Beyond is great but please let the next updates focus on combat and PvP

Well. the short answer to that is: I wasn't responding to IBirdman, I was responding to Sterling, and the post that I quoted. You have to recognize that threads like these range about some. Including your post above.

In the overall we are considering what combat/PvP aspects of the game are satisfying and rewarding, along with those that are not. I described why CQC doesn't stack up. I think I made a pretty good case. Players of all stripes want to use the ships they choose and fit out. Not toys that have almost no ability to be customized. Don;t let a bias, keep you from recognizing something.
When why not advocate for getting FDev to move CQC into the real main game, so we can do "meaningful" PvP?

That way everybody wins. PvP is moreso encouraged through the whole "championships" shtick, meaning more targets to shoot at and to shoot back at you. You get your thrill of the challenge, AND you can actually have the PvErs be much more welcoming to PvP as a whole. Thus you get less salt, and more GG and we all have fun.
 
When why not advocate for getting FDev to move CQC into the real main game, so we can do "meaningful" PvP?

That way everybody wins. PvP is moreso encouraged through the whole "championships" shtick, meaning more targets to shoot at and to shoot back at you. You get your thrill of the challenge, AND you can actually have the PvErs be much more welcoming to PvP as a whole. Thus you get less salt, and more GG and we all have fun.

I'm all for that, but I have other interests to follow. My intentions were to bring what balance I can to this discussion, and to answer Sterling's question. Why I have to justify myself to you is a mystery, and I suspect this may be the last time I do.
 
Weird.
And I thought they were playing the game as designed by its developers.

He has a distinct problem ascertaining what is and what isn't 'playing the game as designed by its developers'. He has consistently told us readers that both the majority of players, and FD are mistaken in the choices they make. We, as a group, don't understand the game, in his view. When he gets worked up like this, I choose to avoid engagement. I Forum-Log on him, and work behind the scenes.
 
I'm all for that, but I have other interests to follow. My intentions were to bring what balance I can to this discussion, and to answer Sterling's question. Why I have to justify myself to you is a mystery, and I suspect this may be the last time I do.
I never asked, nor implied, for you to justify yourself though. I was only asking why I never see any active PvPer try to advocate for the revival and improvement on CQC, and maybe even implimentation into the main game.



EDIT: Nevermind, I made myself look autistic. Checked CQC subforums and well..yea. I accept any and all rebuttals
 
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He has a distinct problem ascertaining what is and what isn't 'playing the game as designed by its developers'. He has consistently told us readers that both the majority of players, and FD are mistaken in the choices they make. We, as a group, don't understand the game, in his view. When he gets worked up like this, I choose to avoid engagement. I Forum-Log on him, and work behind the scenes.

Just suspected I had been playing it wrong for 4 years. Whew!
 
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I never asked, nor implied, for you to justify yourself though. I was only asking why I never see any active PvPer try to advocate for the revival and improvement on CQC, and maybe even implimentation into the main game.

It's been around. Not for a while I'll admit, but at release there was tons of that going on. But, nothing, as FD has/had other fish to fry.

By the way, I don't consider myself an active PvPer. I have left that aspect of gaming behind, in general for my peace of mind. I hope you recognize my attempts at being an advocate for good ideas, not PvP or PvE.
 
Pvp does not just happen in cqc so adding cqc into the main game and allowing use of your own ships. Walst would be a huge improvment to cqc would not solve the problem at its root nor encompas the whole problem and its nuances across the whole experience.
 
Pvp does not just happen in cqc so adding cqc into the main game and allowing use of your own ships. Walst would be a huge improvment to cqc would not solve the problem at its root nor encompas the whole problem and its nuances across the whole experience.

I imagine this is completely true. I do believe CQC could have been more popular, from the get go, if it wasn't so divorced from the rest of the game.
 
What about Trading? Passengers are their own thing, and wing missions are for every type of mission, so don't count. In fact, trading has gotten worse with the removal of several different types of trade missions.
 
While it is undeniable that combat has been in the spotlight for a long time it hasn't really helped it all that much. First there was engineers, which while good in paper, absolutely destroyed the essence of PvP, then we had the SLF's which were much better in terms of adding something to the experience. Then came Thargoids which while cool and relatively hard to fight don't really add much to the old combat formula (Besides making a separation for AX ships which is an entirely different can of beans) and the risk/reward is absolutely dreadful especially when combat is one of the most expensive career paths. So; yes combat has gotten a lot of attention but when you start to analyze it most of that attention hasn't really done much. Payments could be worse but they're far from great, there's little risk outside of dull PvP attrition battles and when there is risk it's simply not worth it at all. Risking my 40 million corvette for a 7 million mission simply doesn't make sense. I feel FD simply hasn't been focusing on the right areas, multicrew is pretty much decorative at this point, the benefits simply aren't there and even without looking for money it just isn't what I would call a great experience. Small ships are pretty much dead in combat, Capital Ships are a joke and Surface Combat is still irrelevant. I feel Base assaults are an exemplification of what is wrong with combat as it is at the moment, they're risky (when done solo since if you get a wing there are far more productive things to do) and they don't make up for that with money. There's very little structure to support them and they are just kind of boring imo.

