Why is salvaging not a viable Elite career? Why is it illegal?
- Thread starter SRRAE
- Start date
I don't think you can compare this to people leaving cars and you taking it home. If anything it will be closer to the maritime salvage. If it's a wreck and you find it, you can salvage it. (there is the complication of insurance companies, but this is a game, simplify it)
As someone said, occupied escape pods and black boxe are legal salvage in space, the rest is not. Rare Artwork etc remains illegal in space. Personally I find it more fun whether scavenging or hunting for mission cargo that there is a degree of the llegal about this.
I do think the idea of a permitto salvage has some legs, I think a super power or power level permit would bee too larger area, on the other hand I think minor faction level may be too small area.
Simon
I do think the idea of a permitto salvage has some legs, I think a super power or power level permit would bee too larger area, on the other hand I think minor faction level may be too small area.
Simon
Salvaging is a perfectly viable career path - looting on the other hand...
I've made millions from Legal Salvage - largely on planet surfaces, but on occasion, in space as well.
Looting, however - harvesting the jettisoned cargo of ill-fated ships, usually ejected when pirates attack.. that's another matter entirely. It can be compared to showing up at a murder scene and taking the contents of the victim's wallet.
Sure, they don't need it any more, but it's still not there for the taking.
I've made millions from Legal Salvage - largely on planet surfaces, but on occasion, in space as well.
Looting, however - harvesting the jettisoned cargo of ill-fated ships, usually ejected when pirates attack.. that's another matter entirely. It can be compared to showing up at a murder scene and taking the contents of the victim's wallet.
Sure, they don't need it any more, but it's still not there for the taking.
The car comparison is a way to describe the current system in the game. Even though it may be a wreck, it is still somebody else's property, therefore you steal it when you 'salvage' it.
I would have thought it would be more like maritime rules for salvage as well, but there may well be a technical reason why they didn't set it up like that.
Salvaging one area I can imagine some nice new elements of gameplay being introduced for maybe? - https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showt...engine-be-used-for-gameplay?highlight=physics
Wrecked ship salvage should be a thing in ED.
Finding working Modules in dead ships, Using a special limpet and scanner to find and extract it. Hull alloys, components for engineering and cargo.
its such an interesting idea that needs to be fleshed out.
Finding working Modules in dead ships, Using a special limpet and scanner to find and extract it. Hull alloys, components for engineering and cargo.
its such an interesting idea that needs to be fleshed out.
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I agree here - and in keeping with Module salvage - Salvaged Modules could then be used to make our Engineers feel more like Engineers, by taking them to them, turning them over to them to work with, and getting a Pop-up message from said Engineer: "Hey, I finished with that thing you brought me. You should come see what I figured out."
Just because it's illegal... I guess you never heard of a black market yet. Lol. I guess your a griefer cryer too. Who wants 0 danger and to just play space trucks. Again LOL.
There still are. I took a couple yesterday. However, it's no longer as clear beforehand whether it's a legal or illegal salvage mission. If you have an active legal space salvage mission, all non -stolen space salvage is considered legal, even if it's not the thing you're after.
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I don't have a problem with space salvage being illegal as it is at present. There could be changes to he status but I don't think it is the most important thing for a reasonable salvage career.
Salvage is a decent credit earner early game. A few high value canisters can be a nice bonus if you are flying your starter Sidewinder or step up ship. When I reset my save it made a useful extra income stream to get me going.
The problem with salvage is that it doesn't scale well. You will be lucky to find more than dozen canisters at a time. Compared to mining, where bigger and better ships increase efficiency, there is a low and hard cap on the efficiency of salvaging. The simplest way to make salvaging a more compelling activity would be to have more stuff to collect. I was hoping the "debris fields" you sometimes find would be full of goodies but they seem to have no more stuff that common USSs.
With locations chock full of goodies floating in space you would encourage players to come up with builds for efficient salvage. Add some threat from NPC law enforcers, pirates and competing salvagers and you could get some interesting gameplay.
