C&P, to me seems like FD attempt to state that 'Hirogen knuckle draggers', will not be tolerated. There are some really 'Ace' pilots out there, but they don't target players doing their own thing, they are the real 'top guns'
Modes Will 3.0 Increase, decrease or have no effect on Open population?
- Thread starter Chaparral
- Start date
C&P, to me seems like FD attempt to state that 'Hirogen knuckle draggers', will not be tolerated. There are some really 'Ace' pilots out there, but they don't target players doing their own thing, they are the real 'top guns'
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I think most people play where they play for reasons other than C&P. I think people are happy where they are, and nothing FD does will have much of an effect.
My excuse is that I do not enjoy interaction with other humans. Not just in ED, but in any game.
I have dozens of cool games with multiplayer components, but I always ignore those components.
I'd be curious to see what changes.
I generally play in Mobius, but If I know ATR are going to assist in my survival, I might even attempt to take down my attacker. So open would be more fun*, because it sort of addresses the issue between PvE and PvP setups, which is one of the main reasons I avoid open.
*Because running, while exhilarating the first few times, is generally dull.
CMDR Cosmic Spacehead
I generally play in Mobius, but If I know ATR are going to assist in my survival, I might even attempt to take down my attacker. So open would be more fun*, because it sort of addresses the issue between PvE and PvP setups, which is one of the main reasons I avoid open.
*Because running, while exhilarating the first few times, is generally dull.
CMDR Cosmic Spacehead
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Never played in open, private group and solo only. That way I don't have to deal with **** players. No C&P changes will change my mind.
Guess your not the target demographic for the C&P changes then.
ATR response shouldn't be counted on, in the way mentioned above. ATR will be triggered by the Attacker's Notoriety level, not by an individual engagement. You will still have to rely on local authorities mostly, until any given criminal is pursued by the ATR.
That's if you assume the C&P changes are only to repopulate open. I don't think they are. Part of the C&P/Notoriety changes are here to make playing a criminal character more interesting and challenging, in my opinion.
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Just like you have an excuse to stay in Open. Works both ways.
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Well, I always play in Open. But I'll be playing more when 3.0 comes out. I imagine we'll see a nice bump in the player base for all modes of play, so we'll see more peeps in Open regardless.
I do like the engineering changes, though. Top of the line needs an end point everyone can reach for PvP encounters. It's good for piece of mind if nothing else.
I do like the engineering changes, though. Top of the line needs an end point everyone can reach for PvP encounters. It's good for piece of mind if nothing else.
The OP is an interesting question but since we will not be told the payer/mode ratios either before or after the change, it's also a pretty pointless question.
You'd need a ship tough enough to survive until the ATR arrive and still be in reasonable shape at that point. Not impossible by any means for a toughened multirole. I'm not convinced you'd be adding much to the ATR firepower, though.
Okay, no. There are orders of magnitude difference here. For a trade ship to be unkillable it needs to survive 1 minute at most (10 second cooldown, 15 second highwake, 15 second FSD reset if it gets hit by a Grom missile, 20 seconds spare time). Under a full wing of fire this requires significant but not excessive defences ... against a single ship it's practical to survive a minute without even using engineering.
A fully-fit PvP combat ship built for max defense can survive 20 minutes or more under the same level of firepower. In a 1v1 a maxed ship can survive almost indefinitely in some cases because its shield regeneration is faster than it can practically be hit.
What the complaints are about is not "reduce that 1 minute" but "reduce those 20 minutes to more like 5 minutes". This can be done by introducing diminishing returns which don't kick in until *well* after the maximum defences of any plausible non-combatant have been exceeded. In other words, reducing the gap between PvP-fit and PvE-fit ships so that people are less targets and more matched ships. (But PvE combateers don't want matched ships, they want to sit in a RES for 6 hours in an invincible engineered ship racking up the bounties at zero risk, so no chance of this happening)
Note also that police other than ATR would be more effective at defence of traders if it was possible to destroy a PvP ship with something other than a station gun, and C&P would be more effective if PvP-fit ships were actually killable, and "good guy" PvPers would be also more able to protect traders.
I agree this would be funny. Specifically, it would be funny when 99.9% of the bubble shut down within a week because no-one was willing to trade the cheap but essential goods so even the key stations were short on food, basic supplies, basic minerals, etc. (Source: station repair progress and the masses of people complaining that the station repairs are really difficult and should be easier but not doing anything about it themselves because it's not actually profitable in Cr/Hr)
I would say that this question is not the right one. Imo more interesting will be asking If 3.0 will be more enjoyable for those who play ED in open ... I think it will be and I'm looking forward to the Q1 release.
Nah, furious speculation and spurious extrapolation is what these forums (and the internet in general) thrive on...
The thing is, bounties currently expire after a week and can be cleared by suicidewinder anyway. So it makes very little difference there. Without the amnesty all you'd have got would have been a quiet week just now while everyone calmly lets their bounties expire...
The big catch is the people who've accumulated billions in fines - possibly months ago - and never needed to pay them off before. Now they will, but might not have the money.
(When Interstellar Factors first came in, I discovered I had a few million in unpaid and forgotten fines, and I mostly fly in a law-abiding way. There are definitely people with billions of the things...)
