so much, Lonely Astronaut for retrieving this - very helpful to read the quote again in context (yes, we've been at this and over all of this too long and too many times.
Can someone please explain to me the use of the word 'tangential' here, please?

I don't get it. Would not 'opposite' have been more intuitive?

I believe that the usage of "tangential" here is indicative that Distant Worlds Expedition and The Formidine Rift are unrelated to each other.

 

[Han_Zen]

"Call me Don Key,,,"

4500 lyr detour,,, just next door

Just arrived,,

EAFOTS XV-I B37-0 http://imgur.com/a/zQZXw

and because its there EAFOTS XV-I B37-1 http://imgur.com/a/cRcRJ

will start detailed scanning

any ideas?
What next?

Nice.

Just scan the hole system and look at the sky in all directions.

Particularly in the direction of the binary hypergiants that are just a few ly away in EAFOTS YE-R E4-0.

I just want to see if it's like this one?

http://www.techtimes.com/articles/9...rbiting-stars-heading-for-a-kiss-of-death.htm

 

[hiciacit]

Which is pretty much what I am thinking.

I think the noted location is a galactic arm too far, and H&S is already beyond the Rift.

Z...

Yep, so do I. We've mentioned it a couple of times before, but it doesn't hurt repeating it now and then. For sure there is no reason why this interpretation of 'the edge of *the* galactic arm' (meaning ours) is any less valid than the more commonly accepted outer arm.

 

[Zeeman]

Z, drew pretty much said Erimus was correct

"Erimus' position for the Formidine Rift is broadly correct as per the map on this thread, so you are in the right area.- Drew"

Yeah, I just saw the expansion of that comment (skimmed it somehow as I read the replies) so I guess my theory is out the window. Problem is, H&S kinda doesn't make sense in that case, as the rift if kinda beyond it... Which, I guess means, in my mind, that that is either the "corrected" path, or the direction we need to look to see whatever it is we're meant to see from the rift. Or not...

Z...

 

[Jorki Rasalas]

Yep, so do I. We've mentioned it a couple of times before, but it doesn't hurt repeating it now and then. For sure there is no reason why this interpretation of 'the edge of *the* galactic arm' (meaning ours) is any less valid than the more commonly accepted outer arm.

One of the books (Lave Revolution) implied that the Rift was much closer:
“Traffic from Reorte is constant,’ Cassom said, manipulating the view to focus on Lave. ‘This appears to be the main trade route. Import/export from Orrere tends to be sporadic and mostly illegal. Reorte to Riedquat is another used trade lane, but local pilots talk about problems in the Formidine Rift; something to do with an unchartable area of space and ships going missing.”

Excerpt From: Stroud, Allen. “Elite: Lave Revolution.” HWS Press. iBooks.

So I wouldn't be at all surprised if we have been looking in the wrong place along the R-R line; however we do have the (relatively) recent EAFOTS signal from the old Cobra in Tionisla graveyard which should hopefully be more precise.

 

[CMDR Moortz]

I'm heading back out there for the third time. The way I see it is, the RR line, EAFOTS, Heart and Soul and the Vain Queen clues are all pointing in the same direction.

So head out in that direction and see what you find. There are enough of us out there.

Something that has been around since beta, something that doesn't involve horizons, something someone might have found but not noticed, something out in the void between the galactic arms.

It's not a red door with a sign saying 'well done Commander'. It's not a USS with a thargoid mother ship. It's not anything obvious that you can look at and go 'well, there it is!'

It has been compared on here to, variously, looking for a needle in a haystack, or a needle in a million haystacks, or a needle in a haystack made of needles - but actually, we don't even know what the needle is.

There aren't really that many things it can be - a 'rogue' planet, a Dyson Sphere, an abandoned station, a devastated planet... I think we need to identify as many things we could be looking for, based on our current knowledge, in order to assist in this search. We know (roughly) where we are looking, we need to work out what we are looking for.

 

[IliteratSqirel]

One of the books (Lave Revolution) implied that the Rift was much closer:
“Traffic from Reorte is constant,’ Cassom said, manipulating the view to focus on Lave. ‘This appears to be the main trade route. Import/export from Orrere tends to be sporadic and mostly illegal. Reorte to Riedquat is another used trade lane, but local pilots talk about problems in the Formidine Rift; something to do with an unchartable area of space and ships going missing.”

Excerpt From: Stroud, Allen. “Elite: Lave Revolution.” HWS Press. iBooks.

So I wouldn't be at all surprised if we have been looking in the wrong place along the R-R line; however we do have the (relatively) recent EAFOTS signal from the old Cobra in Tionisla graveyard which should hopefully be more precise.

