Are rares broken? 20,000 ly payout! Read it and weep !

[Rafe Zetter]

Rarity/availability does not automatically equal higher value. An item's maximum value is equal to the maximum that people are willing to pay for it.

No matter how far you had to ship it, a still just isn't going to be worth more than $16,800. I dont see the outrage here, especially since the logic is fairly straight forward.

For example, I have stone age tools and pottery shards that were made by a group of people that is yet unknown to science. They inhabited the land here, and finding such items from a group of people from that time is fairly rare in the region (south eastern US).

The pottery shards have intricate patterns on them, and the stone tools range from a shaft straightener (arrows), to hammers, and mortars.

Very rare, unique, and quite old. The pottery shards have all been loaned to a university for study, but none of it has any monetary value.

My business card holder was crafted by humans thousands of years ago, but its still just a rock.

*cough* .

The particular tribe of first nations maybe be a mystery, but "group of people unknown to science" sounds like aliens or a hitherto undiscovered branch of sapiens, and is clearly an exaggeration.

Also a few pottery shards tools and tools does not a civilisation make.

You are correct in that rarity doesn't come with value automatically - demand is also a factor - but the evidence is clear; in the ED ecomony the "rares" being moved has enough of a demand that they are offered in many places around the galaxy, and it's only the type that changes. Demand for first nations items is incredibly high - a trading blanket sold relatively recently at auction for 1.2 MILLION USD - it's actually pretty unremarkable as designs go, and not a patch on some Tibetan works I've seen that are far far older (and possibly worth less) and the owners had no clue as to it's value, until someone ELSE put that value on it.

For rares trading, ED put that value without taking the many factors of how it would be in reality into account - or rather they did to some degree, then nerfed it into oblivion removing all reason and meaning from it.

If you want to cling to the "it's just a still" routine, you could RP that the stills from this particular origin impart an unusual quality or other such added side effect only gained from using this particular still compared to another from elsewhere (just as the levels of equipment in the Elder Scrolls games do to alchemy potions made). Trust me when I tell you there are chefs in the world whom only use certain pans / woks and other devices for certain dishes because they have noticed differences in a dish prepared this way compared to that.

Wine, Oak barrels..... etc etc shall I go on?

 

[Rafe Zetter]

I have plenty of experience with trading in real life, and its worked out for me pretty well so far. I'm in my 30's with zero debt (zero) and fully funded retirement. 10 years ago I had six figure debt (includes mortgage) and five figure bank balance. The delta is from buying and selling on open markets.

I'm happy for you, but I'd keep being a trader on the open markets quiet if I was you considering the world economy and the last 10 years, most of that is trading on other peoples misery and a great many would have been less fortunate in thier recovery.

Even if something is rare and in high demand, there is always a maximum price.

Maximum prices fluctate with demand and time - "Top Price" records are ALWAYS being broken for almost everything.

I thought you said you were a trader on the markets?

I DO understand the point of view you are coming from but when you're talking galactic distances, the variables change dramatically.

Someone mentioned that "considering they are sold all over the galaxy" but the truth is "rares" is the global name for a whole assortment of unusual commodities because FDev have been lazy and grouped it all together under the same economy mechanic whereas the truth may well be that X only comes from a handful of places among the billions....

and that's the point of view I'm coming from.

 

[CMDR ANCALAGON]

I just stated that there is nothing inheriently flawed with the logic that prices would have a limit, even for rares.

You respond by throwing around insults and insinuations. I'll take the effort you put into attemts to diminish me as an anknowledgement that you're just being emotional and would like to move on.

 

[Dakron Nova]

What a joke!

https://i.imgur.com/It9VPRh.png

No No.

This is a joke.....

My wife woke up with a huge smile on her face this morning.
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I love marker pens.

 

[CMDR ANCALAGON]

No No.

This is a joke.....

My wife woke up with a huge smile on her face this morning.
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I love marker pens.

Knock knock

 

[Dakron Nova]

Knock knock

Whose there?

 

[Frenotx]

That used to be a lot of money per ton. Unfortunately, income expectations have risen over time, but rare trading profit has not. Also, the price doesn't just keep rising at the same rate forever with distance- there is only so much it will go up.

 

[CMDR ANCALAGON]

Whose there?

I ate mop

 

[Ouberos]

I trade Rares because I like the extra descriptions you get and I like going to places that have become a little familiar. Pulling into Lave will always feel a bit special.

Anyone else here do stuff for fun or is it just me?

 

[Flavourless]

The rares mechanic in ED is pretty dull anyway.
To have any value, let alone high value, they shouldn't spawn at known rates and locations.

They should rather be things that are actually rare, and could be traded to buyers who have a special interest in them regardless of distance.

Expecting things which are by nature just ordinary commodities to have exorbitant profits merely because they have been transported is pretty lame.

 

[Schmack]

Just because you hauled something 20,000 kly doesn't mean any one will want to pay millions of cr for them, or actually want them.

Sure, price increases as availability descreases, but there is a point where no one is going to pay any higher for something. Its a $683 still. Do you expect anyone to pay more than a 2370% mark up? Or will everyone just say "yeah that's nice and all, but I can't see paying you $50,000 cr for a still. I'll just wait until Jeb makes another run out that way and I'll tag along and pick one up there..."

