Massive flaw in the new Crime and Punishment.Selling credit for real money.

[CMDR Relick]

No I meant that since that cap was introduced all the other ways to make credits have gotten easier, and return much more. Thus the cap likely has less effect now than when originally introduced. The "since" in my sentence wasn't meant to be read as a "because".

Aahh. Thanks for clarification

 

[sidereal6]

there is already talk from players that have 10's of billions of credits that can afford to the penalty that they'll rack up 100 million bounty by killing a few new players and then charging real world money to let someone collect that bounty.

Surely they can already do this by purchasing something expensive like meta allows (100k each) and then meeting up with another play and jettisoning them, letting the other player pick them up with limpets.

A new player can get an AspX and make 10 million credits a trip this way.

 

[CMDR Relick]

That's not what Sandro explained in the Livestream. With the changes to the C&P system, so came changes to the KWS. Look it up.

P.S. https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showt...-The-Kill-Warrant-Scanner!?highlight=save+KWS

I've heard people saying that CMDRs will for some reason be excluded from this, but I cannot site it. If you're right, then I apologize. If you're right, then why is the KWS even a module anymore...

 

[Mohrgan]

I've heard people saying that CMDRs will for some reason be excluded from this, but I cannot site it. If you're right, then I apologize. If you're right, then why is the KWS even a module anymore...

My Understanding is that the change is intended to keep the pressure up on wanted ships, and notorious criminals, by not wiping a criminals account through one defeat. The new arrangement will allow you repeatedly collect bounties from active criminals.

 

[CMDR Relick]

My Understanding is that the change is intended to keep the pressure up on wanted ships, and notorious criminals, by not wiping a criminals account through one defeat. The new arrangement will allow you repeatedly collect bounties from active criminals.

Yes. Allow you to repeatedly fail at collecting, or even finding a criminal with a noticeable bounty haha. I think that managing to actually find, successfully pull, and then successfully kill someone who knows how much financial $&!7 they are about to be in should be worth more than 2 million credits.

 

[Ventofreddo]

Hello Commanders!

For clarity:

• A criminal can have bounties issued against their ships.
• Most bounty crimes are nominal values, because the real cost of committing them is becoming wanted, which allows other ships to legally attack and destroy them, triggering a potentially expensive rebuy (as well as the hassle of losing cargo, vouchers and respawning at a detention centre).
• The murder crime has a special set of rules to determine its cost, by using a new statistic: Notoriety.
• Notoriety increases every time you commit the crime of murder. It's a value from 0-10, and always starts at 0.
• Notoriety decays over time spent playing the game, at the rate of 1 point for every two hours that pass playing.
• When you commit murder, as well as the static portion of the bounty value (which is being set as 5000 CR across the board for legibility), two other calculations kick in:
  • 1. For every point of notoriety, an additional cost is added, equal to small fraction of your ship's rebuy value. This fraction increase ramps up as your Notoriety increses, so at Notoriety 10 you will be paying much, much more than at Notoriety 1.
  • 2. If the victim's ship has a rebuy cost (all Commander ships do), then the bounty value is increased again. This time, the game looks at the difference between your ship's rebuy and the victim's rebuy. 10 percent of this value is added to the bounty per point of Notoriety you have. Basically, if the ship you attack has a bigger rebuy cost, then no extra is added. The cheaper the rebuy of the victim's ship, the greater the the amount of cost *could* be added. Notoriety determines exactly how much of this potential is *actually* added.
• When bounty hunters come a callin' and scan you and detect your bounty, they receive a bounty claim upon destroying your ship. This claim is equal to the bounty cost, but is capped (the cap is being increased to 2 million per jurisdiction. So even if you committed many murders and ended up with a 50 million credit bounty in a jurisdiction, the most a bounty hunter could claim upon taking you down is 2 million.

