Beyond convoluted.

babelfisch

babelfisch
Enderby said:
Really?
Click to expand...

Yes, really. Other people in this thread already mentioned "new things to do, see and interact with". Why should Kubicide suddenly listen to me when he ignores everything that doesn't fit his agenda?

Arguing with him is like playing chess with a pigeon; no matter how good you are at chess the pigeon is just going to knock over the pieces, crap on the board and strut around like it's victorious.
 

subhouse07

subhouse07
Blackcompany said:
New things to discover. New ways to interact with those discoveries. More than just a lousy, fiddly, tedious 2D mini game.
Click to expand...

Check the codex, there are several "new things." As for interactions, just to brush over things, we've got actual interaction (a brand new, long requested probing mechanic) to discover locations of planetary POI (some of which are also new things), some of those "new things" react to light, movement, we've got persistent USSs which opens up opportunities to drop into one, leave to go get something, come back (interactive USSs) ... and more?

I'm curious what interactions you desire? I'm not trying to say this update has enrichened the game to its full potential but the way many people talk, it's as if they are unaware of things that actually were added. What interactions with what new things would you suggest that would make sense in a game where you are essentially a spaceship?
 
Last edited:

rrobes

R
The FSS setup and implementation falls under my "my time is better spent elsewhere" category.

When I'm utterly bored and have no RL tasks pending, I may revisit.
 

avow555

avow555
More disappointments in general over this past years updates.
I just can't get along with the narrow minded approach that goes into a lot of gameplay elements.
Visuals and sounds, terrific. Some ships also really nice.
C&p, BGS, engineers, mats, xeno, SRV, fss all very weak.

Looking like the farce elite 2 was except on a much larger scale.

All the big cheese of Fdev totally absent as well, perhaps they lost interest?
 

CaptainKremmen

CaptainKremmen
I've just tried the new mining systems for the first time - never got to give them a go during beta.

I must say, I've been pleasantly surprised. I'd expected to have endless frustrations with HUD modes, fire groups, etc. The reality was rather different!

- Planetary ring only needed probe-scanning once, full stop. When I came back to the same ring a second time, hotspots were still highlighted.
- No HUD mode switching required during mining (managed to avoid any aggro pirates, so no dogfighting).
- Only two fire groups required during core mining (one for ping+prospector, a second for abrasion+collector).

Very enjoyable, flying through a darkened planetary ring of asteroids, switching between normal and night vision, eyeballing core-crackable asteroids to save on prospectors, getting the charge strengths just right, pinwheeling around a broken asteroid in VR as I hit all the surface deposits with the abrasion blaster... and dat BOOM.

I've certainly got my do-not-like list about FD's over-complicated user interface choices for some of the things they've added. To be honest, though, I can't bring myself to complain about asteroid core mining.


As for the multiple layers of "scanning probing" mentioned in the OP regarding mining, it seems pretty sensible.

1. Go to unexplored system. Scan to find ringed worlds. Only needs doing once.
2. Go to planetary ring. Scan to find resource hotspots. Only needs doing once.
3. Go to hotspot. Scan to find valuable asteroid.
4. Go to asteroid. Use prospector limpets to find fissures, etc.

Steps 3 and 4 are something only miners care about, and they require mining-specific equipment to do.

It took me a run or two to get familiar with it all, but it feels like second nature now.


So I can't really agree that mining is particularly "convoluted". Core cracking is actually pretty straightforward, and is more engaging, more profitable and better looking than traditional point-laser-at-rock mining.
 

B1rdy

B1rdy
Regarding Exploration: So we have new tools, which help us get the information we already were able to achive before the update. And we also can now find POIs. But where is the interaction beyond that? What can we find? How does it affect the game? Is it just some nice backdrop and addition of a bit of background information to whatever you just found?
To me it feels the same level of cheap as in the latest Tomb Raider games, with equally low impact on the game mechanic.
 

babelfisch

babelfisch
B1rdy said:
Regarding Exploration: So we have new tools, which help us get the information we already were able to achive before the update. And we also can now find POIs. But where is the interaction beyond that? What can we find? How does it affect the game? Is it just some nice backdrop and addition of a bit of background information to whatever you just found?
To me it feels the same level of cheap as in the latest Tomb Raider games, with equally low impact on the game mechanic.
Click to expand...

If you don't know what you can find it's probably best to jump into your ship and explore it...

Anyway, it feels like people are moving goalposts regarding exploration. For 4 years we asked them to add more stuff to discover, give us more and better tools and overhaul the silly insta honk. That was the feedback from the exploration community. Sure, some people might disagree, but that's the overall picture I got from reading on the forums on a daily basis, so it's probably the same picture FDEV got when they looked for feedback.
 

B1rdy

B1rdy
babelfisch said:
If you don't know what you can find it's probably best to jump into your ship and explore it...

Anyway, it feels like people are moving goalposts regarding exploration. For 4 years we asked them to add more stuff to discover, give us more and better tools and overhaul the silly insta honk. That was the feedback from the exploration community. Sure, some people might disagree, but that's the overall picture I got from reading on the forums on a daily basis, so it's probably the same picture FDEV got when they looked for feedback.
Click to expand...
Of course "things to find" is the very least you need to implement in order to call this activity "exploration". Ideally the process should be varied, challenging, engaging as well as the result should be rewarding. Is ED's new extension of Exploration like that?
 

babelfisch

babelfisch
B1rdy said:
Of course "things to find" is the very least you need to implement in order to call this activity "exploration". Ideally the process should be varied, challenging, engaging as well as the result should be rewarding. Is ED's new extension of Exploration like that?
Click to expand...

