Minor fines and service denial.

Way i see it......You have an Artic lorry full of blankets travelling down the M1 destined for the homeless and freezing people in say...........Derby, police pull you over for speeding! Still gotta pay the fine, and if you don't then just maybe your truck gets impounded until you do pay the fine + expenses.

Time scales are different, but the facts are the same. Do the crime, pay the fine!

If that happens we get a bill at home and not the whole car impounded. Might happen in weirdo country. But to egt your car immediately taken away you must do some serious dangerous stuff first.

lower fines should not directly lead into getting excluded, that isn't very logical at all.
 
I see the logic here i cant lie and that would indeed be something wed have to figure out.

Perhaps there could be a clause where if you were attacked first you are well within the right to return fire without getting a fine?
A self defence clause..much like what exists in the real world?

Of course if it was accidental fire and the other pilot only got a small fine..this means you cant flat out murder them...there would be a clause there too.

The issue is that the game cannot determine intent... To that end the rules have to be pretty black and white. If what we have now is too complex for some players, just imagine how people would react to the possible 'mitigating excuses' that you have already identified.

It's the reason that friendly fire has to be a bounty too. "Hey, I wasn't even targeting them, obviously it was a mistake, how come I'm wanted now?" Well, plenty of players quite capable enough with weapons to be able to chip away at another person without targeting them. Intent, the game can't tell, so there has to be a simple binary rule, and if we break that rule then we face whatever consequences. :)

Generally, people only look at the issue from one direction here on the forums. They understand that they made a mistake, but don't see why the punishment should be so severe. If they actually were able to think it through, they'd see that if they were on the other end of the mistake, they would likely want it to be just as it is. The irony is that there are already plenty of posts where people complain that they got a bounty because they were attacked and got wanted for defending themselves. That's typically down to buggy behavior, but the point stands I think that no one would be happy with that situation were it possible in the game.
 
The issue is that the game cannot determine intent... To that end the rules have to be pretty black and white. If what we have now is too complex for some players, just imagine how people would react to the possible 'mitigating excuses' that you have already identified.

It's the reason that friendly fire has to be a bounty too. "Hey, I wasn't even targeting them, obviously it was a mistake, how come I'm wanted now?" Well, plenty of players quite capable enough with weapons to be able to chip away at another person without targeting them. Intent, the game can't tell, so there has to be a simple binary rule, and if we break that rule then we face whatever consequences. :)

Generally, people only look at the issue from one direction here on the forums. They understand that they made a mistake, but don't see why the punishment should be so severe. If they actually were able to think it through, they'd see that if they were on the other end of the mistake, they would likely want it to be just as it is. The irony is that there are already plenty of posts where people complain that they got a bounty because they were attacked and got wanted for defending themselves. That's typically down to buggy behavior, but the point stands I think that no one would be happy with that situation were it possible in the game.

Hull damage: intent to kill - Bounty (victim can defend self by all means with no punishment)

Shield damage:
intent to fight. - Fine (victim of assault defend self but only to a point. If they damge your shields...you can damage theirs with no punishment but killing them is considered illegal)

Lets not complicate it too much but this is what i meant by the fight escalating or potentially de escalating.
If im assaulted on the street and i get punched , ok i can punch him back. But if i get punched once and i go over the top and kill the guy...well i suspect i would be punished.

Its just an idea, we dont have to dwell on it i guess.


o7
 
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Hull damage: intent to kill - Bounty (defend youself by all means with no punishment)

Shield damage:
intent to fight. - Fine (defend yourself but only to a point. If they damge your shields...you can damage theirs with bo punishment but killing them is considered illegal)

Lets not complicate it too much.

Its just an idea, we dont have to dwell on it i guess.


o7

I like this simplification of the whole system. Can we please remove the existing system and replace it with the above???
 
Its much, much easier to cry about something and demand its changed to suit you than it is to learn the basics.

Welcome to the forums.


Errr why are you quoting me? did you get the wrong post to quote?? I am not the one crying, i am one of the ones saying get on an pay the damn fine and do the crime pay the fine??

care to enlighten me why you quoted my post?

Thanks
 
I like this simplification of the whole system. Can we please remove the existing system and replace it with the above???

What if the aggressor doesn't have shields? You would also be required to remember who attacked you when and how so you know which NPC / player you can attack. It's also open for all kinds of exploits. Nope, sorry, this is neither simpler nor better.
 
Errr why are you quoting me? did you get the wrong post to quote?? I am not the one crying, i am one of the ones saying get on an pay the damn fine and do the crime pay the fine??

care to enlighten me why you quoted my post?

Thanks

lol no man i was just telling you what i thought of him haha

o7
 
What if the aggressor doesn't have shields? You would also be required to remember who attacked you when and how so you know which NPC / player you can attack. It's also open for all kinds of exploits. Nope, sorry, this is neither simpler nor better.

If the agressor has no shields - They still fired first. The game could make an excpetion in this case and simply adjust the rules to allow you to damage them to half hull before the intent state changes.

Simple really.

I like this simplification of the whole system. Can we please remove the existing system and replace it with the above???

Its just an idea and it needs tweaking and discussion sure but i think theres grounds there for consideration.
 
It seems like some folks would be fine with the idea of me interdicting another player (Fine: 300cr) and hatchbreaking (Bounty: 400cr) their cargo and it being written-off as "small infractions".
 
