The PIRACY Thread - new ideas for changes needed to make it more viable as a Role

Willa Allason

Willa Allason
Have you ever been Pirated by NPC and given Cargo and then let go on your way? - YES
Have you been Pirated by a Player and given Cargo and then let go on your way? - YES
Have you tried Piracy without trying to kill the Ship and picked up Cargo? - YES (NPC only)
What Cargo do you hope to find and what is it's value? - Rare goods or anything over 5k/ton
Have you tried Piracy in Multicrew? - NO
If any of the above what Mode do you Pirate in: SOLO/GROUP/OPEN? - OPEN
Why did you try Piracy else would you like to? - It's fun and intense but not a high-paying career
Can you suggest how to improve this Role to become even more viable? - Hmm, more credits/hour. What if you could Privateer for the Empire, Feds or Alliance, and gain privateer bonds for disrupting the rival superpower's shipping on top of the cargo?

AND a demand cargo button.
There is no good way to solve the combat logging issue though I'm afraid.
 
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X-Terminator

Banned
X-Terminator
Obvious patterns are arising here and is an education for curiosity I believe. The thing is though, keeping us playing as such a Role which will in fact draw players together with less of a fear to be killed and mistaken for Psycho Killers. Yes, they still need to instil a threat else they get ignored. The threat of losing your Shields is harmful but not deadly and many Players would prefer to run away instead. However, a new weapon to disable a Sub-System fully without destruction and taking away any other Hardpoint Weapon capability would ensure this threat to be more viable. Oh man just think of the embarrassment of being frozen adrift whilst you get your Cargo stripped away and are totally left helpless except if you had Multicrew Turrets to get a lock on them.

Yes Wings Of Psycho Killers are a real problem here. ENTER new C&P system.
 
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Madrax573

Madrax573
In EVE I was a sometime Bounty Hunter and sometime Pirate. 90% pvp related and really fancy having a go in Elite.

However I suspect it may be more fun here as piracy in EVE was none existent in terms of making viable isk.

For me though I'm not sure what ship/fit to be using for piracy. I have Ideas but until I go and do it well. And as for PVP (piracy or BH) it seems more pronounced around the need for high grade engineering etc.

However when I flew in EVE (I really must stop making comparisons) I loved flying cheap junk and still being able to be decent at pvp. I hope this is also the case in Elite....
 

fergal

fergal
  • Have you ever been Pirated by NPC and given Cargo and then let go on your way? - Yes, was mining for engineers, and dropped stuff I didn't want and they left me alone.
  • Have you been Pirated by a Player and given Cargo and then let go on your way? - Yes, CODE guys at several CGs
  • Have you tried Piracy without trying to kill the Ship and picked up Cargo? - Yes for missions against NPC, tried pirating players, 0 tons collected, they would rather die.
  • What Cargo do you hope to find and what is it's value? - Other than mission specific cargo, anything worth the cr to make it remotely worth your time.
  • Have you tried Piracy in Multicrew? - No
  • If any of the above what Mode do you Pirate in: SOLO/GROUP/OPEN? - Open
  • Why did you try Piracy else would you like to? - Boredom
  • Can you suggest how to improve this Role to become even more viable? - Time is the main problem. Time to find a viable target, time to get cargo to drop, time to collect cargo. Collecting bounties is very easy and quick, and just had a massive buff by allowing players in wings to somehow collect the full bounty each, which makes no sense.
    There are no piracy wing mechanics, no way to share cr. You need to drop pirated loot for the other wing members, and then they need to collect it. More time needed for this (if you have the cargo racks)
 

Faybs

Faybs
X-Terminator said:
Obvious patterns are arising here and is an education for curiosity I believe. The thing is though, keeping us playing as such a Role which will in fact draw players together with less of a fear to be killed and mistaken for Psycho Killers. Yes, they still need to instil a threat else they get ignored. The threat of losing your Shields is harmful but not deadly and many Players would prefer to run away instead. However, a new weapon to disable a Sub-System fully without destruction and taking away any other Hardpoint Weapon capability would ensure this threat to be more viable. Oh man just think of the embarrassment of being frozen adrift whilst you get your Cargo stripped away and are totally left helpless except if you had Multicrew Turrets to get a lock on them.