Sorry, but 'vaired, challenging, engaging and rewarding' is very subjective. For some it's already too challenging to bind 5 keys... ;)
 

Kaocraft

Kaocraft
Blackcompany said:
New things to discover. New ways to interact with those discoveries. More than just a lousy, fiddly, tedious 2D mini game.
Click to expand...
Isn’t that exactly what we have? A whole bunch of signal sources with multi-stage scenarios in them, and a ton of new mega ships and installations which can be assaulted, hacked into, heisted from, or become part of a conflict attack/defend scenario, all of which ties into and has an effect on the bgs and the relative standing of factions within the system, as well as the installations themselves being functional contestable assets which can be claimed by factions. And of course CZs are different. And also new alien life, stellar phenomena, and “anomalies”, at least a few of which can (I think?) be interacted with using the science/research limpets.

You can say it’s lame or badly done if you like but you can’t legitimately claim it isn’t there.
 

Rat Catcher

Rat Catcher
B1rdy said:
Of course "things to find" is the very least you need to implement in order to call this activity "exploration". Ideally the process should be varied, challenging, engaging as well as the result should be rewarding. Is ED's new extension of Exploration like that?
Click to expand...

Not for you, maybe, but for me I'd say a positive yes to all, but as I've only travelled around 40KLy since 3.3 went live, there are still a few things left for me to find before I've completed the entire Milky way and all that is in it.

Entirely subjective, I don't like Tea but wouldn't tell everyone it is awful and spawn of the devil...
 

Rat Catcher

Rat Catcher
Stealthie said:
Nor would I.

When I keep getting served tea, it might be time to say something though.
Click to expand...

I'm a poor example for this discussion, I just play the game and get on with it, my view on the game being that something new was introduced so I'll use it, if the change had made playing no longer fun I'd stop playing and thank the value of over 600 hours play for so little money. I honestly don't care about the 'loss' of the ADS or its being replaced by the FSS, methodology is different but that is all, the end result is that I pretend to 'explore' in a game and have fun doing so, as the (UK) gambling advert keeps pushing "when the fun stops, stop" the sentiment works well for games also :)
 

Stealthie

Stealthie
Ratkatcher said:
I honestly don't care about the 'loss' of the ADS or its being replaced by the FSS, methodology is different but that is all...
Click to expand...

Exactly the point I'm making.

A lot of effort to create a lot of new bells & whistles, soleley for the purpose of changing the methodology involved in existing things rather than giving us new activities.
 

Rat Catcher

Rat Catcher
Stealthie said:
Exactly the point I'm making.

A lot of effort to create a lot of new bells & whistles, soleley for the purpose of changing the methodology involved in existing things rather than giving us new activities.
Click to expand...

Yes, but the changes introduced better opportunities to engage with the galactic environment, revealing things that had eluded discovery in the 2 or 3 years since they had been introduced. As we aer only a few weeks into 3.3, and 99.9*** % of the MW remains unexplored how can anyone be certain that we've "been there, done that, got the T-shirt" when so much remains unknown?

You aren't enamoured with the changes, fair enough, but until the Dev's categorically state that the methodology change was 'because we can' rather than as a forerunner for as yet undisclosed content beleiving that things were changed just for the sake of change is a little bit harsh IMO.
 

Stealthie

Stealthie
Ratkatcher said:
You aren't enamoured with the changes, fair enough, but until the Dev's categorically state that the methodology change was 'because we can' rather than as a forerunner for as yet undisclosed content beleiving that things were changed just for the sake of change is a little bit harsh IMO.
Click to expand...

I don't believe there IS a time when it's possible to be critical in a constructive way.

- FDev hint at something, you criticise it and you get told "ZOMG! You're arguing about something that doesn't even exist yet!!!"

- FDev release specific details of the thing and if you criticise that you get told "At least wait for the Beta and then you can provide feedback"

- Beta arrives, critical feedback is provided and people say "Well, this is just Beta. Wait and see if it's improved in the live-build".

- The live-build is criticised and you're saying "Well, wait and see if it's the basis for something else too"

- The final step is, at some point in the future, to say "Well, you should have said something earlier on"


If other stuff does arrive in the future, that'll be great.
The fact remains that we've had 3(?) years of Horizons and the most significant changes we've had to gameplay are to rework existing things to make them more fiddly.
 

[VR] Mad Mike

[VR] Mad Mike
Stealthie said:
I don't believe there IS a time when it's possible to be critical in a constructive way.

- FDev hint at something, you criticise it and you get told "ZOMG! You're arguing about something that doesn't even exist yet!!!"

- FDev release specific details of the thing and if you criticise that you get told "At least wait for the Beta and then you can provide feedback"

- Beta arrives, critical feedback is provided and people say "Well, this is just Beta. Wait and see if it's improved in the live-build".

- The live-build is criticised and you're saying "Well, wait and see if it's the basis for something else too"

- The final step is, at some point in the future, to say "Well, you should have said something earlier on"


If other stuff does arrive in the future, that'll be great.
The fact remains that we've had 3(?) years of Horizons and the most significant changes we've had to gameplay are to rework existing things to make them more fiddly.
Click to expand...

Whilst I am not sure I agree with you about everything you are spot on about the logic of some about complaints about the game (wait till beta, wait till release, then finally , you should have spoken up sooner don't moan now ;)
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom