New scanning mechanics displayed in th livestream...

[Bunkerkind Anni]

really,

this mechanic needs:
1. scanning a ship
2. targeting subsystems of that ship
3. using a scanner on a targeted subsystem
4. sending a limpet with said subsystem targeted

how many of those actions can a multicrew gunner do without beeing allowed to select subsystems ?

was MC dumped already?

aside from that new scanning thing,
multicrew was not mentioned a single time in the presentation of wing missions.

 

[CMDR Cosmic Spacehead]

Multicrew is dead.

Long live..... Uhh... NPC crew. Lol

I still need to watch the live stream. It's on my to-do list. Along with the last updated live streams. And the ones before that...

Lol

 

[CMDR Dreamstate]

I'm hoping this year's paid expansion will fix some of the issues with multicrew - that, and the Q4 update.

Who knows, Q2 and Q3 of Beyond will be "small" updates, so they may be able to work on something for multicrew then.

I also want them to make it possible for multicrew to use SRV's. I am just completely astonished that they can make it work for fighters, yet can't make it work for SRVs - just... the logic totally perplexes my mind.

I'd also prefer much less worrying rhetoric coming from some of the Devs on the live streams, saying, "If it is a success, then we'll add more to it" and almost moan just how "hard it is to code" - It's like, what? Are there problems with the Cobra engine? Or is it just too much of a headache to do? Sometimes it makes me wonder why some of the Devs work for Frontier developing a game if it is too challenging - other game developers don't have a problem creating multiplayer content that works fine, nor do they ever come out and say some of the stuff they have in the past.

Meh, I'm sure in the end lots of issues we've had in 2017 will be fixed in 2018 - I'm hazzarding a guess most of Frontier's talent has been working on other games, so naturally it'll take longer to develop Elite until they are done in their other projects.

 

[Rubbernuke]

multicrew was not mentioned a single time in the presentation of wing missions.

Probably because being on the same ship does not really count for being in a wing of separate ships.

 

[Bunkerkind Anni]

Probably because being on the same ship does not really count for being in a wing of separate ships.

its using a similar code

all wing related keybinds work in multicrew for the helm and the slf pilot.
wing's trade share also works in multicrew.
and crew has access to the transactions panels most of the time (excluding gunner in external view)

i see no reason why wing missions wont work with them. my issue is more or less that multicrew doesn't need dedicated missions because its still just one ship.
it only needs mission reward interests paid to crew like it does for trade income

 

[ZeroAi]

how many of those actions can a multicrew gunner do without beeing allowed to select subsystems ?

was MC dumped already?

aside from that new scanning thing,
multicrew was not mentioned a single time in the presentation of wing missions.

I really hope they add ways for multicrew members to earn credits while exploring, mining, trading, doing missions, and anything outside of combat.

The solution is simple.

To insure the crew members have to participate, give them exclusive control of some functions like scanners, the mission board, etc, so they earn their keep.

The problem with MC only paying crew members for combat is that it's high risk and low reward for the owner of the ship. Why should I risk my Anaconda so I can do combat with two friends? Better to wing up and let them risk their own ships then for me to put my expensive three seater on the line.

Oh, and FDev please add:
- A forth seat, plus additional seats for NPCs.
- Four player SLF support (when not in MC, I can leave my ship in a SLF without an NPC, so why not in MC?)
- Four Player MC SRV support (and please update planetary bases with winding highways we can race on)
- MC missions (like wing missions, but maybe with time bonuses?)

In summary, I'd love to go exploring with three friends in my Anaconda, but today they wouldn't make dime doing it which is sad...

 

[Arthur Shappey]

I think an opportunity was lost by FDev not to insist all multi-crew seats were filled in larger spacecraft, as per FFE.

Whether NPC or player, it would mean that the larger fighting capacity and larger trading capacity of large ships would be offset against sharing the rewards (kills or credits) with a multi-crew (NPC or player).

Perhaps because that decision wasn't made, it was almost impossible for FDev to balance multi-crew play fairly against solo play?

 

[Ignition]

Multicrew is dead since the 2nd week of its release.

