I would love a NPC Helmsman

[Riverside]

There is some confusion between exploring (scanning stars & stuff) vs travelling (pressing J a lot & occasionally scooping).

For travelling I don't really see a worthwhile objection to allowing the ship to just do it for you, until you reach the last scoopable star (or are otherwise put in danger) provided it takes longer than doing it manually. Only throttle in the blue zone instead of max, give the star a wide berth to keep the ship cool etc, doing it manually the Cmdr can run closer to the star to optimise the route etc.

For those 'ooh shiny' moments where you want to explore just take the controls again (as with autodock), do your scanning/whatever and resume. No logging off & waiting like ship transfer, have it happen in real time.

Exploring is fun (for some), travelling is dull (for most).

 

[Mr Jack Burton]

If the point of the game is walking...then taking a plane breaks the game. Getting to Beigjing in 12 hours by plane won't get you into the Guinness Book of World Records for the shortest time having walked there.

The point of the game isn't grinding J button...

 

[S3B4ST13N]

I'm not getting this idea...the game is based on travel in space and space is big and empty. What you are asking for is to have autodriving for a truck simulation program. It changes the complete nature of the game. You might just as well point where you want to go...pay credits to get your ship there...then close out the game and come back when your ship arrives.

Honestly? This isn't about making people play my way. I just don't see why anyone would want to play this game if they didn't enjoy the flying/movement restrictions. I'm all about instant transfers of ships to places, once you have arrived at a place...but this type of request is different..it's a complete rejection of the games design...and if it is that bothersome...why bother with the game?

On the current game mechanics, I doubt it would work well, likely having the effects you think it would, but if/when Frontier introduce ship-legs?
Then I get to spend 25 minutes Witchspacing to a destination, whilst I get to do activities on my ship. That, to me, would be epic.

 

[RidingTheFlow]

There is some confusion between exploring (scanning stars & stuff) vs travelling (pressing J a lot & occasionally scooping).

These are somewhat tied together though.

FDev wanted "remote regions" which feel really "remote".
The only way to do this is to make travelling distance very meaningful.
The only way they figured out they can make it distance "meaningful" is to make player pay for it with "effort". Even if its very repetitive effort (but that what actually discourages people from travelling too far - and this is by design, because they wanted to discourage people from travel too far).

 

[Ian Skippy]

That's why I don't explore.

But seriously - if the process of jumping is not interesting or entertaining the solution is to make it entertaining, not to eliminate any player involvement entirely. Games are supposed to have interesting choices all the time for players.

If the point of the game is walking...then taking a plane breaks the game. Getting to Beigjing in 12 hours by plane won't get you into the Guinness Book of World Records for the shortest time having walked there.

Except there is no 'guiness book of record' in ED, and the point of the game isnt to press 'j' as often as possible. You may make it a goal for yourself, and you may feel very proud about pressing that button a lot, but it really is no reason to force it upon others. If you want to make it an accomplishment, just have it be 'speed based', and make auto-travel slower. That way you can go press that button very rapidly if you want, and others can do other stuff they find more fun.

Which I imagine is pretty much everything else.

 

[777Driver]

Honestly? This isn't about making people play my way. I just don't see why anyone would want to play this game if they didn't enjoy the flying/movement restrictions. I'm all about instant transfers of ships to places, once you have arrived at a place...but this type of request is different..it's a complete rejection of the games design...and if it is that bothersome...why bother with the game?

I enjoy flying in this game, I enjoy hand flying in super-cruise, especially with the updated graphics. Have never seen the point in manually performing trivial tasks like adjusting course by 1 degree to keep a destination alignment, or a 30 degree adjustment for jump alignment. Wouldn't even mind if it was an NPC crew helmsman we had to hire for the big ships, or an additional slot requirement like the DC.

I'd rather delegate the more mundane tasks to a machine or crew member, focus on more important things like studying the gal map, keeping an eye out for pirates, give us more engaging things to do instead off adjust course by 1 degree, or press J. Some of ED's tech does seem to be firmly set in the pre Sperry era before 1914.

 

[Ian Skippy]

That's why I don't explore.

But seriously - if the process of jumping is not interesting or entertaining the solution is to make it entertaining, not to eliminate any player involvement entirely. Games are supposed to have interesting choices all the time for players.

On the current game mechanics, I doubt it would work well, likely having the effects you think it would, but if/when Frontier introduce ship-legs?
Then I get to spend 25 minutes Witchspacing to a destination, whilst I get to do activities on my ship. That, to me, would be epic.

Space legs even requires it so some extent. When would you otherwise walk about your ship? In the 40 seconds in supercruise/witchspace?