Salvage is a decent credit earner early game. A few high value canisters can be a nice bonus if you are flying your starter Sidewinder or step up ship. When I reset my save it made a useful extra income stream to get me going.
The problem with salvage is that it doesn't scale well. You will be lucky to find more than dozen canisters at a time. Compared to mining, where bigger and better ships increase efficiency, there is a low and hard cap on the efficiency of salvaging. The simplest way to make salvaging a more compelling activity would be to have more stuff to collect. I was hoping the "debris fields" you sometimes find would be full of goodies but they seem to have no more stuff that common USSs.
With locations chock full of goodies floating in space you would encourage players to come up with builds for efficient salvage. Add some threat from NPC law enforcers, pirates and competing salvagers and you could get some interesting gameplay.
Blackcompany
Banned
Can the people who support this mess of nonsensical, illogical, disparate Mechanics FDev call a game please, for once, DO IT WITHOUT PERSONAL ATTACKS?
I don't think you can.
That Salvaging is not a perfectly legal career is ridiculous. It makes ZERO sense, in universe. If you tell me to do it, it's fine. But if I take the initiative and try and return your salvage proactively, I'm a criminal?
That's just lazy design.
That's not entirely fair. There are plenty of people who seem to hate this game who resort to personal attacks in these forums as well. It's not a problem of "which side your on" it's an individual issue. Some people go on personal attacks ... regardless of which "side they are on". Though I have to wonder why people who hate this game so much fell the need to spend so much energy attacking it and the people who are still enraptured by it. I bought this game three years ago, play it almost every day, and even though it isn't perfect and I've spent way too much on the game then I'd care to admit this is still the number one dollar per hour investment in entertainment that I've made in my 47 years on this planet.
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It's ok for those starting off but this is one of the problems, there are few 'careers' that really pay off for a vet of the game.
I'm maybe misunderstanding what people are asking for but I thought the whole point of the salvaging role was that you had to smuggle the stuff in, in a ship built for it.
You can do what you're asking you just have to accept that the law in ED doesn't like you doing it.
If you mean you can't make decent cash off it, well that's not a problem limited to salvaging.
You can do what you're asking you just have to accept that the law in ED doesn't like you doing it.
If you mean you can't make decent cash off it, well that's not a problem limited to salvaging.
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So, putting together some of the ideas in this thread we have a viable suggestion:
How it works
- Salvage of cargo remains illegal (with the exception of Escape Pods)
- Work with a minor faction to achieve a progression threshold that will grant you a Salvage License for all systems controlled by that minor faction.
- Working with that minor faction could entail doing a certain amount of cargo-based (trade or salvage) missions from the mission board specifically from that faction + remaining clean.
- If that minor faction doesn't control any systems but is just present in one system, then the Salvage License is just for that one system.
- If you become Wanted in a system controlled by the faction for whom you have the Salvage License, you get an initial timed suspension of said License, and further infractions lead to it being revoked (like a points-based system).
- The Salvage License permits you to legally pick up and sell any and all cargo in the system(s) you have a license for.
More mechanics to add to the concept are:
- Salvaging not just cargo and engineer materials floating in space, but also using a mining laser to extract raw materials from the dead husks of ships - the bigger the ship, the more high grade the materials are, and the more available for extraction (the difference between the wreck of an Eagle and the wreck of an Anaconda, for example).
- Salvaging data from black boxes and ship data cores via the data link scanner - giving you a peak at the information it contains in the process (a little more story snippets, yay!)
- Salvage of Escape Pods you can choose to go Commodities Market to essentially return them home or Black Market to sell them into slavery, and you get a little standard flavour text to tell you what you've done. Rewards for either can be roughly equal, so CMDRs don't automatically go for one over the other because of more money.
Extra mechanics I'd like to see:
- Salvaging modules. "Ooh look, that Anaconda has a nice full intact fuel tank, I'm out of fuel myself, I'll take that instead" - useful for explorers not paying attention and adds extra worth to those USS's that are far out in the black usually just containing survey data salvage (sorry, Fuel Rats for taking away your jobs again!)