Other trivia:

• Notoriety also helps the victim. For each point of Notoriety your killer had when they murdered you, your rebuy cost is reduced by 6% in compensation by the Pilot's Federation. Basically, your rebuy will be more than halved when you fall foul of a Notoriety 10 murderer.
• Around starports, Notoriety is not used (it is not increased by murder and does not inflate the bounty) when ship destruction is caused by collision to mitigate ram trolling.
• Notoriety stops you using Interstellar Factors, and they're the only way to pay off bounties (fines can be paid of at security contacts).
• Bounties are attached to ships, not Commanders, so if you switch to a ship with no bounties, you will not be wanted.
• Bounties never run out. They last forever, or until claimed or paid off using the Interstellar Factors.
• If your combined bounty/fine value for jurisdictions aligned to a superpower exceed more than 2 million CR, they will be conglomerated into an Interstellar bounty, which will make you wanted in all jurisdictions controlled by factions aligned with the superpower.

Hope this info helps.

Ok. Can we have now an ingame tutorial who explain to everyone is not in this forum how all that work?

 

[Arvel Yael]

Gold sellers = doom!


DOOM!



DOOOOOOOM!

Lol

CMDR Cosmic Spacehead

I'm gonna sing the Doom Song now!

[video=youtube;s2jvANh2aEc]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s2jvANh2aEc[/video]

 

[hookandsling]

Hello Commanders!

For clarity:

• A criminal can have bounties issued against their ships.
  
  
• Most bounty crimes are nominal values, because the real cost of committing them is becoming wanted, which allows other ships to legally attack and destroy them, triggering a potentially expensive rebuy (as well as the hassle of losing cargo, vouchers and respawning at a detention centre).
  
  
• The murder crime has a special set of rules to determine its cost, by using a new statistic: Notoriety.
  
  
• Notoriety increases every time you commit the crime of murder. It's a value from 0-10, and always starts at 0.
  
  
• Notoriety decays over time spent playing the game, at the rate of 1 point for every two hours that pass playing.
  
  
• When you commit murder, as well as the static portion of the bounty value (which is being set as 5000 CR across the board for legibility), two other calculations kick in:
  
  • 1. For every point of notoriety, an additional cost is added, equal to small fraction of your ship's rebuy value. This fraction increase ramps up as your Notoriety increses, so at Notoriety 10 you will be paying much, much more than at Notoriety 1.
    
    
  • 2. If the victim's ship has a rebuy cost (all Commander ships do), then the bounty value is increased again. This time, the game looks at the difference between your ship's rebuy and the victim's rebuy. 10 percent of this value is added to the bounty per point of Notoriety you have. Basically, if the ship you attack has a bigger rebuy cost, then no extra is added. The cheaper the rebuy of the victim's ship, the greater the the amount of cost *could* be added. Notoriety determines exactly how much of this potential is *actually* added.
• When bounty hunters come a callin' and scan you and detect your bounty, they receive a bounty claim upon destroying your ship. This claim is equal to the bounty cost, but is capped (the cap is being increased to 2 million per jurisdiction. So even if you committed many murders and ended up with a 50 million credit bounty in a jurisdiction, the most a bounty hunter could claim upon taking you down is 2 million.

Other trivia:

• Notoriety also helps the victim. For each point of Notoriety your killer had when they murdered you, your rebuy cost is reduced by 6% in compensation by the Pilot's Federation. Basically, your rebuy will be more than halved when you fall foul of a Notoriety 10 murderer.
  
  
• Around starports, Notoriety is not used (it is not increased by murder and does not inflate the bounty) when ship destruction is caused by collision to mitigate ram trolling.
  
  
• Notoriety stops you using Interstellar Factors, and they're the only way to pay off bounties (fines can be paid of at security contacts).
  
  
• Bounties are attached to ships, not Commanders, so if you switch to a ship with no bounties, you will not be wanted.
  
  
• Bounties never run out. They last forever, or until claimed or paid off using the Interstellar Factors.
  
  
• If your combined bounty/fine value for jurisdictions aligned to a superpower exceed more than 2 million CR, they will be conglomerated into an Interstellar bounty, which will make you wanted in all jurisdictions controlled by factions aligned with the superpower.

