Space Force Presents: Operation Drag Queen

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We are having fun playing the way we want within the framework of the game rules and mechanics and for sure, not the way you want us to play.
We have been, without a doubt, way more helpful towards the community than you could ever be.
Finally, the approach you wrote are not mutually exclusive, things are not only black or white nor as restricted as you wish they were.

git gud

I am gud thanks. I've become very gud at driving a SRV over the last few weeks, although stand in awe of those who bomb along at 80... that's a little high for my tastes.

And sure you are playing within the framework of the game, its always been the defense of gankers. We can do it, the game allows it, therefore we do it.

The funny part is this thread though, where gankers say they will gank because of this change, even though they ganked before and will continue to gank afterwards.

Gankers will gank.

And please, individual members of SDC might be helpful to players from time to time, with their guides, with their training, but that is massively overshadowed by the negative effect they have on the community.

If i may use an analogy, its like giving someone a pound and then punching them in the face, and expecting the person to be greatful to you for giving them the pound.

Many people are helpful towards the community, most of those who are helpful do not spend most of their time performing acts that generate negativity or plotting new schemes to cause widespread negativity.

I'll save my praise for those people, not the gankers who want a pat on the back for occasionally being nice and helpful.

PS: And personal opinion here, but i suspect over the years, i've provided far more help to players, especially new players, than any member of SDC, and if we factor in negativity, i would say most members of SDC are heavily in the negative in terms of help/hinder balance. However, that is entirely subjective, and obviously from my point of view.
 
Lol, I like how you guys are so sincere you cant even remember what each 'operation' was supposed to be about.

Never mind, go club some seals for [insert cause].

See my post above?

I don't club seals - haven't for ages and ages. Right now myself and Loren's Reapers are working to keep the Carcosa Shipyard open for business. Only place to buy Federal and Alliance ships in Colonia, as far as I know. Pretty cool stuff!
 
Took a look at that, and I have to say I do like the idea of drags bolstering the usefulness of FSD interrupts, that's some nice synergy there. It could also lead to more than one FSD blueprint being used, and I'm all for more dynamic choices for engineering. Would be nice if they could do something with clean drives reducing target lock time or something too, for more valid choices.

I'm starting wonder if drags might actually be a silver lining in an otherwise cloudy bland engineering environment. Maybe a longer CD so it isn't ruining people's PvP meta, but still useful for upping the chances of landing dumbfires (mines?).

I might actually like Drag Munitions being useful for ambushes (like the kind you'd want in PowerPlay, Bounty Hunting, Pirating, or Tasteful Political Murder) but not a "must have" choice for a proper fight. Would be fun to see some comments from the "top tier" about this.
 
I see this as a game mechanic change and some just not liking it.
I dont like hull tanks
I dont like Chaff
I dont like short fsd
I dont like expensive builds
I dont like rebuys
I dont like having to gather mats for engineering
Can the dev change this all to make me happy?

Also... shooting non pvp people will not prove a thing. They will be destroyed with or without drag due to the wrong build and lack of evading experience.
 
Their rep is quite outstanding for people that understand the game unlike you.

LOL, oh dear... is that the best you have? A declaration that i don't understand the game?

Ok, right back at you, you don't understand the game!

There we go, neither of us don't understand the game. Or, just going out on a limb here, we have different views about the game we both play?

Ironically everything they have done. Is because of people like you.

How does that make you feel?

OH MY GOD! I WASN'T AWARE! ITS ENTIRELY THE FAULT OF PEOPLE LIKE ME! People who contribute to the game in a positive way and try and be nice and friendly to other players who are the cause of people ganking!

Well, thank you very much for pointing that out! My eyes are opened!

Deary deary me... is that really what you think?

How about the gankers at least own their own choices and their behavoir?

I have never ridiculed anyone for being a PvPer. I've spent time working with the guys in San Tu and made friends there. I was an early supporter of Cobra Kai, a group designed for people, especially people who were only PvEers, to learn how to do PvP. I remember the early tentative steps of players like Arguendo as he transformed from being a PvEer into a PvPer, and he is a great guy as well as others like LeKeno and Ozram.

