Just when you thought grinding couldn't get any lower...

..., you go and do a thing, like meet someone called Hera Tani. This, boys and girls, is the classic example of desperation at its finest. In this case desperation to create grind where none is warranted. We got people out there with cargo space that can fit a village in it, yet, the commodity market here is rigged so that as long as it so much as detects the 23 Kamitra cigars it has just sold you, in your inventory, it absolutely WILL NOT restock anymore....ever...not until you fly back to Hera Tani and offload what you have...only then will you be "allowed" to stock more in your hold. So this means your third trip back is to buy 4 cigars? FOUR??? What the???

I'm sorry, but I procrastinated for almost 4 years in unlocking these engineers for precisely this reason. I did not believe in engineering because I thought the whole "make this person happy, to get a referral to that person, to make them happy, to get a referral to another person, to make them happy...." thing, in addition to the "oh each one of us want some stupid commodity thing, too" was so poor. Iit appears I was not wrong. Oh and while we are on the topic... Marco Qwent was the most useless thing I've ever unlocked in a game, but we NEED him, for Palin...and what does Palin want? Nothing more, or less, ridiculous than what Selene wants. Let's see...jump 20 thousand times? or mine 500 tons of ore? I just can't decide which is more fun?

But even after all that...do I still love Elite? A mind blowing "YES." It just bewilders me how low people can go to figure "how can we create unnecessary grind?" And, you know you struck the gold mine of "grind ideas" when you think, "how about only fitting 23 tons of the required 50tons in a cargo hold of 160 tons?"
 
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Try this one for size: Finally scrounged up the 100+ technetium to unlock gimballed and fixed large and medium shock cannons, went to test them in a haz res and then I run out of ammo. Yep, they are worse at ammo than even double shot fragment cannons while the rearming for them costs grade 3 materials and not too few. What a complete waste. Now I have to wait until they boost them to get anything from the materials back I used to unlock the lot.
 
I looked at the unlock requirements for somemost of the engineers and said fuggedaboudit.

I'd like to have G5 thruster mods, and I travel thousands of LYs for FUN, it's what I DO in Elite. But I'll probably never meet Palin, because I'll probably never unlock Qwent*. I'll definitely never meet Hera Tani, because I'll never unlock Liz Ryder, because I avoid combat, which also locks me out of multiple other engineers. I'll never see the bottom two rows on Inara's list. Hell, Lei Chung is the only one on the second row that I got.

Oh well. I got enough for what I do. There's parts of the game I just simply don't want to play.

*Edit: Qwent's not really a good example anymore since, as Stealthie showed later in this thread, there are single missions around which give more MTs than he asks for these days. That kind of thing didn't exist back when I originally evaluated the engineers.
 
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I looked at the unlock requirements for somemost of the engineers and said fuggedaboudit.

I'd like to have G5 thruster mods, and I travel thousands of LYs for FUN, it's what I DO in Elite. But I'll probably never meet Palin, because I'll probably never unlock Qwent. I'll definitely never meet Hera Tani, because I'll never unlock Liz Ryder, because I avoid combat, which also locks me out of multiple other engineers. I'll never see the bottom two rows on Inara's list. Hell, Lei Chung is the only one on the second row that I got.

Oh well. I got enough for what I do. There's parts of the game I just simply don't want to play.

I hear you. There are some engineers I won't unlock almost as a point of principle.

I took one look at the guardian grind and decided not to go there. It's just not worth it, doing the same drive/shoot/collect puzzle game over and over and over...for one blueprint. Just no.

I find myself increasingly limiting the activities I'll take on in ED just to avoid the grind, game is getting smaller and smaller for me.
 
I looked at the unlock requirements for somemost of the engineers and said fuggedaboudit.

I'd like to have G5 thruster mods, and I travel thousands of LYs for FUN, it's what I DO in Elite. But I'll probably never meet Palin, because I'll probably never unlock Qwent. I'll definitely never meet Hera Tani, because I'll never unlock Liz Ryder, because I avoid combat, which also locks me out of multiple other engineers. I'll never see the bottom two rows on Inara's list. Hell, Lei Chung is the only one on the second row that I got.

Oh well. I got enough for what I do. There's parts of the game I just simply don't want to play.

I feel your pain. I was in the same boat. I had my own way I liked to play the game, too. It was just opposite you. Combat only. So I'd seemingly never unlock anyone requiring trading, exploring etc. It's the game's way of saying, "We're going to make you play our way..." which is the opposite of what games should do. Lol
 
Unlocking engineers isn't always sparkling gameplay but it's hardly the end of the world.