It seems like some folks would be fine with the idea of me interdicting another player (Fine: 300cr) and hatchbreaking (Bounty: 400cr) their cargo and it being written-off as "small infractions".

So... if i rob you anyone has a green light to kill me?

That seems like a well thought out system.
 
If the agressor has no shields - They still fired first. The game could make an excpetion in this case and simply adjust the rules to allow you to damage them to half hull before the intent state changes.

Simple really.



Its just an idea and it needs tweaking and discussion sure but i think theres grounds there for consideration.
At first glance, sure its simple... then you need to account for modules, which you can trash an entire ship before dropping it to half hull... thats even more programming crapola to input. The current system in game is actually decent, but with the wreckless discharge non-functional the game is jumping straight to bounty.

Simplification is nice, but rarely simple.
 
Have you seen what happens to loiterers? Game can be straight up Old Testament brutal at times.

Well the issue wit this is we have no better ingme mechanic, to kinda "tractor beam" or the AI to remote controls these ships off. And it had to be penalised harshyl becasue some morons would otherwise absolutely abuse this to grief in open and block entire stations. yet the system turns out to eb ridculous if you see how often NPC's get blown up becase the Ai cannot even properly steer some ships out fo the station. And form an inunivers epoitn fo view, havign ship debis and even huge cutter debis flying aroudn inside of your station is totally something completely idiotic.
 
I have no problem with having to pay off fines, and being restricted until you do. I do have a problem with the disproportionate reaction you get when you accidentally get a 200cr fine in a combat situation and then all NPCs turn on you to kill you for 200cr!
 
At first glance, sure its simple... then you need to account for modules, which you can trash an entire ship before dropping it to half hull... thats even more programming crapola to input. The current system in game is actually decent, but with the wreckless discharge non-functional the game is jumping straight to bounty.

Simplification is nice, but rarely simple.

As i said, just an idea.. but im sure with constructive chat we could figure that out.
Module damage could easily be factored in. If your life support is about to fail...well thats considered life threatening. Where as giving someone a flat tire is not a cause to murder them.

Im a firm believer that simplification can be simple. Its just us as humans love to complicate everything.

o7
 
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If the agressor has no shields - They still fired first. The game could make an excpetion in this case and simply adjust the rules to allow you to damage them to half hull before the intent state changes.

Simple really.

Its just an idea and it needs tweaking and discussion sure but i think theres grounds there for consideration.

I honestly believe that you think it's simple, but it's so not simple...

If I am attacked, I will destroy the ship that attacked me, and I'm pretty sure that you would want to do that too. The only reason I would not destroy the ship is if it wakes out on me, because once it has waked out it is no longer in a position to attack me.

You are proposing that if I am attacked, I have to moderate my response, and may not continue to defend myself without falling foul of the law / rules by making sure that I stop shooting when their hull approaches 50%. And if they are still shooting me, but have still not taken out my shields? Do I really have to wait until my shields go down and I've taken a bit of hull damage before I can finally rid myself of them?

As I said above, the game cannot tell intent. It simply says you have been attacked, you are free to defend yourself because your attacker is now wanted. That is simple. :)
 
You see, in the year 3010, Tri-millenials began loitering about, using their Gal-phones and blocking shipping lanes, airlocks, and even whole sectors of the galaxy. Due to the lack of parental guidance, government practices against punishment of children, and general unemployment, humanity reached a point where production and distribution was at an all time low.
Due to this, online complaints about shortages abounded on GReddit. Gwitter exploded. Outrage ensued. Finally, a hero stood up, pointed the station defense cannons at the loiters and, with a large vein at his temple pulsating with rage, unleashed hellfire into the hangar bay.
All was saved, loitering became punishable by death, and that man was elected to lead the Federation.
All hail Zachary Hudson.
 
I honestly believe that you think it's simple, but it's so not simple...

If I am attacked, I will destroy the ship that attacked me, and I'm pretty sure that you would want to do that too. The only reason I would not destroy the ship is if it wakes out on me, because once it has waked out it is no longer in a position to attack me.

You are proposing that if I am attacked, I have to moderate my response, and may not continue to defend myself without falling foul of the law / rules by making sure that I stop shooting when their hull approaches 50%. And if they are still shooting me, but have still not taken out my shields? Do I really have to wait until my shields go down and I've taken a bit of hull damage before I can finally rid myself of them?

As I said above, the game cannot tell intent. It simply says you have been attacked, you are free to defend yourself because your attacker is now wanted. That is simple. :)

Have you ever been in a schoolyard fight? I have.

Im pretty sure hes still alive.

I actually didnt have to try very hard to NOT murder him. But yea i like to think i gave as good as i got.


ANYWAY as i have said 47 times...it was just an idea....dont worry im not trying to break your game...we dont have to dwell on it.
All im doing is suggesting an idea to the people who are not a fan of the current one.

(not directed at you)


o7

You see, in the year 3010, Tri-millenials began loitering about, using their Gal-phones and blocking shipping lanes, airlocks, and even whole sectors of the galaxy. Due to the lack of parental guidance, government practices against punishment of children, and general unemployment, humanity reached a point where production and distribution was at an all time low.
Due to this, online complaints about shortages abounded on GReddit. Gwitter exploded. Outrage ensued. Finally, a hero stood up, pointed the station defense cannons at the loiters and, with a large vein at his temple pulsating with rage, unleashed hellfire into the hangar bay.
All was saved, loitering became punishable by death, and that man was elected to lead the Federation.
All hail Zachary Hudson.

lmao
 
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