Yes Wings Of Psycho Killers are a real problem here. ENTER new C&P system.
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I think this is looking at things from the wrong angle - C&P is just going to increase fines, Sandro already said so. The most popular pirate I've yet seen in ED is that guy who did it in an unarmed sidey and would d'aaw people into giving him loot. I know that if I were to give piracy a try I wouldn't do it in anything bigger than a cobra; I'm not going to be able to scoop up 100t of stuff anyway, and if I look too intimidating the mark would probably think I'm a ganker and combat log to save himself.
 
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X-Terminator

Banned
X-Terminator
This is why I found both Cobras & probably Keelback to be the perfect Ships as they are also Multicrew and you require speed and efficiency to defend and collect. I still want to do it much more efficiently to pick more up is the point. Multicrew does add that extra pip for both defence and speed to run when needed also. It should also therefore provide much higher yields in doing so. Just fix the Collectors (no limits) and see how it goes.
 
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Faybs

Faybs
X-Terminator said:
This is why I found both Cobras & probably Keelback to be the perfect Ships as they are also Multicrew and you require speed and efficiency to defend and collect. I still want to do it much more efficiently to pick more up is the point. Multicrew does add that extra pip for both defence and speed to run when needed also. It should also therefore provide much higher yields in doing so. Just fix the Collectors (no limits) and see how it goes.
Click to expand...

Not to mention the SLF to catch the mark if they decide to pull a runner.
 

varonica

varonica
​

  • Have you ever been Pirated by NPC and given Cargo and then let go on your way? - NO
  • Have you been Pirated by a Player and given Cargo and then let go on your way? - NO
  • Have you tried Piracy without trying to kill the Ship and picked up Cargo? - NO
  • What Cargo do you hope to find and what is it's value? - N/A
  • Have you tried Piracy in Multicrew? - N/A
  • If any of the above what Mode do you Pirate in: SOLO/GROUP/OPEN? - N/A
  • Why did you try Piracy else would you like to? - N/A
  • Can you suggest how to improve this Role to become even more viable? - Nothing.
  • and before you ask, no I will never try piracy as a role in game.
 

Faybs

Faybs
varonica said:
​

  • Have you ever been Pirated by NPC and given Cargo and then let go on your way? - NO
  • Have you been Pirated by a Player and given Cargo and then let go on your way? - NO
  • Have you tried Piracy without trying to kill the Ship and picked up Cargo? - NO
  • What Cargo do you hope to find and what is it's value? - N/A
  • Have you tried Piracy in Multicrew? - N/A
  • If any of the above what Mode do you Pirate in: SOLO/GROUP/OPEN? - N/A
  • Why did you try Piracy else would you like to? - N/A
  • Can you suggest how to improve this Role to become even more viable? - Nothing.
  • and before you ask, no I will never try piracy as a role in game.
Click to expand...

If you're avoiding piracy because you don't want to ruin someone's day, but would like to add some spice to your travels, I recommend you try smuggling. Gets the old heart pumping, scratches that anti-social itch and no-one's looking at a rebuy screen.
 

Agony_Aunt

Agony_Aunt
X-Terminator said:
What drew you to try Pirating - perhaps you wanted to test out the tools for the Ship Build OR wanted to test it on Players and be a badass but with respect?

I think Multicrew Piracy does have advantages here. I kitted out the Cobra MkIV with 3 Beam Turrets for my Crew as they are on top rather than underneath (Cobra Mk III) so are good when pulling up in any defence. Helm can concentrate on where the Collector Limpet is and if near any cargo to pickup thus making it keep up and waste nothing whilst shorten the collection time.
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Oh right.

Well, in general I roleplay a good guy but who will stoop to bad activities to further the cause of his group. So less a pirate, more of a privateer or agent provocateur. But also because unlike many activities, its not just single stage, it requires a bit of skill, takes some brains/knowlege, and can be highly profitable. At least on the PvE side. If i were to do PvP piracy, it would be purely for the roleplay. I don't see it ever being a proftable venture for PvP, or any sort of activity where people will generally be happy with being pirated, as there is nothing in it for the target. So, i'd only do it if i could give something to the target, and that can really only be via roleplay fun. Back in the day, i was interdicted a couple of times by Code, and one of them was very memorable for the roleplay they gave. Lots of arrr's and matey's in their speech ;)
 