Hope this info helps.

For goodness sake - please put this guide where it can be found.
Preferably in the game, but a sticky at least.

 

[Jmanis]

nevermind

 

[Mephane]

[*]Notoriety decays over time spent playing the game, at the rate of 1 point for every two hours that pass playing.

I said it in another thread already: counting only time spent in the game is an effectivily meaningless but wasteful restriction - either someone would continue to play while the nororiety is above 0 anyway, or if they would actually take some "time off" to let it cool down, they would just sit somewhere afk to wait until it's back to 0.

To be brutally frank, Sandro, sometimes it seems you have little grasp of how gamers actually think. Letting the PC run over night, or while at work, sitting afk in a game is nothing of that means to sit out something like that. And making the times longer only increases the incentive to do so over extended periods (or in multiple sessions).

Meanwhile, for anyone who would be willing to play with the risk from being at notoriety above 0, it makes no difference whether that time has to pass in the game or in real time, because they would keep playing either way.

And finally, I must say this makes some other design decisions look deliberately made to be punishing where they needn't. Think of mission timers - you let them run in real time instead of ingame time, where it would be in the players' favour if it were the latter. Now you are letting something run in ingame time (the first time anything like that is not real time, by the way) where it is to the intended (yet not practically effective, as explained above) disadvantage of the player.

Bounties are attached to ships, not Commanders, so if you switch to a ship with no bounties, you will not be wanted.

And what if I put all modules in storage, sell the ship, buy a fresh out, and put back in my stored modules? All bounties from that ship gone? Because as soon as the bounties exceed 10% of the hull price, that would be the most economical answer, and in any case it would circumvent the "cannot use interstellar factors to pay off while notoriety is above 0" limit to pay it off immediately.

 

[Mohrgan]

I said it in another thread already: counting only time spent in the game is an effectivily meaningless but wasteful restriction - either someone would continue to play while the nororiety is above 0 anyway, or if they would actually take some "time off" to let it cool down, they would just sit somewhere afk to wait until it's back to 0.

To be brutally frank, Sandro, sometimes it seems you have little grasp of how gamers actually think. Letting the PC run over night, or while at work, sitting afk in a game is nothing of that means to sit out something like that. And making the times longer only increases the incentive to do so over extended periods (or in multiple sessions).

Meanwhile, for anyone who would be willing to play with the risk from being at notoriety above 0, it makes no difference whether that time has to pass in the game or in real time, because they would keep playing either way.

And finally, I must say this makes some other design decisions look deliberately made to be punishing where they needn't. Think of mission timers - you let them run in real time instead of ingame time, where it would be in the players' favour if it were the latter. Now you are letting something run in ingame time (the first time anything like that is not real time, by the way) where it is to the intended (yet not practically effective, as explained above) disadvantage of the player.



And what if I put all modules in storage, sell the ship, buy a fresh out, and put back in my stored modules? All bounties from that ship gone? Because as soon as the bounties exceed 10% of the hull price, that would be the most economical answer, and in any case it would circumvent the "cannot use interstellar factors to pay off while notoriety is above 0" limit to pay it off immediately.

I have never followed how having consequences will now make some one act like they are unfettered. It goes against logic. Those that buck the standard logic, not having consequences is the same as having them. So now we sort them. For a good many the timers will slow player's up, and make them consider their actions. It's the best you can do, considering Human Nature. Scare mongering. If you make me pay, I'll hurt you worse....

Modules equipped on a ship that becomes Wanted, become "Hot" and have to be cleared. Not clearing them will make the next ship Wanted as well. Boom.

 

[Mephane]

I have never followed how having consequences will now make some one act like they are unfettered. It goes against logic. Those that buck the standard logic, not having consequences is the same as having them. So now we sort them. For a good many the timers will slow player's up, and make them consider their actions. It's the best you can do, considering Human Nature. Scare mongering. If you make me pay, I'll hurt you worse....

