Walking Around Space Stations - What Would You Like To See?
- Thread starter Zaine
- Start date
Sorry, when ever I think about this, I end up visualising long boring walks to achieve anything
Unless there is a real reason in the form of strong enjoyable game objectives to walking around, I think it will wear thin very quickly.
For me, whenever these FPS games appear with incredibly-rendered environments, the one thing that makes them feel flat is their lack of interactivity.
If I can't pick up, open, read, climb upon, use and change everything that I can see, then the environment is little more than just a pretty background. So I would hope FD would put the focus on making everything that is visible to be usable.
I would rather an averagely-rendered environment with 99% interactivity than have a photorealistic environment with little interactivity.
One of the things that is a big danger for the "station bar" thing is the empty bar, in which there is no reason to be, besides maybe sprinting up to an NPC, standing there a moment and sprinting back to your ship.
I've long dreamed of a game (cyberpunk 2020 or shadowrun were my images) where interacting with players in the bar was a critical "minigame."
Example:
You walk into the station bar and look around. You see players sitting at tables, some together some alone. You see players with the gameboard in front of them, waiting for a wager, you see others sipping drinks.
You approach a drink sipper and say something e.g. "hey guy, I'm looking for someone to make carry a shipment for me."
Then the player can respond with "Eff off" or "What are you paying." or whatever. After a little banter a contract is formed for both players, which is a mission. One player completes it, the other transfers the payment (could be creds, could be cargo, ship or what-have-you.
The incentive to not brick the mission or stiff in payment is a "business rep" type thing, which is viewable when you encounter the guy in the bar. You see a guy with a dis-rep and you move on till you find someone that seems like a good bet for your cargo.. Who knows, maybe you need someone now and wind up going with a risky contact. Might be a good idea to hire someone else to watchdog him, or do it yourself.
Anyway, this kind of a mechanic makes walking into the bar to pick up missions a multiplayer experience, and not only that, adds an entire layer of depth to the game.
I want to play a game like this. Player generated content, player generated reward - a potentially unique mission every time. Tasks could be escort, travel, deliver, scout etc. Payment could be credits, cargo, information, ships, whatever. Also, any number or parameters could be defined like time frame, allowed range, etc.
One other note: I very specifically DO NOT picture the eve online contract type thing. Though a message-board type system might be okay for simple, above-board delivery missions, smuggling, illicit bounties and the like will need to be done face to face in the cantina a-la Han Solo.
Also it would differ from the lifeless eve contract thing in that many parameters could be defined, making the mission more interesting and less like a simple delivery.
I've long dreamed of a game (cyberpunk 2020 or shadowrun were my images) where interacting with players in the bar was a critical "minigame."
Example:
You walk into the station bar and look around. You see players sitting at tables, some together some alone. You see players with the gameboard in front of them, waiting for a wager, you see others sipping drinks.
You approach a drink sipper and say something e.g. "hey guy, I'm looking for someone to make carry a shipment for me."
Then the player can respond with "Eff off" or "What are you paying." or whatever. After a little banter a contract is formed for both players, which is a mission. One player completes it, the other transfers the payment (could be creds, could be cargo, ship or what-have-you.
The incentive to not brick the mission or stiff in payment is a "business rep" type thing, which is viewable when you encounter the guy in the bar. You see a guy with a dis-rep and you move on till you find someone that seems like a good bet for your cargo.. Who knows, maybe you need someone now and wind up going with a risky contact. Might be a good idea to hire someone else to watchdog him, or do it yourself.
Anyway, this kind of a mechanic makes walking into the bar to pick up missions a multiplayer experience, and not only that, adds an entire layer of depth to the game.
I want to play a game like this. Player generated content, player generated reward - a potentially unique mission every time. Tasks could be escort, travel, deliver, scout etc. Payment could be credits, cargo, information, ships, whatever. Also, any number or parameters could be defined like time frame, allowed range, etc.
One other note: I very specifically DO NOT picture the eve online contract type thing. Though a message-board type system might be okay for simple, above-board delivery missions, smuggling, illicit bounties and the like will need to be done face to face in the cantina a-la Han Solo.
Also it would differ from the lifeless eve contract thing in that many parameters could be defined, making the mission more interesting and less like a simple delivery.
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That to me sounds like an incredible waste of effort - Man years of effort so books can be moved and opened? Switches operated? Chairs swivelled? And all time that could be invested in actual gameplay with depth and interest.
I'm confused why people think walking along corridors and opening doors will be of any interest after an hour or two? People seem obsessed with it. IMHO unless there's actual interesting gameplay behind it, it'll get tired and boring very quickly!
For years players of Egosofts X series of games asked about entering stations, and walking about on them.
With X Reunion players got their wish.
One of the most popular mods was one which removed the necessity for station landings....
I like Ipecac's emergent gameplay ideas, hopefully something can develop along those lines, but I don't believe a first person walking around metagame is necessary for that, or Elite.
That said, it would be nice to get up out of the seat and have a wander around the ship, for a few minutes anyway.
To do it right, needs a LOT of effort, and tbh I would prefer that time was spent in the shorter term on all things planetary landing.
With X Reunion players got their wish.