If [1] it restricts hostile pilots to killing only one ship every 2 in-game hours (and that includes any police ships which try to assist the trader they attack, since NPC murders also add notoriety) then that's a massive win for undershielded traders, since at the moment they can kill one every 2 in-game minutes with basically zero consequence.
Remember that they can't clear their bounty until those 2 hours is over, which basically makes that ship useless for anything but more crimes.
Everything in-game is accelerated because it's a game. 2 hours is a pretty long time. You can get to Colonia in 2 hours with a fast ship. You can get to Hutton Orbital in half that. You can transfer a ship across most of the bubble in half that. People complain regularly about all of those delays being far too long. 2 hours is going to be plenty and I predict the majority of complaints about it once 3.0 gets going will be PvEers with poor RES trigger discipline complaining it's far too long.
Sure, but it only stays a Clean ship if you don't commit any further crimes, and Notoriety isn't ship-specific. It means that they can safely fly as Clean a non-combat ship for when they're not killing things but given how easy it is to make an invincible-versus-bounty hunters ship even in 2.4 where the PF bounty is on the player, that makes no practical difference.
[1] It won't. They'll ignore notoriety entirely and just keep the bounty - but then have to wait 20 hours without murder to be able to clear it, which is very substantial, so they probably won't bother with that either. The big thing that is going to make a difference in C&P is the substantial extra bounty for killing a lower-rebuy ship with a high notoriety. That basically takes the Cutter, Corvette and Anaconda out of action entirely as practical murder-ships (even once the notoriety has decayed they will have bounties of hundreds of millions or billions to clear) unless used only as a murder-ship and never dying. Some will be able to manage that anyway, because "never dying" is easy in a combat ship ... but the less competent ones will find themselves rapidly (and perhaps surprisingly) bankrupt.
(Even the FDL will be pretty expensive for attacks on anything other than ships able to easily mount enough shielding to get away from it)
It's not. Nor is C&P made as a device to slow the mass exodus from Open. It's meant to discourage the wanton, wholesale slaughter of people still trying to figure out how to get their sidewinders out of the mail slot for the first time, and to dissuade the leave-no-witnesses, your-money-and-your-life style of so-called piracy.
What effect will this have on mode populations? +/- 1 CMDR at most.
This is precisely the attitude/mindset and total lack of respect for other player's choices that have given Open and those who evangelize it as the only viable mode in the game, the overall negative reputation if has within the larger ED community.
No changes to the game is ever going to change this perception. Especially when we see comments like the above on a daily basis throughout these forums.
Many who complain about the lack of a decent gaming population in Open are actually the very same players responsible for helping to clear it out.
I think I'll be in Open more. I default to Open these days, but I quickly switch to Private / Solo when I spot griefers at a place I plan on 'working', like a CG or station under evacuation.
That said, there are other reasons to switch to Solo / PG. I find the "fishing holes" overly crowded in Open at Bounty Hunting CGs, and I'm betting certain Engineers will be extra crowded when 3.0 drops. I'll also switch when Frontier's servers are struggling, in order to avoid a 10 minute SC transition. Sometimes I explore in Solo because I don't want my friends knowing where I am (it makes the galaxy feel bigger when one can 'get lost' in the stars without being tracked in real time).
But to the OP's point, I feel safer in Open with the new C&P rules in place. Not safe, just safer.
Having played in Open since Gamma my answer would be "no effect" as people choose their game mode for whatever reason they want in a game they pay for. The whole premise that players can be encouraged en masse to switch modes because of the introduction of X,Y or Z is a classic example of cognitive dissonance.
I can't see how Open can become any worse?
The NPCs currently have no effect against ganking, so how exactly do you go backwards from that?
Honestly this whole thread seems rigged to poke fun at Fdevs expense, and while they make.....questionable.....decisions from time to time, they clearly have a vision for the game, even if it's not one some people want, a I can at least respect that, as some developers are far worse and seem to actively try to mess with the community, only adding to the problems at hand.
Fdev, at the very least, area trying. Just look at ATR ships and notoriety. Does it possibly need tweaking? Only time will tell, but I'm certain Fdev will tweak the system if needs be, and some problems (like making piracy competitive to do while discouraging ganking at the same time), require approachs outside the box that seem to be ignored (like with the previous example, if it was easy to loot cargo without destroying ships, then you could seperate pirates from gankers very easily).
TL;DR: OP and others like them, need to lay of Fdevs back for once and actually try to help them instead of just being negative like this thread. If they want to be negative, they should play a game like Overwatch, I'm sure they'd fit right in there
This is not an anti-Fdev thread as you seem to think it is. People are just voicing their opinions in response to the OP.
Personally, my engineered ships are adequate for Solo but would not be for serious PvP in Open, or for defending myself against a PvP Gank-Machine. As a result, I shall stick to Mobius or Solo.
I certainly have no intention at all of going through the RNGineer grind again simply in order to play in an open environment that was screwed from the first moment of the RNGineers being introduced. Good luck to those who are happy to succumb to FDev's principal time-wasting mechanic.
In any case, even in the early days, ED never felt to me like a true MMO. It is a single-player game with a few MMO bolt-ons; nothing more. The latest changes will not change that.
Exactly NOTHING will happen. For Solo and Group-Players there´s still no reason to play Open. Gankers will still be able to gank, and Gankers will still be able to hide in Solo/Group for Re-Grinding Money.