General / Off-Topic The safest place

[Ian Skippy]

And in very good news: Italy's stats have again dropped today. 602 people died, versus 651 and 793 yesterday and the day before, respectively. It is still early days, but it might be that Italy has crossed the peak and is now heading for recovery.

For the rest of us: if so, the lockdown measures resulted in the peak being exactly one month after the first reported casualty...

 

[Morbad]

we actually teach the notion of group punishment being valid to our children since early age.

If there is one thing public school taught me it's that everyone is considered guilty until proven innocent and that guilt by (often vague and arbitrarily contrived) association is considered a valid way to round up and make examples of scapegoats...all to encourage kids to grow into nice reliable chekist drones.

Absolutely. I struggle with naming a European country that does not have not just a single black page but an entire black chapter in their history book (Iceland, maybe?)

Bjork's music videos, especially that one where she's eating a watermelon while licking the rind and her forearm. I didn't see her wash that watermelon earlier in the video.

Could be.... Or it was spot-on and had to be pulled instantly for political reasons. Too hot.

I can scarcely think of single case of this actually happening, certainly not since the dawn of the internet age, where there is virtually zero possibility of covering it up.

Either way, what are the odds of a high-grade Biohazard suddenly popping up for the very first time and out of nowhere on a Food Market?

As viruses are constantly mutating and these sorts of markets prime vectors for introducing them into human populations, probably pretty high.

China (or at least, CCP) has always struggled massively with what they consider 'showing weakness'.

All the superpowers or wannabe superpowers do that, to the extent they can get away with it, and a little more. People tend to react favorably to confidence, even to the point of hubris and bravado, more than they value honesty.

 

[askavir]

To be clear: as far as viruses go, this one is pretty mild. It scores a disappointing '2' when it comes to how contagious it is, and its lethality is profoundly underwhelming. I mean, I would expect a Chinese high-grade bioweapon to do better than this: https://metro.co.uk/2020/03/22/95-y...est-woman-italy-recover-coronavirus-12438267/

Well, it's made in China...

 

[Stigbob]

Did you report my post again, Stiggy-wiggy?

I've never reported any of your posts, I was replying to your huge meltdown the other day when the mods deleted it.

The TLDR was : Man up.

 

[Northpin]

In other words: a very predictable (though maybe not preventable, but CCP in any case certainly did not even try to prevent it the past years) outbreak was handled in a very predictable way, resulting in equally predictable conspiracy theories.

Chinese blaming the Americans. Everyone else blaming the Chinese
I'm not a believer of conspiracy theories, but i wont dismiss any possibility

So it's not impossible that SAR-COV-2 is actually an engineered virus, it's not impossible that someone did a huge mistake and let it escape from a lab, it's not impossible that it was let out voluntarily, it's not impossible that no matter how it got out someone might had the idea to let it run and see what it happens and so on

There is also an overwhelming possibility that it was just a zoonotic virus that was simply underestimated in the beginning.
They tried to hide it under the carpet, but the bulge kept growing and eventually became to big to slip noticed

Not even this article from nature.com is dismissing the lab hypothesis. They just say it's improbable.

The proximal origin of SARS-CoV-2 - Nature Medicine

www.nature.com

 

[Ian Skippy]

Not even this article from nature.com is dismissing the lab hypothesis. They just say it's improbable.

The proximal origin of SARS-CoV-2 - Nature Medicine

www.nature.com

Dude, at least read the entire abstract/summary.

Here we review what can be deduced about the origin of SARS-CoV-2 from comparative analysis of genomic data. We offer a perspective on the notable features of the SARS-CoV-2 genome and discuss scenarios by which they could have arisen. Our analyses clearly show that SARS-CoV-2 is not a laboratory construct or a purposefully manipulated virus.

 

[Synkreto]

Chinese blaming the Americans. Everyone else blaming the Chinese
I'm not a believer of conspiracy theories, but i wont dismiss any possibility

So it's not impossible that SAR-COV-2 is actually an engineered virus, it's not impossible that someone did a huge mistake and let it escape from a lab, it's not impossible that it was let out voluntarily, it's not impossible that no matter how it got out someone might had the idea to let it run and see what it happens and so on

There is also an overwhelming possibility that it was just a zoonotic virus that was simply underestimated in the beginning.
They tried to hide it under the carpet, but the bulge kept growing and eventually became to big to slip noticed

Not even this article from nature.com is dismissing the lab hypothesis. They just say it's improbable.

The proximal origin of SARS-CoV-2 - Nature Medicine

www.nature.com

Whenever something bad happens, the majority of people start looking for someone to blame . The few others immediately start thinking, and working towards softening the blow and preventing it from ever happening again .

Just because it is a conspiracy theory, does not mean it is not true . One would be a fool to not believe that conspiracies have played massive roles in earthshattering events in many societies all over the globe through the millenia .