In short: Combat has gotten a lot of love but it hasn't done much for it, FD has been focusing on the wrong areas and no doubt it could do with a focused update; however there are plenty of issues with the rest of career paths and I can see why those would take more priority over what is in arguably the most "acceptable" state.
 
I have some suggestions for PVP and combat in general.

Limit all combat modules to one of each type per ship.

All these pirates flying around in 150million dollar ships with 0 cargo space. How did they ever pirate the money to buy anything.
 
So you would rather they continue attacking you in your cargo ship than give them something to do? Sounds pretty counter productive to me.

You see atacking cargo ships and explorers isn't actually PvP, these players aren't actually using the existing PvP features in the game, why should FDEV add more? So that they can then ignore the new features while they attack cargo ships and explorers because they are easier to make go BOOM!?!
 

AP Birdman

Banned
You see atacking cargo ships and explorers isn't actually PvP, these players aren't actually using the existing PvP features in the game, why should FDEV add more? So that they can then ignore the new features while they attack cargo ships and explorers because they are easier to make go BOOM!?!

Good job at being the 100th person to completely missunderstand what I meant by that or intentionally twisting the meaning to fit your "pvp is bad agenda".
 
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Good job at being the 100th person to completely missunderstand what I meant by that or intentionally twisting the meaning to fit your "pvp is bad agenda".

Dismissing a point, out of hand, because you perceive anti-PvP bias is completely counter productive. Examine the notion that what you are describing is a kind of petty extortion. "Give me what I want, or I'll have no option but to take stuff from you". How will that kind of argument encourage a closer look into the plight of Combat, and indeed PvP? All this sort of argument attains is a widening or hardening of the gap between the two points.

A boss of mine opened my eyes by saying to me: "Don't bring me problems, bring me suggestions". Suggest a way to integrate PvP into the game. Suggest a way to make PvP meaningful. Rather than expecting others to solve your problems. Your ideas may not gain immediate acceptance, but allow for debate and refinement. The refrain "I want" is often responded to with a "So what?".
 
Good job at being the 100th person to completely missunderstand what I meant by that or intentionally twisting the meaning to fit your "pvp is bad agenda".

I don't think PvP is bad, I think PvP against non-consenting PvE players is bad, there fixed that for you at least.

I guess you either deliberately misunderstood or intentionally twisted what i was saying to fit your "PvP must get all the updates from now until Elite dies during the cold dark heat death of the universe" agenda.

Fact is PvP has had the majority of updates and improvement since I started playing when Horizons was released, what exploration just got is just a tiny bit of what the major group of players deserve, they deserve a lot more and I hope they get it, the fact I am one of them in no way indicates any bias on my part. That you can come in here whining after years of PvP improvements to claim "exploration is getting to much whaa whaa it must stop" is really quite unbelievable.
 

AP Birdman

Banned
I don't think PvP is bad, I think PvP against non-consenting PvE players is bad, there fixed that for you at least.

I guess you either deliberately misunderstood or intentionally twisted what i was saying to fit your "PvP must get all the updates from now until Elite dies during the cold dark heat death of the universe" agenda.

Fact is PvP has had the majority of updates and improvement since I started playing when Horizons was released, what exploration just got is just a tiny bit of what the major group of players deserve, they deserve a lot more and I hope they get it, the fact I am one of them in no way indicates any bias on my part. That you can come in here whining after years of PvP improvements to claim "exploration is getting to much whaa whaa it must stop" is really quite unbelievable.

PvP has had the majority of updates? Are you serious? Name one PvP update this year, name one!
And NO, ships that are capable of combat are NOT pvp updates.
PvP still has zero rewards and zero reason.

The reason players are getting blown up in their cargo ships so much in open is because pvpers are bored and have nothing better to do with their uber pvp ships. If pvp got a meaningful upgrade in the way that mining just got upgraded, a lot of pvpers would leave your cargo ship alone. Not all but many would stop griefing helpless ships if they had something meaningful to do.

It is in all players interest to give pvpers more to do. The more they're focused on something else the less they'll focus on the rest of you.

Also, if Fdev added some kind of meaningful pvp a lot more players would be willing to try it because right now there are zero incentives to give it a shot. The only thing you're guaranteed is a rebuy screen.
 
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