Don't think it takes more than an hour to unlock any of them... aside from Palin, depending on whether you've done any travelling already.

Yes I agree. There’s no doubt that FD seem to have gone out of there way to make many of the unlock requirements deeply annoying, but it’s not that traumatic. I unlocked the majority over the course a few weeks pretty early in my game and that’s it, done for the rest of my time in Elite. Just grin (d) and bear it. Personally, I find material acquisition more irritating than the unlock process. I agree with the O.P’s general sentiment though – questionable game design.

That said, some of these requirements do encourage you to venture out of your comfort zone and try different aspects of the game. As an explorer, Palin was one of the first that I unlocked. I have a few remaining like Lori and Juri Ishmaak, simply because I’ve not been a combat oriented player. It was largely the desire to unlock these that encouraged me to spend more time on combat. I’m quite enjoying it, even though it's proving to be a bit of a slog.
 
Hey look at this boys, Bro-Man Tarquin wants 50 Fujin Teas. How much you want to bet I can't put any more than 23 at a time in my cargo?
 
I feel your pain. I was in the same boat. I had my own way I liked to play the game, too. It was just opposite you. Combat only. So I'd seemingly never unlock anyone requiring trading, exploring etc. It's the game's way of saying, "We're going to make you play our way..." which is the opposite of what games should do. Lol

I mean sure, I get it, not all of a game is going to be accessible from every playstyle. There's things in Skyrim I'll never do or see because I don't want to play a certain way. I'll never summon synths in Fallout 4. And I'll never see the Chaos ending of Neptunia Rebirth 2 (or even any of the various other endings aside from True end). That's ok.

But the difference is the actions required to achieve most of those generally aren't boring or rage-inducing. In my first round of engineering I ragequit the grind and headed off into the black with half-baked modifications because I was so sick of trying to scrounge up the data mats that could only be gotten from surface data points (little did I know, planetary scan missions are an excellent source of those, or maybe they didn't yield so many at the time).

I don't want to say the engineers should just be open to all but maybe they should have a good, long think about what their goal is with the requirements, and then ask: "is this fun, and is it still fun for a player who doesn't like combat/trading/exploring? If not, could we make an alternative that is?"
 
Hmmm... another post ranting about "The Grind"...

fascinating...

No, not grinding. This is a whole other thing. To say that somebody can't put more than 23 of [X] item in their cargo hold until they've dropped off the 23 they have...down right dirty. What's the point of anything over a Cobra then? Got a cutter with nearly 750t of cargo space? Sorry! It's only 23t of cigars for you! "Hey! Truck driver hauling 25 skids of Pepsi a cross town... I'm afraid we're going to need 20 of those skids back. Deliver 5 and you have and come back for another 5."
 
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Might be a good idea to try that player-run trading thing out, where you can trade platinum for various materials. I bet they could hook you up so you don't have to scrounge for stuff
 
It's bad I agree.

But when I did the Hera Tani unlock, the cigars only appeared in quantities of 5...

:(



You must be thinking about Broo Tarquin's flippin teas. I just pulled into port and discovered that they are only sold in lots of 5. So let's pickup 5, deliver them 10 times, shall we? Hmmm...let's see how many jumps that is.
 
if it's worth anything, it's not only 4 or 5 cigars you can haul at a time, but 4 or 5 tons of cigars...

Sorry, I am not good at making people feel better :D
 
Gotta agree with OP. I started the grind for Selene Jean last week. Did all the hoop-jumping and now locked on grade 3 Armour despite having all the materials up to Grade 5. I can't seem to get ahead now as I think I now have to keep grinding this grade 3 on all manner of ships until I get to grade 4 etc. I mean really? I "liked" the old system better. I guess my old brain isn’t grasping this new fangled way of doing stuff lol. Any tips on how to accomplish grade 5 would be most welcome!
 
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Gotta agree with OP. I started the grind for Selene Jean last week. Did all the hoop-jumping and now locked on grade 3 Armour despite having all the materials up to Grade 5. I can't seem to get ahead now as I think I now have to keep grinding this grade 3 on all manner of ships until I get to grade 4 etc. I mean really? I "liked" the old system better. I guess my old brain isn’t grasping this new fangled way of doing stuff lol. Any tips on how to accomplish grade 5 would be most welcome!
Buy some hull reinforcement, put it on your ship and keep engineering it. Remove the mod when you hit the barrier and start over engineering. Repeat until you unlock grade five.
 
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