So I keep reading how EDO FPS is either poor or just MVP. So what makes a good FPS.I ahve limited experience as I've only played COD and Grand Theft Auto on a PS3 then I've played Half Life Alyx and "The Walking Dead" in VR - yes a bunch of others such as the game with "snake" as the lead what ever that was called.. All these games seem OK to me, as does Oddy FPS. So whats your top 3?
What makes a good FPS - Your Top 3?
- Thread starter He$$eeTant
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Interesting to think that stone cold classics like Half Life 2 & Goldeneye and even Doom do not have "essential" modern mechanics like body dragging, leaning and X-ray vision and auto target lock that have been mentioned elsewhere.
Also anyone who read Masters of Doom might remember that body dragging/Hiding was actually removed from Wolfenstein 3D as it ruined the pace, so some assumed "essential" mechanics aren't really anything new or would make an FPS "good" despite what some YouTuber who has never designed an FPS says.
Also anyone who read Masters of Doom might remember that body dragging/Hiding was actually removed from Wolfenstein 3D as it ruined the pace, so some assumed "essential" mechanics aren't really anything new or would make an FPS "good" despite what some YouTuber who has never designed an FPS says.
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I forgot about Golden Eye, played that on the N64. It was a good storyline
For me personally the biggest thing that would improve Odyssey FPS would be to encourage us to interact with other players.
Tha alpha was in a single system and forced us to come across random players sneaking around bases or fighting in combat zones. This was a unique experience as you'd see their ship landed outside some outpost or see them being attacked by NPCs as you flew in.
Since then I've rarely seen anyone in open on foot and it's a missed opportunity. So if you're going to have multiplayer FPS encourage multiplayer.
Tha alpha was in a single system and forced us to come across random players sneaking around bases or fighting in combat zones. This was a unique experience as you'd see their ship landed outside some outpost or see them being attacked by NPCs as you flew in.
Since then I've rarely seen anyone in open on foot and it's a missed opportunity. So if you're going to have multiplayer FPS encourage multiplayer.
It has to be fun, it has to be engaging and well balanced. You can argue till you're blue in the face whether a game has leaning, body dragging, ect... But all that is window dressing.
One of the best FPS games I played and had the most fun at was Battlefield Bad Company 2, the Vietnam DLC. Limited weapons, limited maps, no prone but we had the most fun every weekend mornings killin and chillin. For me, I like to play with and against my friends. Playing against AI is not my thing.
One of the best FPS games I played and had the most fun at was Battlefield Bad Company 2, the Vietnam DLC. Limited weapons, limited maps, no prone but we had the most fun every weekend mornings killin and chillin. For me, I like to play with and against my friends. Playing against AI is not my thing.
"First-person shooter" is a pretty broad genre.
Tribes 2, Battlefield 1942, and the first year of Planetside 2 (minus the 'progression' nonsense) are my benchmarks for tactical shooters. All were combined arms games with a lot of tactical depth, generally low TTKs, though generally a bit lighter on the simulation aspects than I'd prefer.
Frankly, I was hoping Odyssey infantry combat would be something reminiscent of Planetside, given the other aspects that seem to have been inspired by it, but less grindy. Unfortunately, it's worse in essentially every aspect I can think of.
Most of my favorite shooters have no such mechanisms, but they are also of a more direct combat oriented scope than Odyssey is trying to be. Being able to move bodies in a game that has major stealth elements is a pretty essential feature.
Leaning is a nice feature to have, but certainly not something I'd consider essential.
This is the first I've heard of the claim that target locking or x-ray vision would even be desirable in this sort of game. When it comes to Odyssey, I think the omniscient sensors are bad enough.
Golden Eye is one of the those games I played a lot as a teen, but which doesn't hold up well at all.
Some mechanisms are mandatory to convincingly depict certain settings/situations. The core shooter elements should be the foundation of all of this, however.
NPCs are indispensable in a setting of Elite's scope. The problem with Odyssey here is that the NPC behavior is not up to task.
Tribes 2, Battlefield 1942, and the first year of Planetside 2 (minus the 'progression' nonsense) are my benchmarks for tactical shooters. All were combined arms games with a lot of tactical depth, generally low TTKs, though generally a bit lighter on the simulation aspects than I'd prefer.
Frankly, I was hoping Odyssey infantry combat would be something reminiscent of Planetside, given the other aspects that seem to have been inspired by it, but less grindy. Unfortunately, it's worse in essentially every aspect I can think of.
Most of my favorite shooters have no such mechanisms, but they are also of a more direct combat oriented scope than Odyssey is trying to be. Being able to move bodies in a game that has major stealth elements is a pretty essential feature.
Leaning is a nice feature to have, but certainly not something I'd consider essential.
This is the first I've heard of the claim that target locking or x-ray vision would even be desirable in this sort of game. When it comes to Odyssey, I think the omniscient sensors are bad enough.
Golden Eye is one of the those games I played a lot as a teen, but which doesn't hold up well at all.
Some mechanisms are mandatory to convincingly depict certain settings/situations. The core shooter elements should be the foundation of all of this, however.
NPCs are indispensable in a setting of Elite's scope. The problem with Odyssey here is that the NPC behavior is not up to task.
The Half-Life franchise is probably my favourite among the FPSes. Half-Life 2 especially; all of its elements are so intertwined, and the game is constantly moving forward on all front - progressing its narrative, introducing new gameplay - and it just works so well. I've played it so many times - alone, with friends and/or randos using co-op modes - and each time it's amazing.
Doom (the original games, not Bethesdoom) I also love. Good level design, good guns, good atmosphere.
For multiplayer I think Team Fortress 2 is well up there. So much variety and it's just pure fun. Too bad it's basically dead.
I like Odyssey's FPS element. The gunplay is decent, weapon variety is okay if small, stealth missions make you get creative with your movement and attacks, and conflict zones are fun whenever I drop into one.
Doom (the original games, not Bethesdoom) I also love. Good level design, good guns, good atmosphere.
For multiplayer I think Team Fortress 2 is well up there. So much variety and it's just pure fun. Too bad it's basically dead.
I like Odyssey's FPS element. The gunplay is decent, weapon variety is okay if small, stealth missions make you get creative with your movement and attacks, and conflict zones are fun whenever I drop into one.
I see comments on NPC I am not sure what more they can do. Your side fight back to back with you and the others will chase you down ducking and diving but persistent I’ve been targeted many times by a persistent NPC. Indeed this in the context of a multiplayer offensive, not like a Half-life Alyx where all eyes are on you. Of course there are bugs but in the main this is how they behave.
Fun of course is in the eye of the beholder I can’t get enough tbh. There is zero grind to get to a G3 weapons and suit which is more than enough to survive and thrive in a High CZ.
Fun of course is in the eye of the beholder I can’t get enough tbh. There is zero grind to get to a G3 weapons and suit which is more than enough to survive and thrive in a High CZ.
Doom original is just so old but great
It was the first time I remember the straffe action, something that is a staple in all FPS that I’ve played since. I particularly also remember the baby crying as part of the soundtrack, late at night with headphones on, in the dark… that was creepy.Better awareness and use of surroundings: better use of cover, attempts to actually flank targets, more dynamic adjustments to patrol routes, actively sweeping areas, consolidating forces in defensible/critical locations, reactivating disabled sensors/alarms/turrets, sabotaging assets to prevent their capture, not forgetting stuff after 90 seconds, etc and so forth.
Having basic competence with their own equipment would also be nice. They only seem to switch weapons due to range, don't take advantage of splash damage, and can't even use the rocket packs they wear. About the only thing they are good at is throwing grenades.
EDO's AI is bad relative to titles from twenty years ago and woefully poor in comparison against some contemporary game AI. Anything that falls short of what players can do is an area that can be improved upon.
We must be playing different parts of the game because in the CZ they do everything you state in the first paragraph. I can record a session and go through it point by point.
Far Cry Series (3 is my jam), Fallout NV and 4 and the Metro series are pretty good. I also like shooters with lots of stealth like MGS and Clancy's Rainbow Six.
I've played a crapton of CZs, and even post U11, the AI is still brain dead. However, the responses are mostly just poor and ineffective, rather than being nearly absent as they are in non-CZ scenarios.
Actually, now that I think of it more, even in CZs most of the stuff in my first paragraph is actually absent. By and large NPC rush the control points, then bunch up. They barely use cover. They only pursue high threat hostiles for a few moments before going back to what they were doing. They never clear areas after a control point has moved. They don't setup perimeters for layered defense. They don't camp or sabotage ammo boxes or recharge stations.
