Engineers 2.1 Combat tactics required (macho free zone) :)

Angus

Angus
I'm nothing special combat wise, I only fight npc's but I like to think I'm competent at it. I'm noticing though that a lot of ships are out-turning my A class Vulture, with me using the mid throttle point and often some FA off.

I'm trying to work out what I'm doing wrong, I generally dogfight with 4 pips to weapons most of the time, but perhaps I need to give the engines more attention to compete in the turning game. I also noticed an NPC adder flying backwards quite a bit in a fight so perhaps I need to investigate that tactic, although I'm not very keen on the concept in a game that does the WW2 fighter combat thing so well already.

Just to be clear, I welcome the increased challenge, it was silly being able to defeat Elite Anacondas etc, but I'm not sure how to raise my game, and would welcome any advice.
 

Derath

D
If your in a vulture and your getting out-turned its probably not shifting your pips to engines when you aren't being shot at, also remember to use directional thrusters to make your turns wider/shallower as you need to. Vultures are the perfect ships to get used to these things in because its so nippy anyway!
 

stripealipe

stripealipe
You've basically worked it out yourself dude. Pips management has always been essential in PVP combat, and now you're gonna have to start using that for PVE.
I use Voice Attack macros for PIPs management and set the different combos up depending on the ship i'm flying, but def assigning Pips to engines is gonna help you out.

Good luck :)
 

vermu

vermu
Angus said:
I'm nothing special combat wise, I only fight npc's but I like to think I'm competent at it. I'm noticing though that a lot of ships are out-turning my A class Vulture, with me using the mid throttle point and often some FA off.

I'm trying to work out what I'm doing wrong, I generally dogfight with 4 pips to weapons most of the time, but perhaps I need to give the engines more attention to compete in the turning game. I also noticed an NPC adder flying backwards quite a bit in a fight so perhaps I need to investigate that tactic, although I'm not very keen on the concept in a game that does the WW2 fighter combat thing so well already.

Just to be clear, I welcome the increased challenge, it was silly being able to defeat Elite Anacondas etc, but I'm not sure how to raise my game, and would welcome any advice.
Click to expand...

Here's advice how AI won't out turn you. Put 4 pips to engines. Boost and at the same time use flight assist off and turn. Even python is turning really fast like that. So boost before flight assist off is the key here. This is basic flight assist off move and I am using it all the time. Other than that I am not flight assist off expert.
 

Angus

Angus
Thanks for the responses, from my own testing, I couldn't see that increasing the pips to engines made an obvious difference to turning, (pitch) - is the point that it gives you more frequent opportunities to boost, for boost turns?
 

bkrownd

B
Is there any way to simply cycle through just 3-4 basic "pips" pre-set configurations without reaching over to diddle with the arrow keys? (something that doesn't involve talking to the computer all the time, which would make me very unpopular at home)
 
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dutchy2000

D
You can use something like AutoHotKey to program sequences that set pips to what you need instantly. I don't use it, but its possible. Lets say you want full pips to system. reset, sys, sys, sys or something of that. Well whatever keys you have assigned to them anyway. Its not quite as easy as lets say voice attack as you need to edit some text files, but its fairly straight forward.
 

Angus

Angus
I'm still not clear if having more pips to engines actually improves turning - aside from boost turning?
 

[VR] Deggial

[VR] Deggial
Turn-rates are indeed optimal, when flying "in the middle of the blue".

However, turn-rates are realted to the total speed - which is not what is displayed in the speed-indicator!
When using thrusters, their speed is added to the forward-speed and the total speed is increased beyond the turn-optimum. Staying a little bit below the blue center when using thrusters is a good idea, imo.

Additionally, different ships react differently in respect to sub-optimal-speed turns.
I did some in-depth-testing quite a while ago:
- The Viper, is way more forgiving at max-speed than other ships
- The Eagle reacts better to more pips in engines in comparison to other ships.

And while this was done in the pre-release beta, I don't think, the flight mechanics were altered fundamentally ever since.
 
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Sans Daring

Sans Daring
4-pip engines I'd say is key, even if it means you can't sustain fire as much as you'd like. If I'm arcing against a reasonably nimble ship, 4-pips and in the blue means if my ship isn't a brick, I can break their turn and get behind them. If things level out for a time, I'll got back to 4 on weapons, but depending on how much turn and speed I need will define whether I prioritise the pips on thrust or engines.

Yeah the FA off and thrust and turn is pretty useful, especially if you find yourself ending up head-on with an enemy. Get past and round, or if you can, time the turn as you boost past on FA off and get some hits in.

I'm not a combat king, I often fail at all this, but these tactics have proved useful when I've tried them.

Though the best tactics I guess now is check the ranks (regardless of the ship class, yes even Eagles), measure up whether you might have any security pals who might help out if you screw up, don't be an idiot and take on wings without the certainty you have other people who will take up some of the slack if things get tight. Be ready to 4-pip engine and boost from mass-lock if things go wrong (like a nasty ram knocking your upper-hand). Common sense has become a greater friend than combat tactics I think.
 
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Klab

Klab
Boom and Zoom is now an effective tactic, especially against the smaller ships that like to stick on your tail. I fly a Corvette, and reversing/pitching up just does not cut it anymore since the patch dropped. It is virtually impossible to get them in your crosshairs by using conventional tactics. Boom and Zoom however DOES work, simply boost away in a straight line, do a quick FAoff 180 degree turn whilst sailing away from your target. By the time you have completed your turn, the target will be about 2km away and somewhere close to your crosshairs. FA on again,you can now target it for a good few seconds until they get behind you again. Rinse and repeat.
 
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