Credits ... Are we making too much or too little?

[Conch]

i also would like to note that i do not got money problems, atm ive got 3.4B in assets and 600m in the bank.

but i would like to see more dangers in a RESites and more high paying bounties.
if it were me, i would put back the ALD and Hudson bounty bonus like it used to be, when powerplay was worth the time..

 

[BDelacroix]

I am playing this game all wrong. I billion in a week? I barely make a partial rebuy in a week and that's if I grind for it. Which I refuse to do, so I don't make a rebuy in a week.

 

[Jools]

A player playing the old way (no exploits, no external data sources like Inara etc, no mode switching, no mission stacking) earns far far too little, to the point where its impossible to play the game (whatever data you gather, whatever you manage to learn, be it trade routes or simply how things work, and whatever you buy - modules etc. - all of it can become useless as soon as the new patch comes).

Buying let`s say an anaconda, starting fresh without prior knowledge of the game, is virtually impossible on your own without dedicating your entire life day by day to it

The game tells you almost nothing, and it changes its own rules without letting you know, sometimes in the middle of you doing something or achieving a certain goal, making all your efforts worthless

Its awful. But it`s not only a problem of Elite (but its the most pronounced here because of how slow the game is in general)

The problem comes from:

A player playing the new way, (outside info, exploits, min/maxing cr/h based on data not possible to acquire in game...) who earns far too much, to the point where credits loose their meaning, break any plausibility of the economy and force devs to balance the game around exploits which in turn again hinders normal gameplay

 

[Conch]

I am playing this game all wrong. I billion in a week? I barely make a partial rebuy in a week and that's if I grind for it. Which I refuse to do, so I don't make a rebuy in a week.

dont think anyone in the right mind would suggest we make a billion a week...

 

[Ian Skippy]

dont think anyone in the right mind would suggest we make a billion a week...

Some do, but cr/week is a pointless metric. Some here can play 12hr/day. Its quite possible to earn a billion in 100+ hours, but most people will need many months to play the same number of hours.

 

[babelfisch]

Too much, but some ships and modules also cost too much.

 

[EvE4evah]

A player playing the old way (no exploits, no external data sources like Inara etc, no mode switching, no mission stacking) earns far far too little, to the point where its impossible to play the game (whatever data you gather, whatever you manage to learn learn, be it trade routes or simply how things work, and whatever you buy - modules etc. - all of it is useless as soon as the new patch comes).

Buying let`s say an anaconda, starting fresh without prior knowledge of the game, is virtually impossible on your own without dedicating your entire life day by day to it

The game tells you almost nothing, and it changes it own rules without letting you know, sometimes in the middle of you doing something or achieving certain goal, making all your efforts worthless

Its awful. But it`s not only a problem of Elite (but its the most pronounced here because of how slow the game is in general)

The problem comes from:

A player playing the new way, (outside info, exploits, min/maxing cr/h based on data not possible to acquire in game...) who earns far too much, to the point where credits loose their meaning, break any plausability of the economy and force devs to balance the game around exploits which in turn again hinders normal gameplay

I used to agree with you, but now I don't. Check my previous post about different ways of making at least 10 million Credits per hour. Choose a system in War, initially do Trade/Data Delivery/Donation missions for one of the warring minor factions until you get Allied or at least Friendly. Massacre missions will appear. You can do them in a Vulture just following your NPC buddies in a CZ, leeching their kills. Or, you just pick Settlement Assault missions in a Cobra with 2-4 PAs. Ninja destroy the powergrids.

It's not hard to get to an Anaconda at all.

Edit: BTW I agree with that last paragraph. Most "nurf" cries come from people too spacerich for their own good, and who care about other people's business when they shouldn't .

 

[Stealthie]

I am playing this game all wrong. I billion in a week? I barely make a partial rebuy in a week and that's if I grind for it. Which I refuse to do, so I don't make a rebuy in a week.

Nah, you're not playing it "wrong" if you're doing what you want to do.

If you want to earn a billion credits in a week, and you're not, then you're doing something wrong.

 

[playfuldreamer]

One thing that this thread makes clear is that not all payouts are created equal: some avenues of play pay better than others.

 

[Gun Star]

I think one of the biggest problems right now is some players just starting the game think they need one of the big 3 A rated within the first week of playing the game.

When I first started it was, ok how much do I need to get into a Cobra or a Hauler. Then once you do that. Ok what do I need to do to get into a Asp X or DBX. Then a Python and so on. I didnt get my first Conda till about a year after playing. Then I slowly started saving for A rated components and then engineering it. I've been playing for 2 years and I just finally made Lt Commander in Fed and only a Serf in Imp. Those werent my priority until a couple of months ago. Same with unlocking engineers.

 

[Stealthie]

Some do, but cr/week is a pointless metric. Some here can play 12hr/day. Its quite possible to earn a billion in 100+ hours, but most people will need many months to play the same number of hours.

It's quite possible to earn a billion credits in a dozen hours (or thereabouts) IF you're willing to apply yourself to the task.

Do people really want to earn credits faster, or think a dozen hours is an unreasonable amount of time to invest?

 

[EvE4evah]

One thing that this thread makes clear is that not all payouts are created equal: some avenues of play pay better than others.