I think the 140ly cap makes a lot of sense. It would be silly to think that prices would continue to increase with distance and that someone would always be willing to pay that price.

What you say totally defeats the concept of "rare". If Jeb can run out that way and pick one up, it's not rare, and that's why the price goes up as you go further away from the source. Supposedly the common folk don't go 20K LY on a whim, which is why Jeb would have to pay someone 25 million Cr to take him out there (and back). So 25m to get a 5K item? Sure.

 

[Limoncello Lizard]

Few players complained when it paid millions to haul poo a couple of hundred lightyears. But now a genuinely rare good should only earn a few hundred credits to take 20,000ly?

 

[The Wallet Inspector]

The Spice Islands. A sailor could retire on a plantation with just a few kilograms of spice brought back from the other side of the world. In this universe, the so called "rare good" maxes out about 10 minutes travel from the origin (about 120 seconds in my Anaconda). Makes total sense (sarcasm, because some people actually think this makes sense, i need to add this). It's just another undeveloped stub that was left as is, along with combat zones, SRV's, CQC etc...

I got paid 1.5 million credits to ship 100 tons of water o a system on an icy moon 11 lyrs away. The base was literally surrounded with ice. Nothing in this game makes sense anymore, if it ever did...

 

[CMDR ANCALAGON]

What you say totally defeats the concept of "rare". If Jeb can run out that way and pick one up, it's not rare, and that's why the price goes up as you go further away from the source. Supposedly the common folk don't go 20K LY on a whim, which is why Jeb would have to pay someone 25 million Cr to take him out there (and back). So 25m to get a 5K item? Sure.

Sure, the anaology doesn't really work.

Does not change the fact that rarity does not automatically equal high value, because rarity does not automatically equal demand. Rarity does not mean that there isn't a price limit. Also, distance from the source also doesn't automatically mean that the price goes up.

Someone mentioned square water melons earlier, and there is an obession with "perfect" watermelons in Japan, and I do recall one example within the last five years or so that one sold for a stupid amount of money, in excess of $20,000 USD, and even strawberries selling for over $4000 USD each. I don't care how rare those things are or how special they are in Japan, I can promise you that I cannot sell those exact same items in local markets (south eastern US) for anywhere near their market value in Japan (by a factor of 1000:1).

Again, it seems backwards to me it is a flat given that prices will go up the further an item is shipped.

 

[GJ51]

IIRC it used to was that price per ton maxed out at roughly 2X the galactic average.

In the OP's case he should have gotten aroubd 26-27K per ton sale price and made around 750K profit???

 

[Patau82]

Npc smugglers can carry some illegal rares, would make colonia a nice place to be a pirate if their value didn't have a distance cap

 

[CMDR ANCALAGON]

I got paid 1.5 million credits to ship 100 tons of water o a system on an icy moon 11 lyrs away. The base was literally surrounded with ice. Nothing in this game makes sense anymore, if it ever did...

Not such a crazy scenario.

Saudi and UAE import sand from Austrailia and even places like Lankenshire, because while they are surrounded by sand, it has too high of a silica content and is generally too course for use in production of concrete and other construction materials. In fact, there is something of a shortage of suitable sand in the global market, and in a few regions (not in Austrailia) where good sand can be found in river beds, open conflict has broken out over the sand and the land.

Camels are an invassive species in Austrailia, so they are more than happy to get rid of the ferral beasts, and most of the camels in Saudi are bred for labor or racing, and anamials suitable for meat are in short supply. They are nice and fat in Austrailia, so they get their eating camels from down under.

So if Austrailia is sellig sand and camels to Arabs, perhaps it isn't so crazy to sell water to inhabitants of an ice world.

 

[Vasious]

I thought the cap out on Rare goods value around 150 light years was a thing since they were first introduced?

What has changed?

 

[metatheurgist]

I thought the cap out on Rare goods value around 150 light years was a thing since they were first introduced?

What has changed?

Nothing. Someone thought they'd found a potential gold mine and are upset that FD were already one step ahead of them. If it worked I'm sure the tone would be how broken the payout is.

 

[The Wallet Inspector]

Not such a crazy scenario.

Saudi and UAE import sand from Austrailia and even places like Lankenshire, because while they are surrounded by sand, it has too high of a silica content and is generally too course for use in production of concrete and other construction materials. In fact, there is something of a shortage of suitable sand in the global market, and in a few regions (not in Austrailia) where good sand can be found in river beds, open conflict has broken out over the sand and the land.

Camels are an invassive species in Austrailia, so they are more than happy to get rid of the ferral beasts, and most of the camels in Saudi are bred for labor or racing, and anamials suitable for meat are in short supply. They are nice and fat in Austrailia, so they get their eating camels from down under.

So if Austrailia is sellig sand and camels to Arabs, perhaps it isn't so crazy to sell water to inhabitants of an ice world.

Don't have the patience anymore to RP this stuff. Les pretend its special super valuable water because the water there is different? No. I'd rather have a functioning ingame economy. I could just sit and pretend i'm playing a game, if i want to RP..#sophistry