Moesis

M
  • Have you ever been Pirated by NPC and given Cargo and then let go on your way? - Not on purpose (dropped scavenged illegal cargo in prep for system security showing up for when I fought him)
  • Have you been Pirated by a Player and given Cargo and then let go on your way? - NO
  • Have you tried Piracy without trying to kill the Ship and picked up Cargo? - Yes (missions)
  • What Cargo do you hope to find and what is it's value? - Mission defined, but anything gold (maybe silver)+ and rares
  • Have you tried Piracy in Multicrew? - No
  • If any of the above what Mode do you Pirate in: SOLO/GROUP/OPEN? - Group (PvE)
  • Why did you try Piracy else would you like to? - Usually if option presents itself, i.e. they attack but drop cargo, or missions
  • Can you suggest how to improve this Role to become even more viable?

One very simple thing I've not noticed mentioned is allow us to make a demand to NPC's. Currently they can to us but we can't to them. Could be simple drop your cargo, or let us select the cargo they have that we want. They may or may not comply but it would add an option and help create the feeling of a more interactive world. Could also be fun to do it on pirates trying to pirate us. Won't make it more viable but would be more enjoyable. And ships, stealing ships one day (if only npc) would be awesome, along with robbing outposts/stations but that's far off stuff.
 

ArchEmperor

ArchEmperor
Allow the option to capture ships and sell them ( or keep as new flagship ). That is worth WAY more than any cargo.

Just allow to take them in tow ( or use crewmembers to pilot them ).


A small Cobra MKIII beats a BIG Anaconda in battle. Now he captures the Anaconda and take it as his new flagship, and sells the old MKIII.
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BigBANGtheory [VR]

BigBANGtheory [VR]
I think there needs to be some exchange of comms to agree a non-lethal take down which is then enforced by the game, there has to be some incentive for the victim to co-operate otherwise you'll get pirating followed up with murder which if it happens too frequently or left unchecked will just ruin the whole experience.
 

NeilF

NeilF
X-Terminator said:
Please copy/paste then complete the following Survey to help FD out here: - ​

  • Have you ever been Pirated by NPC and given Cargo and then let go on your way? -
  • Have you been Pirated by a Player and given Cargo and then let go on your way? -
  • Have you tried Piracy without trying to kill the Ship and picked up Cargo? -
  • What Cargo do you hope to find and what is it's value? -
  • Have you tried Piracy in Multicrew? -
  • If any of the above what Mode do you Pirate in: SOLO/GROUP/OPEN? -
  • Why did you try Piracy else would you like to? -
  • Can you suggest how to improve this Role to become even more viable? -


(It's a BIG Role in this game and it even has Paint Jobs & Decals & Outposts!)

​
ps You can select Go Advanced and Select All then add Bullet Points for easier reading.

THANK YOU,
o7 XT
Click to expand...

"Have you ever been Pirated by NPC and given Cargo and then let go on your way?" - YES (needs a simpler/slicker way to hand over cargo. eg: Dedicated option?)
"Have you been Pirated by a Player and given Cargo and then let go on your way?" - YES (but more frequently I've been interdicted, and without a word, been fired up)
"Have you tried Piracy without trying to kill the Ship and picked up Cargo?" - YES (my prefered play style, and what the game should reward)
"What Cargo do you hope to find and what is it's value?" - Anything to reward it. It's nigh on impossible to turn a profit in OPEN.
"Have you tried Piracy in Multicrew?" - NO (Why would I want to simplify the gameplay?)
"If any of the above what Mode do you Pirate in: SOLO/GROUP/OPEN?" - OPEN
"Why did you try Piracy else would you like to?" - Penalties for destroying target. Missions to bolster/reward piracy.



"Can you suggest how to improve this Role to become even more viable?":-
  • The illegal destruction of any Pilots Federation member should damage your reputation. At high enough levels you get penalised (eg: X times in Y period). ie: A Crime and Punishment mechanic.
  • Specific location (eg: CGs or BGS) should offer specific piracy bases missions to steal cargo. Meanwhile a CG goal (or trading missions with rewards) should send traders to that same location. ie: To orchestrate "hot spots".
  • The new cargo hatch breaker mechanics are shallow. You should at least need to reduce shields down (eg: to 1 bar) before you can lock on a cargo hatch breaker.
  • Cargo hatch breakers needs to eject more sensible amounts of cargo. Try getting a sensible amount of cargo out of a T9 (eg: 40t)?
  • Security response times are often daft. Even trying to be a "good pirate" and not damage your victim, security is often there before you can pick up more and 1-2t of cargo.
  • Exiting to menu should show the timer to all CMDRs in the instance. If you are shot during your 15 seconds count down, another 15 seconds is added on (the first time).
  • Combat logging should be monitored and repeat detections warned about (eg: X times in Y period), and then penalised.