I am honestly not sure what you are trying to say there. But let me assume you mean to imply I said that the notoriety timer is equivalent to no consequence; which is not what I said. What I said is, whether the timer runs in real time or ingame time, is of no effective consequence. For those who would keep doing what they are doing, it makes no difference. For those who actually want to lay low while playing, it makes no difference. For those who want to take a break from the game then, the only difference is that they don't turn off the game or their PC while they do whatever else it is they are doing (including playing a different game in the meantime, or playing ED on a different account - yes, people with multiple accounts are not so uncommon).

And whether someone sits afk docked at a starport, or closes the game, has absolutely no further bearing on the game, or other players. They are effectively gone for the time being, and not committing any further crimes. So mission accomplished? Yeah, but letting it run while not in the game would do exactly the same.

Modules equipped on a ship that becomes Wanted, become "Hot" and have to be cleared. Not clearing them will make the next ship Wanted as well. Boom.

Is that already the case in the 3.0 implementation or just a proposed solution to that particular loophole?

 

[Riverside]

Could you or Sandro elaborate on these, as it is not clear if hunting PP ships from another faction will be treated as Murder under the new rules ?

If a destroyed Ship/CMDR has ANY allegiance does this mean it is not Murder if destroyed by a CMDR with any opposing allegiance ?

It's not a part of the game I get involved in, but the info you need is here:

https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showthread.php/401809-Crime-Update-Rules-and-Feedback

The patch notes will contain info on any finalised changes when 3.0 is eventually released (no date yet).

hth.

 

[Raumfahrer Spiff]

I like the concept of notoriety in theory, but we should really be able to see other CMDRs notoriety level after a scan (make use of the relatively sparse contacts tab..)

Give potential victims a way of potentially making a judgment call on whether they can/should trust another CMDR or chance being in their vicinity.

More information is better--too much crucial info in this game is kept behind the curtain.

 

[Razar]

If I am doing bounty hunting (which I don't) I would want to get more than my ships rebuy cost. If it was an NPC, then I can understand. But another player is in a whole other level of dog fighting. Why would anyone want to risk getting killed for such a low cost. I know that not everyone has a ship that has a 1mil+ rebuy cost. But even then, why would someone want to waste their time for 2 million credits, when there are easier and less risky ways to make creds?

If someone has a bounty over 10 mill, then the bounty hunter should get at least that. If it is less than 10, then they should get whatever the bounty amount is.

If they have a 12 million credit bounty, and someone kills them, the one that killed them should get 10 million. The next time someone encounters them, there should be a 2 million credit bounty left.

Likewise, if they have a 25 million credit bounty, then killing them twice would net 10 million each time, with a 5 million credit bounty on them.

However, notoriety doesn't go down when killed. It stays for 7 days. That means that if they kill someone else again, it would give them an increased bounty per kill, and they will be watched closely by system security.

Razar.

 

[Roybe]

However, notoriety doesn't go down when killed. It stays for 7 days. That means that if they kill someone else again, it would give them an increased bounty per kill, and they will be watched closely by system security.

Razar.

Actually, notoriety will decay at the rate of 1 point every 2 hours in game.

 

[Jaffz]

This isn't World of Warcaft with a gazillion players

Maybe someone will pay

But it isn't going to be a problem

 

[-Denali-]

Bounty rewards are capped at 1 million and have been for ages. For precisely this reason ( saucy folks used to do what you were talking about waaay back, so to prevent it, the 1 million cap was introduced).

Maybe someone pointed this out but Archon Fury has a recent video where he got a player bounty for over 2 million. It seems the 1 million limit is per system, not per cmdr.

 

[sollisb]

What's to stop me if I wanted to be a real a-hat, from just buying a throwaway like a Viper MK3 and slaughtering newbies, then sell the ship in an anarchy system?

 

[Raumfahrer Spiff]

What's to stop me if I wanted to be a real a-hat, from just buying a throwaway like a Viper MK3 and slaughtering newbies, then sell the ship in an anarchy system?

IMO, slaughtering newbies is never commendable, but it is a heck of a lot more reasonable in a Viper than it is in a Cutter.