Its just a 3rd person camera for pew pew.

 

[Arthur Shappey]

Multicrew is dead since the 2nd week of its release.

Its just a 3rd person camera for pew pew.

Did it work well the first week then? ;-)

 

[GG7]

Did it work well the first week then? ;-)

It was DOA due primarily to the lack of an NPC crew option. Something a HUGE percentage of the player base was screaming for during this feature's development. Frontier ignored that majority opinion, so the majority promptly ignored the Multi-Crew FDEV delivered.

We all predicted it months before it was released. So when it promptly FLOPPED, there was a collective "WE TOLD YOU SO!" heard across the forums.

It wasn't a hard prediction to make if you were around during all that.

 

[Crank Larson]

I wish someone had told me that multicrew was dead... I wouldn't have bothered playing it if I'd known.

I'm very much looking forward to the beta, but I'm not going to make any assumptions about how things are implemented until I have played it. There are so many changes that it could be that minor things have been missed from the streams. I don't think there's much point in commenting on any of the new stuff until we've had a chance to play with it for a bit.

 

[GG7]

I wish someone had told me that multicrew was dead... I wouldn't have bothered playing it if I'd known.

Its not literally dead... But definitely on life support.

I don't know of anyone on my friends list that uses it anymore. Too many instancing hiccups and other crap, plus the implementation was rather lackluster to begin with.

If NPC crews had been seriously considered and eventually added, it would be a completely different story.

 

[Bunkerkind Anni]

i started that topic not to complain about multicrew in total,
just the fact that FDEV had used arguments like "multicrew was no topic when we have designed this" for the lack of a second seat in the keelback.

and now the next set of new features is released and the lack of responses to ANY multicrew question during the stream and the "selective Q&A after stream summary" hit me.
especially since i was not the only one asking over the the two hours (both streams combined)

and its not that i am someone complaining about something i dont use.
i've played the last two hours with a friend.

gues what - for no reason, he could claim the gunner seat, but did not get any control over the turrets.
it worked perfectly the last two days, but not today. Bugs like this beeing still there is not acceptable.
so again, we had to resort to the ONLY thing that kinda works: SLF pilot.
... except for the random extra pip shifting on the main ship when he tried to shift the pips of the fighter

its not that Multicrew is new. thats a 2.3 feature, in the meantime we had 2.4 and in a few weeks we get 3.0 -YAY


maybe i should try to make a vid and voiceact this like Yamiks or Rinzler ... or hire an Ant for it...

 

[Terry Bruge-Hiplo]

You make a good point there, OP. This would be a great thing for a crew member to be able to do...

 

[krylite]

per mentioned why SRV can't be used with multi-crew, i'm guessing the ship is in a different state when landed and that being in the SRV viewing the ship externally is a drastically different state than being in a fighter or multicrew or npc in a fighter where the ship is still in a flying state. Perhaps there was initial framework done for future spacelegs when the ship was landed where you someday could enter through a hatch, etc. And it would have broken the game with too much now to fix with multicrew using SRV and pilots able to switch around without a proper spacelegs system implemented. That said, I think multicrew also served as a first groundwork for proper spacelegs in the future with holo-me and avatar modeling and customizations already. I would agree a next small step could be filling those extra seats at least with hired npc crew. I was also wondering about the future of multicrew from the livestreams and was disappointed there was no word yet on how mc would factor within Beyond.

 

[Drelthar]

I think an opportunity was lost by FDev not to insist all multi-crew seats were filled in larger spacecraft, as per FFE.

Whether NPC or player, it would mean that the larger fighting capacity and larger trading capacity of large ships would be offset against sharing the rewards (kills or credits) with a multi-crew (NPC or player).

Perhaps because that decision wasn't made, it was almost impossible for FDev to balance multi-crew play fairly against solo play?

Yep, this is basiaclly the problem.

They couldn't afford to lock out the big ships (or didn't have the balls) until muilticrew arrived. So they had to make just... an additive essentially cosmetic version of it. The big ships should require crew.