 

[lysan]

You are saying you want to make it AFK activity, kind of long-range supercruise.
Where you can just have game running in background and do something else, just keeping eye on game window in case something happens.

I can tell you that FDev are not very receptive to such possibility and they always will try to eliminate whenever they spring up, not to mention actually introduce them.

Nope that is not what I'm saying, AFK is not prevented by making the game force you to micro manage your travels.
You will still be attacked by pirates, and if no pirates something else could be introduced. Module failures, refueling.

As I said, your argument is a strawman...

I guess I don't see the different between a single jump taking 25 minutes, or multiple jumps to the same destination taking the same amount of time.
No scale lost (for me).

What if Witchspace was turned into more of a mini-game.. requiring user input to keep your course true and steady (NPC's can fill this roll if you want to take a break). (As I suggested) You could travel to System 25 in 25 minute; but it would require constant input from either the Cmdr, or the NPC.

NPC skill determines how well (s)he pilots through Witchspace.

Inside Witchspace could be pockets of sub-space that disrupt your FSD. Gravity wells threaten to pull you out of Witchspace.
NPC/Cmdr's entering Witchspace might need to be avoided (highly rare incident, but could be interesting).

In certain areas, you must avoid a form of Witchspace interdiction by Thargoids - even players could have a "spacial interdiction unit."

The longer you stay in Witchspace, the farther you travel but also the more dangerous it gets

Well if the time was the same, I agree, no difference, however we know that making the AP is not a huge task, it has been done with 3rd party tools, the direct jump could be more development time and is not the intent here

 

[Riverside]

These are somewhat tied together though.

FDev wanted "remote regions" which feel really "remote".
The only way to do this is to make travelling distance very meaningful.
The only way they figured out they can make it distance "meaningful" is to make player pay for it with "effort". Even if its very repetitive effort (but that what actually discourages people from travelling too far - and this is by design, because they wanted to discourage people from travel too far).

Of course they are related, doesn't mean they aren't different things. Cats & dogs are related (both are carnivorians)

Would you trust an autopilot to scoop for a neutron star boost? I wouldn't. But it could steer the ship in SC around the star, line up for the next jump & engage the jump drive while you watch it do it. Sense of scale preserved.

 

[Mr Jack Burton]

These are somewhat tied together though.

FDev wanted "remote regions" which feel really "remote".
The only way to do this is to make travelling distance very meaningful.
The only way they figured out they can make it distance "meaningful" is to make player pay for it with "effort". Even if its very repetitive effort (but that what actually discourages people from travelling too far - and this is by design, because they wanted to discourage people from travel too far).

Pressing "J" every 40s make it feel more remote ? Or would be time/unexpected events that make you feel so ? in 52.000LY often i come back in my home star system with 100% of hull integrity, no problems, the only "problem" is pressing J as soon as possible. This is not gameplay...

 

[Roybe]

Except there is no 'guiness book of record' in ED, and the point of the game isnt to press 'j' as often as possible. You may make it a goal for yourself, and you may feel very proud about pressing that button a lot, but it really is no reason to force it upon others. If you want to make it an accomplishment, just have it be 'speed based', and make auto-travel slower. That way you can go press that button very rapidly if you want, and others can do other stuff they find more fun.

Which I imagine is pretty much everything else.

Well, I still think if this is such a problem...people might not be playing the correct game...but I do agree..as I posted above...there should be something that happens during movements in hyperspace and witchspace...just have more interdictions with more outcomes...in the old games every jump was a fight to the station...and you lost almost as much as you won...but then people will complain that the interdictions are to many...don't make sense....whatever.

I don't have an answer...but do believe the solution is not to automate the driving...like I said...it would be like buying a Truck driving sim, paying for all the content to get that truck from NY to CA...and complain that the game is boring and the driving needs to be automated. Wrong game purchased...wasting time playing it.

 

[RidingTheFlow]

Nope that is not what I'm saying, AFK is not prevented by making the game force you to micro manage your travels.
You will still be attacked by pirates, and if no pirates something else could be introduced. Module failures, refueling.

AFK is not prevented simply by random events - these by definition can't happen all the time, and, as I said, you can simply keep one eye on game window and do something else until you see this pirate appear.
Yes, random events will somewhat involve you, but it still will "lessen" the "sense of effort".

The intent behind current mechanic is to force you to actively fly the ship *all the travel time*. Why? Because FDev decides its as hard as it they want it to be.

Pressing "J" every 40s make it feel more remote ? Or would be time/unexpected events that make you feel so ? in 52.000LY often i come back in my home star system with 100% of hull integrity, no problems, the only "problem" is pressing J as soon as possible. This is not gameplay...