Agreed. Although FDev have moved to try and close the gap; Trade missions are paying better, Assassination/Settlement Assault/Massacre missions too, when Allied.
The huge issue though, is still PvP. Doesn't pay at all, so people who enjoy it have to spend 90% of their in-game time PvEing for rebuys (never mention the Engineer constant grind) and only 10% actually having fun.

 

[Wulfram Carbide]

I wonder if low minor faction reputation payouts should be buffed. I guess quite a lot of new players basically wonder the universe, following the flow of missions, which means they get stuck at cordial at best, where the payouts are fairly trivial. But people doing serious grinding should get allied quite quickly, so it wouldn't have a big impact on them

 

[EvE4evah]

I wonder if low minor faction reputation payouts should be buffed. I guess quite a lot of new players basically wonder the universe, following the flow of missions, which means they get stuck at cordial at best, where the payouts are fairly trivial. But people doing serious grinding should get allied quite quickly, so it wouldn't have a big impact on them

I'm against it. Getting rep is really easy and fast; do a 2h exploration session in the deep void and come back, sell exploration data, *plink* instant Allied. Do lots of Data Delivery/VIP transport/other fast completion mission stuff, gets fast rep too.

 

[BDelacroix]

If you can do a 15 mill an hour trade route you have a ship well suited to trade.

Only 8 million CR for 108 kills in CZ is unusual (most of these missions are Deadly/Elite and pay 15-25 mil), and if it takes three hours to shoot down or tag 108 ships, your ship is not particularly suited to conflict zones.

The only one I found yesterday on the board was for 1.3 million. I am missing something somewhere.

 

[Jools]

I used to agree with you, but now I don't. Check my previous post about different ways of making at least 10 million Credits per hour. Choose a system in War, initially do Trade/Data Delivery/Donation missions for one of the warring minor factions until you get Allied or at least Friendly. Massacre missions will appear. You can do them in a Vulture just following your NPC buddies in a CZ, leeching their kills. Or, you just pick Settlement Assault missions in a Cobra with 2-4 PAs. Ninja destroy the powergrids.

It's not hard to get to an Anaconda at all.

how is a new player, starting in a sidewinder, learning the game, supposed to gain this knowledge in game, without looking at the forum posts like yours, or guides, or external sources?

Your answer is basically "look at my guide on how to make money in this particular patch at this particular point in time, with this particular setup" which is exactly the problem. 2 months from now there will be some new way. None of it will be communicated in game.

The old games made you find your lucrative areas too, yes, but they were designed to encourage curiosity and experimentation, they had saves, the overall immediacy was higher, and the game-play loop from reward to reward was far shorter. Plus there were no forced patches that change everything (mostly engineers, but basically every single patch)

Tried board flipping too?

And now you are proposing exploits. Again just highlighting the problem.


Oh and to be clear. I`m not against such playstyles. It`s an always on-line game, it`s in a way broken by design. People just adjust, and use all the tools they have (of which we have none ingame but plenty outside of the game)

What i have a real problem with is FD trying to balance the game around all this silliness instead of letting those who like to break their game just break their game and sit on billions for god knows what reason

 

[EvE4evah]

The only one I found yesterday on the board was for 1.3 million. I am missing something somewhere.

Are you Allied with the minor faction already? Tried board flipping too?

how is a new player, starting in a sidewinder, learning the game, supposed to gain this knowledge in game, without looking at the forum posts like yours, or guides, or external sources?

Your answer is basically "look at my guide on how to make money in this particular patch at this particular point in time, with this particular setup" which is exactly the problem. 2 months from now there will be some new way. None of it will be communicated in game.

The old games made you find your lucrative areas too, yes, but they were designed to encourage curiosity and experimentation, they had saves, the overall immediacy was higher, and the game-play loop from reward to reward was far shorter. Plus there were no forced patches that change everything (mostly engineers, but basically every single patch)

OK, I agree. General pointers for new players aren't great in ED.

 

[Conch]

Some do, but cr/week is a pointless metric. Some here can play 12hr/day. Its quite possible to earn a billion in 100+ hours, but most people will need many months to play the same number of hours.

gotta agree with you on that!

 

[Stealthie]

I wonder if low minor faction reputation payouts should be buffed. I guess quite a lot of new players basically wonder the universe, following the flow of missions, which means they get stuck at cordial at best, where the payouts are fairly trivial. But people doing serious grinding should get allied quite quickly, so it wouldn't have a big impact on them

Nah,

The idea of making the effort to become allied with a faction and being rewarded with better missions is fundamental part of the game.

If anything, it just needs to be made clear to the player that this is a useful thing to do.

Perhaps all that's required would be to add some text to the "mission successful" dialogue to remind new players of this?

"Thank you for your services CMDR. If you continue to assist us then you'll find we have plenty of lucrative work available"

 

[BDelacroix]

Are you Allied with the minor faction already? Tried board flipping too?



OK, I agree. General pointers for new players aren't great in ED.

Yes, Colonia Council are very pleased with me. I'm not super worried about it, I've just never seen a mission for more than something between 1 and 2 million max. Anywhere. Other than the special ones like Ram Tah.