 

[GG7]

i started that topic not to complain about multicrew in total,
just the fact that FDEV had used arguments like "multicrew was no topic when we have designed this" for the lack of a second seat in the keelback.

I'm not entirely sure what your original point was actually. ??

As far as the new scanning mechanic goes, I would say just give them some time to flesh it out across the entire game. I can totally envision this same scanning system to eventually arrive on the SRV as well as "hopefully" a NEW surface scanning feature for our ships that will allow us to scan planetary surfaces for POIs and mineral deposit concentrations ahead of actually setting down and taking out our SRVs.

That to me has been the "No Brainer" that has been sorely missing from the game from day one of Horizons.

 

[Bunkerkind Anni]

per mentioned why SRV can't be used with multi-crew, i'm guessing the ship is in a different state when landed and that being in the SRV viewing the ship externally is a drastically different state than being in a fighter or multicrew or npc in a fighter where the ship is still in a flying state. ...

the DEVs have kinda explained why the SRV thingy doesn't work.
first - when you compare it with SLF: As helm you can't switch into the SLF in multicrew either.
for the SRV, they need to force the whole crew to deploy, or implement a multicrew srv that has at least two seats.

I'm not entirely sure what your original point was actually. ??

As far as the new scanning mechanic goes, I would say just give them some time to flesh it out across the entire game. I can totally envision this same scanning system to eventually arrive on the SRV as well as "hopefully" a NEW surface scanning feature for our ships that will allow us to scan planetary surfaces for POIs and mineral deposit concentrations ahead of actually setting down and taking out our SRVs.

That to me has been the "No Brainer" that has been sorely missing from the game from day one of Horizons.

please name one feature that was "fleshed out" within the release version it was released with, if ever.

 

[Alex Brentnall]

TL: DR - OP doesn't know that multicrew not being able to target subsystems was a balance thing and design intent not lack of time or caring.

Alternatively as the thread progressed: "I see dev time that wasn't spent on what I want so i'm going to use that to complain"



Yes I too want improvements to multicrew, being able to direct shields to different places, repair modules and loads of other things with actual gameplay elements that change things. But I disagree with the way you are trying to make your point. Multicrew and wings are separate, quite categorically, just because they spend time working on one doesn't mean they have to in the same sentence mention the other.

 

[Bunkerkind Anni]

TL: DR - OP doesn't know that multicrew not being able to target subsystems was a balance thing and design intent not lack of time or caring.

Alternatively as the thread progressed: "I see dev time that wasn't spent on what I want so i'm going to use that to complain"



Yes I too want improvements to multicrew, being able to direct shields to different places, repair modules and loads of other things with actual gameplay elements that change things. But I disagree with the way you are trying to make your point. Multicrew and wings are separate, quite categorically, just because they spend time working on one doesn't mean they have to in the same sentence mention the other.

they have just released a new ship, that would be perfect for multicrew for thargoid hunting
but nothing works right.

we have "multi crew enabled" bright yellow icons on those c2/c3 multicannon turrets - for what?
because they decided (for balancing reasons????) that gunner turrets auto-snap to targets,
that for balancing reasons, the gunner is not allowed to target subsystems directly, and as such,
can't really "aim" for the hearts of the thargoids, because the weapons auto-snap to the CENTER of the Alien ship ...
for balancing reasons, with weapons that do by default less damage per shot, with the same unreplenishable ammo limit.

using the xeno scanner is always transfered to the gunner, so all the scanning issues mentioned before apply here as well, just with even less range to work with.
Flak is like the only perfect implemented multicrew enabled weapon. fixed when solo, turret for the gunner when in multicrew, ZERO difference except the price between fixed and turret version.

for balancing reasons, the gunner can't to anything what a 6km long range FIXED railgun does to snipe unaware commanders powerplant when they try to land at an engineers base. (snapping to a selected subsystem)

it was more a "design reason" to dumb down gunner controls so much, that it can be presented by a Community manager, using an X-Box controller.
I highlight that, because i haven't seen FDEV talking about multicrew since a Community manager accidentally destroyed the ship of a voluntary players big ship live on stream....