Crime and Punishment and "Hot Spots" - https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showt...-Reputation-quot-and-quot-Risk-Hot-Spots-quot

Bundle Cargo to aid ejection/collection - https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showt...aid-to-piracy-instancing-and-collection-speed



Piracy, like many of the core professions/gameplay have been ignored for 2+ years now: Shallow, simplistic and needs desperate attention.
 
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Comrade Napoleon

Comrade Napoleon
NeilF said:
"Have you ever been Pirated by NPC and given Cargo and then let go on your way?" - YES (needs a simpler/slicker way to hand over cargo. eg: Dedicated option?)
"Have you been Pirated by a Player and given Cargo and then let go on your way?" - YES (but more frequently I've been interdicted, and without a word, been fired up)
"Have you tried Piracy without trying to kill the Ship and picked up Cargo?" - YES (my prefered play style, and what the game should reward)
"What Cargo do you hope to find and what is it's value?" - Anything to reward it. It's nigh on impossible to turn a profit in OPEN.
"Have you tried Piracy in Multicrew?" - NO (Why would I want to simplify the gameplay?)
"If any of the above what Mode do you Pirate in: SOLO/GROUP/OPEN?" - OPEN
"Why did you try Piracy else would you like to?" - Penalties for destroying target. Missions to bolster/reward piracy.



"Can you suggest how to improve this Role to become even more viable?":-
  • The illegal destruction of any Pilots Federation member should damage your reputation. At high enough levels you get penalised (eg: X times in Y period). ie: A Crime and Punishment mechanic.
  • Specific location (eg: CGs or BGS) should offer specific piracy bases missions to steal cargo. Meanwhile a CG goal (or trading missions with rewards) should send traders to that same location. ie: To orchestrate "hot spots".
  • The new cargo hatch breaker mechanics are shallow. You should at least need to reduce shields down (eg: to 1 bar) before you can lock on a cargo hatch breaker.
  • Cargo hatch breakers needs to eject more sensible amounts of cargo. Try getting a sensible amount of cargo out of a T9 (eg: 40t)?
  • Security response times are often daft. Even trying to be a "good pirate" and not damage your victim, security is often there before you can pick up more and 1-2t of cargo.
  • Exiting to menu should show the timer to all CMDRs in the instance. If you are shot during your 15 seconds count down, another 15 seconds is added on (the first time).
  • Combat logging should be monitored and repeat detections warned about (eg: X times in Y period), and then penalised.


Crime and Punishment and "Hot Spots" - https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showt...-Reputation-quot-and-quot-Risk-Hot-Spots-quot

Bundle Cargo to aid ejection/collection - https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showt...aid-to-piracy-instancing-and-collection-speed



Piracy, like many of the core professions/gameplay have been ignored for 2+ years now: Shallow, simplistic and needs desperate attention.
Click to expand...

I think OP is unaware of how many CMDR's that have called out for improvements to this profession. And how many suggestions that have cropped up in 2,5 years since release.
Instead, we have a deeply polarized community, "Carebears" and "Gankers" , both entrenched into their positions as the game's current mechanics are plain stupid, ill conceived and apeear added as an afterthought.
Piracy in itself is not ganking or griefing, but how do you discern between a pirate or a "game disrupter" , you cant!! Not even on forums as naming and shaming is against the rules, and in game it is not existent.:rolleyes:

Fd made the bed, unfortunately we have to lie in it...

Cheers Cmdr's
 

DaggerSnake

DaggerSnake
A lot of the suggestions for Piracy are nice vs NPC because they can be programed to act the victim, but if you are more interested in the emergent gameplay of Piracy vs players, there's still nothing in it for the Merchant. There needs to be a reason to take the risk of being pirated. Good, in-game reasons.
 
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