I brought this one up in the old thread and it was discussed there. From memory, it was thought to predate the actual rift mystery and hence could be discarded as a hint.

Thanks Jaiotu for clarifying the use of 'tangential' - you might be right.

 

[crushdepth]

I'm heading back out there for the third time. The way I see it is, the RR line, EAFOTS, Heart and Soul and the Vain Queen clues are all pointing in the same direction.

So head out in that direction and see what you find. There are enough of us out there.

Something that has been around since beta, something that doesn't involve horizons, something someone might have found but not noticed, something out in the void between the galactic arms.

It's not a red door with a sign saying 'well done Commander'. It's not a USS with a thargoid mother ship. It's not anything obvious that you can look at and go 'well, there it is!'

It has been compared on here to, variously, looking for a needle in a haystack, or a needle in a million haystacks, or a needle in a haystack made of needles - but actually, we don't even know what the needle is.

There aren't really that many things it can be - a 'rogue' planet, a Dyson Sphere, an abandoned station, a devastated planet... I think we need to identify as many things we could be looking for, based on our current knowledge, in order to assist in this search. We know (roughly) where we are looking, we need to work out what we are looking for.

My pet lunatic theory is a networked AI, distributed through space. Mainly because anything involving another spacefaring civilisation would be kind of hard to hide - ships, habitats, all that infrastructure requured to support life. We would have seen the tracks and signs.

An AI doesn't need all that stuff. It's components could be relatively small, easily concealed.

Edit: For god's sake, when is FD going to stop making us give reasons for editing posts? It's maddening.

 

[CMDR Moortz]

So how would this AI mainfest itself in game? Remember, going on the clues we have had so far there are suggestions that the system/ some of the systems that contain the mystery have been explored or at least visited. USS's and POI's have been ruled out. Systems that contain habitable populations are searchable in the GalMap (see Jacques mystery as an example).

A Dyson Sphere around a secondary star might be a good candidate. It would indicate a degree of sentience, be a singular clue to a further discovery without actually being itself a 'thing', it might exist in a system that has been visited by a commander (I'm not running out 15000 ls to visit that star, move on), it also suggest a fearsome power wielded (something suggestibly worse than Thargoids). It wouldn't involve a POI or USS, in fact by it's very nature a Dyson Sphere wouldn't be anything but the the absence of energy - it might actually require the orbits of a binary star system but you wouldn't be able to see the secondary star, or scan it (as the sphere would be absorbing the energy of the system).

The Kahina link to visiting Sol to investigate something might indicate the point where the Dyson Sphere is activated (the 'star' if visible would then disappear when the Dyson sphere was activated, that disappearance travelling at light speed out from the system it appeared in).

The Sphere might also be a restrictive measure (indicating two sentient civilisations) a la Peter Hamiltons Commonwealth saga, a story I'm sure a certain Sci Fi Author might well be aware of.

In fact, thinking about it, is there a reference in this thread somewhere to indicate when Kahina visited Sol, whereabouts in the direction of the Rift would light have travelled from to give us an indication of a distance?

 

[crushdepth]

So how would this AI mainfest itself in game? Remember, going on the clues we have had so far there are suggestions that the system/ some of the systems that contain the mystery have been explored or at least visited. USS's and POI's have been ruled out. Systems that contain habitable populations are searchable in the GalMap (see Jacques mystery as an example).

A Dyson Sphere around a secondary star might be a good candidate. It would indicate a degree of sentience, be a singular clue to a further discovery without actually being itself a 'thing', it might exist in a system that has been visited by a commander (I'm not running out 15000 ls to visit that star, move on), it also suggest a fearsome power wielded (something suggestibly worse than Thargoids). It wouldn't involve a POI or USS, in fact by it's very nature a Dyson Sphere wouldn't be anything but the the absence of energy - it might actually require the orbits of a binary star system but you wouldn't be able to see the secondary star, or scan it (as the sphere would be absorbing the energy of the system).

The Kahina link to visiting Sol to investigate something might indicate the point where the Dyson Sphere is activated (the 'star' if visible would then disappear when the Dyson sphere was activated, that disappearance travelling at light speed out from the system it appeared in).

The Sphere might also be a restrictive measure (indicating two sentient civilisations) a la Peter Hamiltons Commonwealth saga, a story I'm sure a certain Sci Fi Author might well be aware of.

In fact, thinking about it, is there a reference in this thread somewhere to indicate when Kahina visited Sol, whereabouts in the direction of the Rift would light have travelled from to give us an indication of a distance?