In fact, with this concept, you could take a module that you like the look of that would normally be quite expensive, cart it back to a station and either sell it or apply it to your own ship!
- Salvaging maintenance materials - AFMUs repair modules but not your Power Plant or Hull; let's pick up ship-grade materials to repair our hulls and power plants with. These would probably fit best as using the existing engineer mats (that aren't raw elemental materials - so focus crystals, proto-light alloys etc...) and an additional synthesis option.
So, based on all this being in the game, you've decided to go down the Salvage career path? Where does it actually lead? How does it become meaningful?
- Salvage career path thresholds could unlock more systems for you to be able to salvage in - maybe giving out system permits to trade or mining related locked systems
- The career path could unlock more ships, should any specialist salvage ships ever be implemented in the game
- The end of the career path could see you given a Salvage license for the entirety of Federation/Empire/Alliance/Independent space (depending on which superpower your license giving minor faction is aligned to, and/or in the case of having multiple licenses, which license you have done all your work under).
Notes:
- You can have multiple Salvage Licenses with different minor factions.
- Anarchy systems are excluded from being licensed because anything goes there already.
What do you guys think?
How it works
- Salvage of cargo remains illegal (with the exception of Escape Pods)
- Work with a minor faction to achieve a progression threshold that will grant you a Salvage License for all systems controlled by that minor faction.
- Working with that minor faction could entail doing a certain amount of cargo-based (trade or salvage) missions from the mission board specifically from that faction + remaining clean.
- If that minor faction doesn't control any systems but is just present in one system, then the Salvage License is just for that one system.
- If you become Wanted in a system controlled by the faction for whom you have the Salvage License, you get an initial timed suspension of said License, and further infractions lead to it being revoked (like a points-based system).
- The Salvage License permits you to legally pick up and sell any and all cargo in the system(s) you have a license for.
More mechanics to add to the concept are:
- Salvaging not just cargo and engineer materials floating in space, but also using a mining laser to extract raw materials from the dead husks of ships - the bigger the ship, the more high grade the materials are, and the more available for extraction (the difference between the wreck of an Eagle and the wreck of an Anaconda, for example).
- Salvaging data from black boxes and ship data cores via the data link scanner - giving you a peak at the information it contains in the process (a little more story snippets, yay!)
- Salvage of Escape Pods you can choose to go Commodities Market to essentially return them home or Black Market to sell them into slavery, and you get a little standard flavour text to tell you what you've done. Rewards for either can be roughly equal, so CMDRs don't automatically go for one over the other because of more money.
Extra mechanics I'd like to see:
- Salvaging modules. "Ooh look, that Anaconda has a nice full intact fuel tank, I'm out of fuel myself, I'll take that instead" - useful for explorers not paying attention and adds extra worth to those USS's that are far out in the black usually just containing survey data salvage (sorry, Fuel Rats for taking away your jobs again!)
In fact, with this concept, you could take a module that you like the look of that would normally be quite expensive, cart it back to a station and either sell it or apply it to your own ship!
- Salvaging maintenance materials - AFMUs repair modules but not your Power Plant or Hull; let's pick up ship-grade materials to repair our hulls and power plants with. These would probably fit best as using the existing engineer mats (that aren't raw elemental materials - so focus crystals, proto-light alloys etc...) and an additional synthesis option.
So, based on all this being in the game, you've decided to go down the Salvage career path? Where does it actually lead? How does it become meaningful?
- Salvage career path thresholds could unlock more systems for you to be able to salvage in - maybe giving out system permits to trade or mining related locked systems
- The career path could unlock more ships, should any specialist salvage ships ever be implemented in the game
- The end of the career path could see you given a Salvage license for the entirety of Federation/Empire/Alliance/Independent space (depending on which superpower your license giving minor faction is aligned to, and/or in the case of having multiple licenses, which license you have done all your work under).
Notes:
- You can have multiple Salvage Licenses with different minor factions.
- Anarchy systems are excluded from being licensed because anything goes there already.
What do you guys think?
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A salvage system was supposed to be a feature but it didn't really happen. If they did put more work into it now, it would probably just be like mining.