If the AI was any good, it would be possible for me to lose a CZ, but I don't think I ever have, even when doing high CZs in the flight suit. Indeed, I can't even be killed in CZs unless I'm being profoundly reckless or lazy, or stumble across the rare CMDR.
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I think the trend is towards good story line, like a book start at A and end at Z. A friend suggested I play “The Last of Us” it was an excellent story and played quite well if a little slow. Another that springs to mind is the old Resident Evil series, the first PS1 version was quite good albeit the camera angles where a little wiered. Also I liked Rainbow 6 but again the early version on the N64 but it was quite buggy.
Wolfenstein 3D has strafing too. And I can't recall crying babies in Doom, but I do remember a particularly creepy dream scene from the first Max Payne.Doom original is just so old but great
I never played either Wolfenstein or Max Payne but I do remember both. Wolfenstein cause of my retro gaming interest and Max Payne was such a big release it was hard to miss - even if I never played it
I have never found games with low numbers of bullet sponge NPCs to be that great. Much better are relentless hordes that are individually easier to kill, but tactics, ammo management and good aim are needed to overcome them.
This doesn’t fit well with the current settlements, but maybe it’s a direction that any potential on-foot thargoid combat could take.
This doesn’t fit well with the current settlements, but maybe it’s a direction that any potential on-foot thargoid combat could take.
Good level/encounter design is what makes or breaks a FPS. Good level design can sometimes even work wonders around engine limitations, a bad AI or other faults.
Also I think in that regard it'd be most fair to compare it with more open world/nonlinear shooter games - Payday 2, Borderlands 2, Prey 2017 and Deus Ex (old and new) being some of my favorites there.
The level design in odyssey feels nonexistent, perhaps due to the settlements being so multipurpose (stealth, CZ, combat) or perhaps because of "realism". Due to the modular design of buildings and any lack of randomness they stop being fun to explore as spaces quickly, unlike planets. The encounters themselves seem to be down to the AI reacting to the player and it doesn't really have any interesting moves to make there.
If we look at odyssey missions/settlements as levels there's also the issue of how going from level to level takes minutes of space ship gameplay - this is unacceptable in my space ship space game! Compare this to other open world games with driving a vehicle, does getting around take as much time and require as little input from the player, is it as uneventful?
Also I think in that regard it'd be most fair to compare it with more open world/nonlinear shooter games - Payday 2, Borderlands 2, Prey 2017 and Deus Ex (old and new) being some of my favorites there.
The level design in odyssey feels nonexistent, perhaps due to the settlements being so multipurpose (stealth, CZ, combat) or perhaps because of "realism". Due to the modular design of buildings and any lack of randomness they stop being fun to explore as spaces quickly, unlike planets. The encounters themselves seem to be down to the AI reacting to the player and it doesn't really have any interesting moves to make there.
If we look at odyssey missions/settlements as levels there's also the issue of how going from level to level takes minutes of space ship gameplay - this is unacceptable in my space ship space game! Compare this to other open world games with driving a vehicle, does getting around take as much time and require as little input from the player, is it as uneventful?
Overwatch - my current top favorite. It's not just a FPS, it's a chess game in many regards as well, with a ton of diversity in gameplay. Unfortunately the thing that makes it great is also the thing that can make it terrible: the need for a good team.
Earlier Battlefield Games (3,4) - When it comes to more traditional war games, I prefer a "heavier" more realistic feel over the run-n-hop COD games. Battlefield had that, along with huge maps, vehicles, and of course my favorite - destructible assets! Disclaimer - I played these almost exclusively as multiplayer games.
COD Modern Warfare 2 - Despite what I said above about COD, this one was special IMO. The single player campaign was fun, the graphics and gameplay were ahead of their time (at least on console), and I really miss the days of gathering with other friends in the same room and playing a game like this on 4-way split-screen. Split-screen wasn't the best gaming experience, but it was definitely a wonderful social experience.
Honorable mention: Wolfenstein Enemy Territory - I just loved running around yelling, "Attack, attaaack, attaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaackkkkkk!!!!" The voice acting was over-the-top crazy fun.
OH OH OH OH OH!!!! I almost forgot one of my favorite ever - MAG (stands for Massive Action Game). It was a PS3 game that hosted massive battles with up to 256 players at a time, ongoing wars between factions, a diversity of gameplay, and my all favorite elements from the COD and Battlefield games combined (along with unique elements of its own). Like Elite, it was more niche, but those of us who loved it really loved it! I was very sad when the servers shut down
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