At the heart of Brexit lies the belief that Britain alone has the right to assert its own interests.
General / Off-Topic is scotland leaving the UK?
- Thread starter jmg
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At the heart of Brexit lies the belief that Britain alone has the right to assert its own interests.
But what exactly is "the debt issue"? Can we have some numbers.
Considering how brexit went, and if you look at the votes, there were some pools back then too, that generally said, if it was a choice between EU or england, the already insanely close voting for independence, would have been nowhere near close, it would have been a very clear 'bye bye england'
And given brexit has begun now, if the vote comes relatively soon, yeah, it would seem to indicate a very very clear, "Bye bye england." especially given how the brexit vote % were, most of Scotland was very clearly wanting to stay in EU.
Scotland going independent now, is going to hit england very very hard, but...you know, there were plenty of warnings about just that.
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There is no Real Debt Issue. As Scotland has no Contracts that would Bind any UK Debt to them.
I am sure an Agreement on this would be made. But having a National Debt aint much of a Problem.
And the small Share and small Country like Scotland would take. Would be insignificant for the EU.
EU Membership Criteria would likely be no Trouble either. As Scotland is currently in the EU.
Meaning it would not have any Problems just keeping most of the Laws intact.
What Currency will be used is a Difficult one.
Some will say Euro.
Ultimately most Experts expect that Scotland will simply keep the Pound until it Introduces the Euro.
As it has no effect on the Pound regardless of being in the Union or not. There is little problem with that. And it would take time for Scotland to setup its own National Bank to a lvl of providing Currency.
Thing is. Scotland actually has at least a Year until even a Referendum on Independence would be held.
Meaning they can work out these Details.
Unlike the UK they dont have a 2 year Limit and wont be sitting on the Dry if they leave the UK
And a lot of other issues as well, but apparently it's all "scare mongering" and "experts".
Who knows, guess we will wait and see, but a lot of the times various experts and such make those comments I wonder what they are basing it on.
I mean last I checked right now a lot of oil and such that 'really' belongs to scotland goes directly to england and such, and while many seem to say Scotlands economy isn't doing as great as the english, a lot of the english economy seems to my knowledge based around stuff that is there because of Scotland.
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Nothing "wrong" about it.
Thing is, as I wrote above, a lot of the english economy seems to be based around stuff related to Scotland, so if they suddenly lose that? that's a big chunk out of their economy.
Minonian
Banned
TM thinks is... Big mistake, here comes out, all of this nothing to do with honor the people's will but the whole thing is about a pretty political gain, at the cost of her own homeland future, and possibly? Existence.
Couldn't much the same be said of the UK leaving the EU? I fail to see the difference.
Google it and make your own mind up. But a quick google I found that the IFS reckons the below https://www.ifs.org.uk/publications/8218
The required entry to the EU is 3% or projections showing it will hit that.
A larger question is that of currency and EU membership.
Adept has me on block, but he/she should be pointed at GERS - the Scottish governments own financial figures. Pay attention to how they're drawn up and why.
We're talking about an approximate 20% budget deficit, combined with a divorce from 80% of Scotland's export market.
No reason not to have a referendum but certainly a major factor in any future decision.
We're talking about an approximate 20% budget deficit, combined with a divorce from 80% of Scotland's export market.
No reason not to have a referendum but certainly a major factor in any future decision.
There is no Real Debt Issue. As Scotland has no Contracts that would Bind any UK Debt to them.
I am sure an Agreement on this would be made. But having a National Debt aint much of a Problem.
And the small Share and small Country like Scotland would take. Would be insignificant for the EU.
EU Membership Criteria would likely be no Trouble either. As Scotland is currently in the EU.
Meaning it would not have any Problems just keeping most of the Laws intact.
What Currency will be used is a Difficult one.
Some will say Euro.
Ultimately most Experts expect that Scotland will simply keep the Pound until it Introduces the Euro.
As it has no effect on the Pound regardless of being in the Union or not. There is little problem with that. And it would take time for Scotland to setup its own National Bank to a lvl of providing Currency.
Thing is. Scotland actually has at least a Year until even a Referendum on Independence would be held.
Meaning they can work out these Details.
Unlike the UK they dont have a 2 year Limit and wont be sitting on the Dry if they leave the UK
But my key point is, all the above is pure speculation in the same way as the brexit stuff is speculation. So why is NS pointing fingers when the same can be said for her?
All people are looking for is a bit of honesty.
They can start using the Euro, keep using the Pound, or launch their own currency. Nothing too difficult about any of those options. It's just bureaucracy and maths. If it was me I'd just adopt the Euro as the official currency ASAP, but they have plenty of options.
If they want to go let them go. If they really want to go, let the English vote as well, their independence would be a certainty.
I think GERS has very little credibility, as figures for Scotland are deliberately opaque. Figures and liabilities are lumped with the UK as a whole, in other words pretty useless.
Scotland doesn't have any debt. It can't borrow, so it can't have debt. The UK borrows and spends it on whatever it likes, then attributes a share of that to Scotland. It's a meaningless exercise in accounting. In our last referendum, the UK Treasury (no friends to Scottish independence) confirmed this, saying that an independent Scotland would start with no debt and that the UK would assume Scotland's share of the UK debt.
Also, neither currency nor Europe are problems really.
Indeed it could a lot of the english economy relies on EU trade, in general the advantages of leaving are the one's that are overplayed, not the disadvantages of staying.
GERS was created as a political tool for Westminster to use against economic argument for Scottish independence. As all economists who've expressed a view have said, it's meaningless. The only exception to that is an amateur blogger and owner of a loss making pet supplies company who seems to be the only person the media ask about it.
ETA - GERS by economists
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If the UK wanted to play hardball Scotland can walk away debt free as the UK sovereign holds and is liable for all the debt, as was confirmed in 2014.
Add to that the fact that the Scots could use Sterling, or a Scottish pound pegged to Sterling or a basket of currencies inc. the Euro depending on its trading ratios with such currencies. There is nothing bar military invasion that the Ruk could do.
Add to that the fact that the Scots could use Sterling, or a Scottish pound pegged to Sterling or a basket of currencies inc. the Euro depending on its trading ratios with such currencies. There is nothing bar military invasion that the Ruk could do.
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Just to be clear. I am playing devil's advocate because I find TM and anyone agreeing with her decision to disallow a vote to be very hypocritical.