I am not saying its "gameplay". Its simply artificial time-stretch mechanic. ED is full of these.

 

[Mr Jack Burton]

Actually that you have to DRIVE a truck is REALISTIC, when trucks will be self-driving simulators will be different. But actually if you play at Flight Simulator you have autopilot and it is an on-board device with its own use that DO NOT BREAKS Flight Simulator because you have to deal with weather, other planes, control towers etc etc.

 

[lysan]

Pressing "J" every 40s make it feel more remote ? Or would be time/unexpected events that make you feel so ? in 52.000LY often i come back in my home star system with 100% of hull integrity, no problems, the only "problem" is pressing J as soon as possible. This is not gameplay...

In Assassins Creed Origins, the gameworld is huge, not ED huge but huge compaired to similar games. To travel from one end to another will take you 30 mins more or less. You can actually set your horse or camel on auto pilot and it will travel by following the roads to you destination. If you really want to explore and go off the road you need to do it manually.

So we could do something similar in ED, going to Colonia is a known road, we should be able to engage automation to get there.
Not by a direct jump but by letting the helmsman do all the repetitive tasks, line ship up, engage jumpdrive and so on and so forth.

If you want to go somewhere that doesn't have a "road" you could buy a star map from a player or a central cartography agency.

This would make the whole gameplay more fun, fun for those who like to find a new route to the promised land, and for those who would like to go there, but don't want to sit and manage each and every jump to get there.

Win-win

 

[S3B4ST13N]

Space legs even requires it so some extent. When would you otherwise walk about your ship? In the 40 seconds in supercruise/witchspace?

I've pondered it a lot tbh; I'm trying to think of instances where I'd be walking around my ship when not docked .. only thing I can think of is long-distance super cruising (Hutton etc)

 

[Skipnik]

If you don't like traveling much then don't. Most of the stuff needed for majority of gameplay can be found within a few jumps of a central location. Find location, stay there. When I watch space sci fi i never get the impression mega long space travel is fun or exciting but long and arduous, punctuated (now and then) with adventure and discovery.

 

[lysan]

AFK is not prevented simply by random events - these by definition can't happen all the time, and, as I said, you can simply keep one eye on game window and do something else until you see this pirate appear.
Yes, random events will somewhat involve you, but it still will "lessen" the "sense of effort".

The intent behind current mechanic is to force you to actively fly the ship *all the travel time*. Why? Because FDev decides its as hard as it they want it to be.


I am not saying its "gameplay". Its simply artificial time-stretch mechanic. ED is full of these.

To be honest, they are not helping keeping they game fun.

I can garatie if this was implemented the majority of players would praise it to the heavens.

 

[Kaltern]

I really have never understood the objection to an Auto-J option.

Noone is suggesting:

Auto-Supercruise
Auto-Refuelling
Auto-Mining
Auto-Scanning
Auto-Shooting
Auto-Planetary Landings

None of those. Yet people STILL insist on trying to say that Auto-Jumping means we'd get at least one of those.

Think of it this way. You set a course from say, Sol to Maia. Unless you have fitted a huge number of fueltanks, or you use economy mode, you're very likely to have to refuel at some point. So the Auto-Nav Computer can simply do the following:

Jump to first star in list. IF required, reorient ship past star to next navpoint, and initiate jump. Repeat until almost out of fuel, and at last fuel star. Computer voice warns 'Jumping to Fuel Star' and stops. You refuel, and re-initiate the jump sequence. Repeat until computer reaches final destination star.

If at any point you are interdicted, the computer warns you saying something like 'Warning, interdiction detected, aborting jump sequence' and you take over. You can set other options, for example, heat damage, to also abort the jump sequence.

I fail to see how this is, in any way, a problem. Explorers gain nothing because the scanners won't operate during auto-navigation. Pirates don't lose out because there will always be a short delay between jumps. This isn't easy mode at all - just a slightly more convenient way of getting from A to B. And there's no auto-use of neutron stars because that would be a bit much.

Simply put, A to B manually should always be quicker than automatically. And using this system, it definitely would be.

Oh, and anyone here who believes Auto-Dock should be removed from the game is automatically excluded for having any rational opinion on this....

 

[Mr Jack Burton]

If something catch my attention during travel I would be pleased to disengage autopilot and spend time playing, not spending time to watch Netflix with ED running. There is no challenge in long trips except resist enough to boredom.

 

[RidingTheFlow]

To be honest, they are not helping keeping they game fun.

I can garatie if this was implemented the majority of players would praise it to the heavens.

Well, I can't argue with that, you are preaching to the convert here
But I have the impression that FDev tries to make the "game they like". Not the "game that majority of players will like".