One of the most popular mods was one which removed the necessity for station landings....
I like Ipecac's emergent gameplay ideas, hopefully something can develop along those lines, but I don't believe a first person walking around metagame is necessary for that, or Elite.
That said, it would be nice to get up out of the seat and have a wander around the ship, for a few minutes anyway.
To do it right, needs a LOT of effort, and tbh I would prefer that time was spent in the shorter term on all things planetary landing.
With the risk of repeating myself... Why? Unless there is actual game benefit personally I'd rather see all those development man hours spent creating something that will truly extend the game. Would you rather walk around a space stations opening doors and getting on trains... Or see some far more varied/indepth space based game play/missions?
The only way I can see walking around as being fun is if there's gameplay to merit it, and even then it risks treading into the realms of being a FPS, of which there are countless, many of which I suspect - being dedicated to the task - will be more adept at it?
I'd like to see all sorts of environments, from high class office and and shopping districts, to low class "Blade Runneresque" market places.
I think there should be the option to purchase accommodation. From crumbling rat infested dumps, to penthouse apartments with a space view of the docking port. You could use the accommodation as an alternative save point, clothing change area, and a place to check out the news feeds (are there going to be news feeds?)
There should be pubs. What better place to buy something dodgy, or take on some seedy contract than off a bloke you met down the pub! these could also be a meeting place for you and your team.
There should also be stores - for ship parts/upgrades, weapons, scanners etc. And Massive show rooms for ships, like car sales places - from the brand new Bentley/BMW types, down to the crumby used ("one careful lady owner, honest gov!") Sidewinder salesmen. And clothing, ship painters, small arms dealers, warehouse outlets (for your main ship trading stuff) etc.
Of course you should also be able to do it all from your ship, but you should be able to get a better deal on foot. In fact you should also be able to live your life in game as just a ship passenger/turret gunner.
There should be war zones/unidentified signals on the ground/in stations for the odd bits and bobs, there should also be contracts on the ground.
If you ignore all of the above I wont mind if...
Above all, please, please, PLEASE don't make it feel like C.O.D. or Battlefield. Make it more like the Arma series - its based on the Virtual Battlefield Simulator which various military forces around the world (including the British Army) use for training, and therefore much more realistic.
Just my 2p worth. You get a lot for your money from me!!
Brian
That's fine. All that? FD said ok, they'll have a rough test by 2025. Do you realise there isn't a magic button that just adds all that stuff?
I understand you were saying what you would 'like' to see but this just proves my previous point that people are expecting too much with the walking around stations part. You want all that but it has to be totally different in each station no doubt?
Perhaps they will give us a basic framework and add on over time but do not expect what you listed straight away.
Pessimist! I think FD will do fantastically, I realise that not all of what I said in my post won't happen, but whatever FD do put into the game will be great.
Brian
Such as what? The options are very limited if you're going to abide by the traditional gameplay of being a pilot permanently glued to their seat.
You must have an extraordinary imagination if you can come up with more ideas for gameplay variation and opportunities as a permanently seat-bound pilot, than what others can come up with from EVA or other avatar based gameplay.
This isn't the best example but what if you were glued to the driver's seat in GTA? What if you could only ride and control a dragon in Skyrim?
David Braben said the inception and inspiration of Elite was the create the most open-world and sandbox type experience possible for a game. He chose space because it is by far the easiest, because space is empty.
On that premise, you could have a space-centric game with endless cubic lightyears of game space to roam around, and for what purpose? That has no content, depth or meaning. Elite: Dangerous is inspired with the gargantuan difference and advancement in gaming technology; David Braben can finally realise his long-time vision of that sandbox game, and it no longer has to be constrained to being set in virtually empty space. He can add content to that space. He can add gameplay, interactivity, diversity, scope, and depth to that space.
It doesn't seem like ED is going to be clutching on to old times and nostalgia of being a purely space pilot experience, because that would be inhibiting and superficial. Fall into that nostalgia trap and you'll have nothing more than the same game from 20-30 years ago with the graphics of today. Start from point A, fly to point B, fly back to A: basically what the Beta is now, may appeal to the hardcore Elite community of decades ago, but I wonder how very niche that community is. I know there's zero appeal in that for me. I'd get bored and forget it within 2 hours if a demo was available.
Bottomline: I could be mistaken, but it seems like DB's vision for ED is a lot more than a sequel to the old games. It's no longer a space piloting sim, but a much larger project that includes the features of a space piloting sim.
Get rid of the free sidewinder and 1000 credits.
Find yourself broke without a ship?
You're going to have to earn credits working on a station.
Could be working a lifter in the docks shenmue style or mugging pilots on shore leave.
To appreciate the large scale universe a knowledge of the small scale is needed.
Find yourself broke without a ship?
You're going to have to earn credits working on a station.
Could be working a lifter in the docks shenmue style or mugging pilots on shore leave.
To appreciate the large scale universe a knowledge of the small scale is needed.
I expect to get slated for this but I have to wonder how successful FD are going to be with this aspect of the game. Bethesda will spend enough to keep a small country going on the likes of Fallout 3 and in this game it is an expansion pack. There is something to be said for being excellent at what you are good at and sticking to it.