And, as my mom said when the towers fell : " We will never be told the truth about that."

Can we go back to the topic of group punishment ?
checks nation's history
checks ancestry
'Cos you know, I could write a few lines about that .

 

[Northpin]

Dude, at least read the entire abstract/summary.

Yea, but then in the middle of the article, under the section Theories they post this:

It is improbable that SARS-CoV-2 emerged through laboratory manipulation of a related SARS-CoV-like coronavirus.

Which makes me think the opening paragraph was added later on

 

[Ian Skippy]

Yea, but then in the middle of the article, under the section Theories they post this:

Which makes me think the opening paragraph was added later on

Scientific language is (contrary to popular belief) extremely conservative and restraint. When something is 99% certain to be true, you report the 99% and call it "very likely". The truth is in the numbers and the results, the classification is an historic construct. It is something every PhD student runs into when they proudly want to share their result with the world and are hammered in peer-review for reporting conclusions too confidently. That is fine, as long as everyone is aware of this tradition. The current interest of the global media in this topic means that many journalists without an appropriate background might stumble upon it, hence the clarification what it means in the abstract. To be sure "[x] clearly shows that [y] is not the case." is the academic version of:

To be clear: an abstract is not 'added later on', it is a mandatory part of any publication. They also drive this home later:

In the midst of the global COVID-19 public-health emergency, it is reasonable to wonder why the origins of the pandemic matter. [...] [they added the reasons here] Although the evidence shows that SARS-CoV-2 is not a purposefully manipulated virus, it is currently impossible to prove or disprove the other theories of its origin described here. However, since we observed all notable SARS-CoV-2 features, including the optimized RBD and polybasic cleavage site, in related coronaviruses in nature, we do not believe that any type of laboratory-based scenario is plausible.

This is the academic version of:"Look guys, we get why you might think that it might be some engineered stuff, but we looked at it and it just ain't. It can be because of many causes, but this is not one of them. Not blaming y'all, just saying, okay?". This is followed by:

The identification of a potential intermediate host of SARS-CoV-2, as well as sequencing of the virus from very early cases, would similarly be highly informative. Irrespective of the exact mechanisms by which SARS-CoV-2 originated via natural selection, the ongoing surveillance of pneumonia in humans and other animals is clearly of utmost importance.

Which roughly translates to:"Are we done here? Can we please move on to actually relevant topics and study how this thing did happen, please?". Finally, and to be absolutely clear about this: this is a joint study by the US, England, Scotland and Australia publishing in a premier British journal. It is not a Chinese study whitewashing what happened.

 

[Synkreto]

The identification of a potential intermediate host of SARS-CoV-2, as well as sequencing of the virus from very early cases, would similarly be highly informative. Irrespective of the exact mechanisms by which SARS-CoV-2 originated via natural selection, the ongoing surveillance of pneumonia in humans and other animals is clearly of utmost importance.

This kindof screams "Test people, please !", or do I misunderstand ?

 

[Xenith]

Got a call from work this am.

They want to know if working withOUT pay is something I might be interested in, at personal risk, during the pandemic.

It's possible to not live to not spend the money you didn't make... real attractive offer there.

I believe my response to that offer would have been two words, the last one being off!

 

[Sysmon]

New Zealand might be "safe", but good luck getting here! We are going into full lockdown in a day or so. Case numbers are going up, but hopefully the new measures will quench a full outbreak before it really get going.

S

 

[Xenith]

New Zealand might be "safe", but good luck getting here! We are going into full lockdown in a day or so. Case numbers are going up, but hopefully the new measures will quench a full outbreak before it really get going.

S

So was Britain back in February, and look at us now!

 

[Robin of Spiritwood]

It is sort of amazing to look at the history of the thread.

We are literally living through the practical experiment that answers the hypothetical intital question Where would the safest place be?

It might end up being nowhere. Or we could give a consolation prize for the last place to fall, which of course would be Wakanda.

 

[ArchEmperor]

The safest place is death.
But you don't want to go there.

The best place is life.
And to live you must stop being wrong.

 

[sewerratuk]

I get the feeling that Boris is going to try and make the UK the safest place at 20:30

 

[askavir]

We are literally living through the practical experiment that answers the hypothetical intital question Where would the safest place be?

Vanuatu archipelago.

0 cases. Beautiful, paradise scenery. Mighty, magnificent, very active volcanoes.

 

[Han_Zen]

Those nine that are on the ISS are in a good place.

 

[Good Whiskey]

Mighty, magnificent, very active volcanoes.

 

[Xenith]

Boris Johnson just announced new measures, which for all practical purposes amounts to a full lockdown. We'll be permitted to leave the house for food shopping, and exercise once a day, but that's it. Essential work will be permitted, but all other work places will be closed.

Not quite as draconian as on the continent, but I suspect more than a few people will get themselves arrested!