There are many great PvPers out there who do not go out of their way to cause negativity in the community, who try their best not to behave like jerks, who behave maturely and don't just generate salt for themselves and others. They don't start actions based around ganking random players just because they are upset with a change made by FD.

Those are quality players who do PvP to add to the game in a positive manner, to contribute to the game and make it a better place. Hell, even Zarek Null, despite his ganking tendencies, generate a lot of positivity (and humour) through his roleplay, and I find it really funny.

Really, think about what you are actually accusing people of.

Z0
 
LOL, oh dear... is that the best you have? A declaration that i don't understand the game?

Ok, right back at you, you don't understand the game!

There we go, neither of us don't understand the game. Or, just going out on a limb here, we have different views about the game we both play?



OH MY GOD! I WASN'T AWARE! ITS ENTIRELY THE FAULT OF PEOPLE LIKE ME! People who contribute to the game in a positive way and try and be nice and friendly to other players who are the cause of people ganking!

Well, thank you very much for pointing that out! My eyes are opened!

Deary deary me... is that really what you think?

How about the gankers at least own their own choices and their behavoir?

I have never ridiculed anyone for being a PvPer. I've spent time working with the guys in San Tu and made friends there. I was an early supporter of Cobra Kai, a group designed for people, especially people who were only PvEers, to learn how to do PvP. I remember the early tentative steps of players like Arguendo as he transformed from being a PvEer into a PvPer, and he is a great guy as well as others like LeKeno and Ozram.

There are many great PvPers out there who do not go out of their way to cause negativity in the community, who try their best not to behave like jerks, who behave maturely and don't just generate salt for themselves and others. They don't start actions based around ganking random players just because they are upset with a change made by FD.

Those are quality players who do PvP to add to the game in a positive manner, to contribute to the game and make it a better place. Hell, even Zarek Null, despite his ganking tendencies, generate a lot of positivity (and humour) through his roleplay, and I find it really funny.

Really, think about what you are actually accusing people of.

Z0
I want whatever youre smokin. Apparently the stuff I got is not good enough.
 
You're backpedaling now. If the war analogy holds then so does the terrorism one. Nobody is confused about the stakes, here; we all understand it's a spaceship videogame. That doesn't change the nature of what you're doing, only the impact. Of course there are victims; your targets are victims. The operatives behind this little campaign are going out of their way to assault people that they otherwise wouldn't, in a calculated attempt to upset them into passing that upset onto Frontier.

You can rationalize away the victimization people feel on the grounds that because it's a videogame and therefore unimportant that they have no legitimate claim to be upset, or even deserve to be upset; but if you are knowingly imposing that upsetting experience on someone for the sake of upsetting them you are bullying them.

It's critical to recognize that however much you wish to handwave the conversation with "pixel spaceships lol!" you are still doing something specifically because you know it will upset people.

The entire foundation of this project is coercive violence and you need to own that. Just because it's weak sauce low stakes videogame shenanigans doesn't change the fact that you are doing a specific thing to someone else, that they don't want you to do it, and that your prime motivation for doing it in the first place is the sense of violation you expect them to experience. If you can't or won't defend that part of your operation, or worse yet try to deny or deflect it, you will always automatically be the default loser of any argument about this topic.

It's not sufficient to make repeated desperate appeals to the relative unimportance of video games in the grand scheme of things, as if that should shield you from any criticism. We're all here, we're all talking about a videogame as if it were something that matters, and the fact that you're willing to start a coordinated online temper tantrum about how one particular type of videogame weapon works, is all the evidence anyone should need to demonstrate that you're in the same camp as the rest of us, maybe even more so.

"lol imagine being upset about a videogame spaceship" doesn't cut it here, especially when it's opportunistically deployed as a deflection by a group of people who are flipping their collective keyboards over how one particular videogame spaceship fires one particular weapon.

I'm quoting this just so I can find it again later easier. Very well expressed. I'm not even going to try to add on.
 
Took a look at that, and I have to say I do like the idea of drags bolstering the usefulness of FSD interrupts, that's some nice synergy there. It could also lead to more than one FSD blueprint being used, and I'm all for more dynamic choices for engineering. Would be nice if they could do something with clean drives reducing target lock time or something too, for more valid choices.

