I find it fine tbh. Reminds me of freelancer and that's no bad thing.
No Man's Sky recent success is good sign for Elite and future Space games/sims
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I find it fine tbh. Reminds me of freelancer and that's no bad thing.
Those are very good points made, but ED team is bigger, ED has been longer in development than NMS, and the AI complexity is just a matter of time.
I agree that ED flight model is unparalleled at the moment, but NMS flight model development has improved it greatly since release and who knows what updates we will still see in the future.
Elite's AI is really good, but keep in mind, unless the NPC AI is extremelly stupid, you will not know who flies the ship - a human or NPC (unless the game indicates), due to the game being relatively slow paced, compared to other twitch games like CS, Dota2, LoL, where you can see if the human is playing or computer, but the lines are getting blurred there also. The same situation is in NMS, where you really can't tell if the flying ship is human or not.
How it looks is purely subjective, it's completely different style and for some it possibly looks even amazing.
Also, why would you or developers would want to have or make a game that is very close to the game that already exist? It would be a dumb business decision.
You are not making anything new if you are copying another game.
That's why NMS is totally different beast, however, you can't discredit how such a small team was able to turn the community around, make the game actually pretty great adding massive updates, in quite a short amount of time - compared to ED development speed.
And I disagree about competitor, it is still a competitor due to all the similarities - spaceships, planet exploration, space battles - where one is more arcadey and other more sim-like.
That maybe true. I never got to that part because the beginning of the game was so bad, 2-3 hours of constant deaths because there is not enough oxygen. The rest may be better, but from what I can tell from others the flight model is dreadful. And when you get to another planet you need to start shooting crap again to refuel it from what I understand. If I'm wrong about that and refuelling is easy and I don't need to shoot crap anymore then I may be interested. But from what I can tell, that is not the case.
I have also said I will try again and try to persevere. Maybe start again as I may have been on an unlucky starting planet.
I never had these issues with ED.
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ED could have improved at the same time frame if they didn't work on the wrong things like multicrew, engineers, passenger missions/SLF, Powerplay, CQC etc.
For me with ED it hasn't been the time of development what was wrong, it was what was developed.
What they should have done in season one is concentrated on making the core game better, may be powerplay should have released with 1.5 giving the team working on it more time to be made better.
With horizons it should have concentrated on planetary gameplay. Then in beyond they could have added multicrew with more roles as they would have had the gameplay to compliment it. And the same with the rest of the horizons upgrades.
Build the base first, then add stuff on top. With ED they built a rickety base and then tried to build on top and found it hard to do as parts kept falling down.
Now they are trying to fix the base with all this stuff on top of it. Not what I would call the best way to go about it.
I agree, Elite focused on adding more features just for the sake to have players keep coming back to be harshly disappointed by the released quality - instead of few, but really polished ones.
I would take 1 polished mechanic over 5 anyday. But to be fair, SLF is in pretty good spot and doesn't feel unfinished, though SRV SLF type gameplay would have been amazing.
Elite *had* (with Beyond maybe they start to see that polish is more important than adding features on top of the house of cards) a similar feature creep like Star Citizen, and both of them got and still getting a backlash of not finishing what they released and abondoning them all together while continuing to work on new things.
This really has to stop. I feel that C&P is still broken and already feels abondoned. Where can I put feedback that 200 credit fines from NPCs should not make me kill on sight/wanted, blocking me from using station services?
Elite doesn't understand what players want and *Players don't understand what Elite wants us to understand*. Why C&P has caused so many problems for PVE players when it was meant to prevent seal clubbing? Frontier is extremelly disconnected and caved on a vocal minority while effecting EVERYONE with untested new mechanic.
Yes the VR is amazing !
Yes the Graphics are Amazing !
The AI? Is pathetic! To use your words, 'Garbage bin quality' Just making a ship almost god like does not infer good AI. The AI is how the ship reacts to coming under fire from you the player. I can hand on heart say I can list here the AI for each and every ship in the game in terms of what it will do. How-ever there is an arguement, that the NPCs are really only fodder, and can't be too smart. And that's fine. But to say the AI good is just wrong. Spamming chaff is not good AI, Spamming rockets to blind the player is not good AI, Boosting off to 4k away and coming zooming back is not good AI. What is, is cheap AI.
While NMS can be derided for lack of AI and ship graphics, it has to be borne in mind, that NMS has a team of 10 working on it, where-as Elite has 100+. Those 10 NMS devs gave us; Atmospheric planets, Boots on the ground, base building and inter planet/system travel. What did FDev bring us? Let's have a quick tally; A stellar forge, which is a hack of an existing 3 decade old code base. A system to jump from 1 system to another. A system to allow us to put x things in ship and offload them somehwere else and combat based on a 'we cant code AI so we'll over-power the ships'. The core base of Elite was there and has been in their codebase for 4 years and counting. Everything since, from a dev team of 100+ is basic Database code.
The flight model has been there since release, every ship is based on it, using different parameters. I'm sorry when you measure 10 against the 100+ in Fdev, in my opinion, Fdev are lacking, and to a huge margin.
What I see from FDev is a means to milk the honey via the store. NMS is way out in front when engaging the player. If you take away the graphics, Elite is nothing more than souped up copy of a 1974 game. And that's fact.
The problem you have is you believe second hand inaccurate complaining and can't fact check it.
Just to concentrate on one point you raised, the AI. Yep, presently the AI is average at best but wasn't there a time where MoM bought the NPC abilities up and what was the result - total whingfest here on the forums rivers of salt so wide Moses couldn't part it, so much so that the NPCs had to be nerfed.
Honestly, I am really happy you and certain others are so taken with NMS, it appears to be the game you have all been searching for. Just can't understand why you all are still hanging around the forums of a game you now consider so inferior in so many ways.
Again, for the millionth time, C&P is not there to prevent seal clubbing. They literally said this over and over. That is just a myth constantly spread by the weaker players here. FD does not want to prevent, as they said, 'griefcondas killing noobwinders'. Sandro said it. DB said it. This has always been the case. This 'it was against griefers but the design is failed!!!!' is just some myth from upset traders who feel everyone but themselves is responsible for their ship. C&P is there to add more consequences to crime. Period. There are some added mechanics that add some extra punishments to PVP crimes, and some soothing balm for 'victims', but it is not intended to 'prevent' anything nor are the PVE consequences unintended. PVE players, like me, just need to accept that it is not just 'other people's crimes' that are wrong. Dont shoot cops by accident. Dont ram other ships when docking. Or do, and get punished.
It's just awesome how people jump on Eagleboy for having an opinion on NMS without playing it while it's perfectly fine that you have an opinion on ED without playing it.
That is also a myth. What happened is that primarily one routine was removed: fleeing AI when shields are down. This happened at the same time when there was a bug with AI engineered modules, which caused random parameter mismatch. Sometimes this would work in the advantage of us (multicannons shooting with the speed of railguns). Sometimes, in the case of railfuns shooting with the speed of beamlasers, it would be instant death. There was a lot of confusiong about 'killer AI', but it was 99% a bug and 1% an interesting but eventually annoying AI routine. Personally I feel the 'flee' routine should be added back to assassination targets and such, but it reduced RES and CZ to even more boring grindfests when flying big (and slow) ships.
In any case, the 'amazing AI was nerfed due to vocal minority' is also not true.
Ignoring the more ludicrous points you raise: why should I keep this in mind when they charge the same amount for their game? If I pay less for a product, I will keep it in mind. If I pay AAA prices, I can expect AAA quality regardless if its one dude or a million dudes making it. Anyway, I am glad you are enjoying NMS thoroughly, and I wish you the best in their community.
Haven't you forgotten the Number 1 rule of the Dangerous Discussions forum: Being critical of ED and FD is good because FD needs to be told how inept they are. Saying anything positive and you are labelled a White Knight or Snowflake and anything you say is immediately discounted
I agree. The only thing I am unsure about is the bounty being on the ship and notoriety being on the player. If anything it should be the other way round. The Commander should have the bounty on there heads regardless and have notoriety on the ship. When you see that ship around, you know you may be in trouble.
As to consequences, I am fine with the. I find that they add to my gameplay. A bit like anything with consequences like the type of ship I am currently using. If it is poorly set up there are consquences.
Seems to me that people think that good gameplay is a complete lack of consequences. Personally for me, that would make it a bore fest. One of the reason why I like the ship transfer system. If all I do is fly around in taxi ship, then there are consequences to that. It's the reason why I generally fly around in an allrounder and if there is a call for a more specialised ship I can transfer it, but still use the ship I am in for the time being.
I think the game needs more consequences to your actions especially within the BGS and factions. That could be made so much deeper.
Haven't you forgotten the Number 1 rule of the Dangerous Discussions forum: Being critical of ED and FD is good because FD needs to be told how inept they are. Saying anything positive and you are labelled a White Knight or Snowflake and anything you say is immediately discounted
"Beatings will continue till morale improves".
What is 'MoM' ?
The thing about the NPCs being raised was that the NPCs had engineered weapons to god mode and obliterated players. That is not how you do game combat either. The player should always have the advantage.
The NPCs were not nerfed. The error was removed. You really need to get your facts and history checked.
Whingfest? So what You're saying is that you'd be happy to be put against unbeatable NPCs for your entire gameplay? Ok. But in your mind anyone else complaining about it is, 'whining'.. Ok.
Who said exactly that NMS was the game they were always waiting for? Or are you just trying to be 'smart'? What I have done, like many others, is question how a team of 10 can make a team of 100+ look like they're dragging their feet?
Why am I 'hanging' around the forums? To keep the whiteknight brigade honest. I still play Elite, every day in fact. But, I know poor development when I see it. I know poor game design when I see it. I did it myself for a 10 or so years. Where did I say Elite was Inferior? That's right! I did'nt! That's you trying to be 'smart' again, and failing. I said Elite has a lot of catching up to do, to match NMS for abilities and enjoyment. I think 'Oblivion' was probably the best RPG ever made. I don't play it now. Does that mean I now think it's crap?
If you want to debate the differences, bearing in mind the developer count and the deliverables, I'm all for it. If however you prefer to sit and attempt to be 'smart' with me, pick someone else. You might score a point or 2.
You really need to look at what other companies can do with much much, smaller teams. And measure it against what Fdev 100+ are producing in 4-5 years. For sure, NMS had a bad start, but they've turned it around. Elite had a great start, but continued to add buggy code, sub-par implementations of disjointed systems. And to this day, after years in the making, if you click thru the targets in a system and then click next system in route, it bugs out and fails to show the system reticule. Combat is riddled with bugs. The Mission board is bugged. And the entire system lacks cohesiveness, balance and most of all, players are forced to use external code and websites to achieve what should be available in game.
Finally, looking at the recent figures, it would appear that yes, a lot of players have moved over to NMS. For how long? shrug, I don't know, but it is indicative that players want something more than Elite:Grindfest
But hey, I actually think you're a mature guy, but less of the 'smartness' and more facts would be beneficial.
Still looking for these mythical fan boys. Can you point them out to me? Also what constitutes a fan boy, what is the criteria?
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Strange because I distinctly remember it, 2.1, MoM upped the NPCs and the forums were flooded with salt. So much so that by 2.3 or 2.4 the NPCs were nerfed back to a very docile state. And we all know that a nerf is traditionally a result of community feedback!