Noting that the Pilot's Federation controls Universal Cartographics and are highly likely to be one of the powers trying to conceal the rift mystery, it would be logical for them to drop a dyson sphere system from the galaxy map, as it should be dark. Which would alao give them a credible excuse for...missing it.

An AI wouldn't have to have that sort of power requirement, alhough William Gibson's AI liked to make themselves smarter which could get out of hand I suppose.

Since FTL communications exist in ED, a spacefaring, networked AI could be distributed across the galaxy. However, until we actually *find something* (throw us a bone FD) we will be confined to idly speculating while drinking beer in our explorer underpants.

 

[Jorki Rasalas]

I brought this one up in the old thread and it was discussed there. From memory, it was thought to predate the actual rift mystery and hence could be discarded as a hint.

Thanks Jaiotu for clarifying the use of 'tangential' - you might be right.

Yes, I don't think the Rift is between Reorte & Riedquat! But neither am I fully convinced that it is exactly where it appears on the current maps. The "Broadly correct" phrase is very vague; does it mean that the centroid is in the correct position but the area size/shape is wrong? Does it mean the centroid position is incorrect but the size/shape is ok? Does it mean that we have it in the correct galaxy?
To my mind the only firm clues we have to the position of the Formidine Rift mystery are that it's somewhere along the R-R line, and EAFOTS is somehow relevant; everything else seems to be too woolly.

 

[[Diplomacy] Carnegie]

Yes, I don't think the Rift is between Reorte & Riedquat! But neither am I fully convinced that it is exactly where it appears on the current maps. The "Broadly correct" phrase is very vague; does it mean that the centroid is in the correct position but the area size/shape is wrong? Does it mean the centroid position is incorrect but the size/shape is ok? Does it mean that we have it in the correct galaxy?
To my mind the only firm clues we have to the position of the Formidine Rift mystery are that it's somewhere along the R-R line, and EAFOTS is somehow relevant; everything else seems to be too woolly.

Where it is is irrelevant until we know WHAT it is.

 

[Masheikh Scytale]

Yes, I don't think the Rift is between Reorte & Riedquat! But neither am I fully convinced that it is exactly where it appears on the current maps. The "Broadly correct" phrase is very vague; does it mean that the centroid is in the correct position but the area size/shape is wrong? Does it mean the centroid position is incorrect but the size/shape is ok? Does it mean that we have it in the correct galaxy?
To my mind the only firm clues we have to the position of the Formidine Rift mystery are that it's somewhere along the R-R line, and EAFOTS is somehow relevant; everything else seems to be too woolly.

That's also my opinion. If we assume pre-game lore provides actual clues, then the Rift must be at the edge and somewhat beyond OUR arm on the RR line (Old Lady iirc). If not, then EAFOTS and H&S and Co and beyond should prevail.

The thing is, "masked" "uncharted" "invisible" "dark stars" stuff comes on and on ... but how game features can possibly allow us to unveil that kind of stuff ? Oh yes .." look I've found the mystery: entire systems disappear from the GalMap and are uncharteable. This one and this one and those too ! " Clap ..clap ..clap ... So what ? Another all that for that ?

 

[Jorki Rasalas]

Where it is is irrelevant until we know WHAT it is.

Well you won't know WHAT it is until you FIND it!
(And perhaps not even then!)

 

[Masheikh Scytale]

Where it is is irrelevant until we know WHAT it is.

Yep. Which makes me ask myself where comes this myth from ?
Formidine Rift: "terra incognitae" where "here be ghosts" , where ships disappear, where tips and logs tell us about " lights whirling around with weird sounds, even in witchspace, making the ships crash .." and so on ..

 

[lorrad]

Nice.

Just scan the hole system and look at the sky in all directions.

Particularly in the direction of the binary hypergiants that are just a few ly away in EAFOTS YE-R E4-0.

I just want to see if it's like this one?
http://images.techtimes.com/data/im...isualization-of-overcontact-binary-system.png
http://www.techtimes.com/articles/9...rbiting-stars-heading-for-a-kiss-of-death.htm

Nothing pops out to me scanning the skybox and those giants in YE-R E4-0 are 160,000 ls apart.

The anagram has the same feel as the vain queen phrase. Did you try going down other paths picking apart 'the moon card mr gin"? Like iv-3 to get iv-c, there are a lot of them. Or that it breaks down into those two images of the moon card and the mr gin label, holding up both and meditating on them for an answer to appear? I guess you did. It's a very evocative anagram.

Salome's now down in her frozen circle of hell, her dark night of the soul and it seems this thread has gone down with her.