I'm starting wonder if drags might actually be a silver lining in an otherwise cloudy bland engineering environment. Maybe a longer CD so it isn't ruining people's PvP meta, but still useful for upping the chances of landing dumbfires (mines?).

Even before the patch, we had spitballed some synergies that would come about because of this, which might not be 100% true now as we were assuming it would have the same 5 seconds active and no restriction CD on, but showed how absurd this buff is.

Nudrag + force shell cannons : Some people manage to force shell targets into planets without drag, but disabling the victims boost would make this sort of attack trivial to pull off. Even away from planets, you could get permanently knocked around like a ragdoll and there wouldn't be anything you could do about it (have fun trying to get enough forward speed to wake out, grom bombs got nothing on this)

Nudrag + torpedoes : Normally a meme weapon, but not being able to boost means that ships that can't go faster than 200 in the drag state would not be able to avoid torpedoes at all.

Nudrag + cascade rail : Generally in a fight you would boost past someone to give yourself time to use a cell bank without it being cancelled, obviously no boost would utterly banjax that plan.
 
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We have been, without a doubt, way more helpful towards the community than you could ever be.

git gud

I fully agree here. New player systems deployed in the patch is probably a consequence of the player retention problem that Seal clubbing in starter systems did. So thanks for that.

That's why I encourage you continuing in your endeavor. No doubt, at some point, FDEV will want other cause of player retention problems to be addressed. Especially as the game will not have much new content for the months to come.

Of course, the way they will address it, well, might not be to your taste, so I'm sure ryan_m will post a new operation then.
More fun to come, rejoice !
 
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Looks like its going to be reverted: https://forums.frontier.co.uk/threads/april-update-known-issues-24-04-2019.509736/


  • Drag Munitions
    • Based on your feedback, we will revert the change that we made to Drag Munitions, changing them back to how they worked prior to the April Update. However, this is something we may look to revisit in the future.
128865
 
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You lack imagination...
You can just read comments/feature request from people antagonized by "Content Delivery Specialists".
It's not that difficult to find :)

How about you tell me instead so we can talk about it right now? Wouldn't want to presume what you're claiming.
 
You can call the initiative off now. Drag is going to be reverted to how it was in the next patch. If you're now going to still abuse-gank the hell out of it until then, you'll just unmask yourself.
 
How about you tell me instead so we can talk about it right now? Wouldn't want to presume what you're claiming.

I'm not claiming anything, just highlighting consequences. Online games are ecosystems, if you want the ecosystem to be sustainable you need to keep it balanced and fun for ALL the players, the majority being non-PVPers incidentally.

So no, please speculate :)

And anyway it's not for me to decide what should be done as I'm not a dev, just a player and sceptical of FDEV design decision on top of that. Let the majority party having a stake decides what is the best for them.
 
What role are you playing in-game, Morbad?

That's a simple question with a complex answer. What role are you playing in your daily life?

I could rattle off a biography of my character, from his origins as megacorp company man (Cosi Holdings, born and bred, going back at least twenty five generations and possibly as far back as it's origins on Earth), to joining the Pilots Federation for a shot at living his dream as a freelancer, to his disillusionment with that organization when he became aware of just how far it's corrupt authority spread...and that they'd never let him leave. I could talk about how he's often found himself a mercenary profiting from all sides in conflicts, with the full knowledge of the powers that be among all those sides, who readily collude with each other to maintain power at the expense of those beneath them. I could describe the atrocities hes committed as a black opperative to fast track his advancement in military circles. However, I'd have to write a book to capture a complete picture of his motives and the mutable 'role' he grudgingly plays.

Ultimately, I play a Pilot's Federation Commander whose already gotten ahead and has some regrets about the methods, but who won't trade what freedom he's got left, or the comforts he's won, for anything. He mostly minds his own business, subtly (or not so much) undermining (preferably to death) those he percieves as threatening that comfort and freedom. Self-preservation is his prime motive (and I play him as someone who isn't quite sure that ejection seat will always work) and in a complex world, that makes for a complex role.
 
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