A strange thought about canopies.

[Hungry Shoggoth]

So I've been watching the original 1960's Star Trek while on my way to Sagittarius A and something struck me. Why do the ships in ED have glass, or acrylic or whatever clear material they use, for canopies?

Wouldn't it be much safer, especially on the military vessels, to have a completely armored hull with a screen to view the outside world like the Enterprise has on its bridge?

Even if a ships designer wanted to have a way to view the world outside unfiltered I would think there would be some mechanism, shutters of some sort maybe, to close if the canopy is breached. I wonder if a feature like this would make for a good optional internal for explorers/combat pilots.

 

[Hooplah]

Well, if one is watching Star Trek then the answer of course has to be transparent aluminum! Holds whales and lots of water with no problems so great for canopies.

 

[stormyuk]

Its for the cool sound effects when you get "Canopy Compromised" and the Darth Vader breathing.

I'd keep that over a Star Trek screen any day of the week.

 

[Clifra Jones]

In an episode of Next Generation Picard is standing in front of an observation window with someone not of the 24th century (It may have been the Mark Twain episode, can't remember) The other person points to the "window" and says "That isn't glass is it?" Picard responds, "No, no glass could hold back the vacuum of space, it is a force field".

I agree, why do we have glass, especially glass that can be broken by weapons.

But, I don't see Elite as the "Future that will be" but more of the "Future we thought would be back in 1980s!" Like the future we should be living in now according to those in the 50s and 60s. (Which did not happen)

 

[mostly newish]

So I've been watching the original 1960's Star Trek while on my way to Sagittarius A and something struck me. Why do the ships in ED have glass, or acrylic or whatever clear material they use, for canopies?

Wouldn't it be much safer, especially on the military vessels, to have a completely armored hull with a screen to view the outside world like the Enterprise has on its bridge?

Even if a ships designer wanted to have a way to view the world outside unfiltered I would think there would be some mechanism, shutters of some sort maybe, to close if the canopy is breached. I wonder if a feature like this would make for a good optional internal for explorers/combat pilots.

awesome ! what a great post .

 

[tafkabb]

Don't be silly. Star Trek isn't real

 

[Mr Cynical]

Don't be silly. Star Trek isn't real

Blasphemer! Stone him, stone him!

 

[Micha]

Funnily enough one meta-explanation for the original Elite's 4 views (forward, aft, left, right) and wireframe graphics was that the cockpit was a fully enclosed module somewhere in the ship, with the ships' computers generating a representation of the outside view for the pilot based on sensor data.

And yes, makes a LOT more sense but is nowhere near as immersive. Could be used to add interesting game-effects though - as outside sensors are destroyed, you lose parts of your view.

 

[Iskariot]

So I've been watching the original 1960's Star Trek while on my way to Sagittarius A and something struck me. Why do the ships in ED have glass, or acrylic or whatever clear material they use, for canopies?

Wouldn't it be much safer, especially on the military vessels, to have a completely armored hull with a screen to view the outside world like the Enterprise has on its bridge?

Even if a ships designer wanted to have a way to view the world outside unfiltered I would think there would be some mechanism, shutters of some sort maybe, to close if the canopy is breached. I wonder if a feature like this would make for a good optional internal for explorers/combat pilots.

This has come up many times.

This simply is a game design choice.
FD chose canopies.
I think it is perfectly fine, but I would like to be able to engineer a canopy to make it stronger.

 

[Father Giliam]

Monitors can fail without being directly damaged, Cyber-warfare would very much be a concern.

 

[STARB0YY]

This has come up many times.

This simply is a game design choice.
FD chose canopies.
I think it is perfectly fine, but I would like to be able to engineer a canopy to make it stronger.

That would be great for ships with bad canopies, such as the vulture.

 

[CMDR Delta Lima]

Actually BSG (the reboot) really did it right. Bury the bridge/CIC/whatever you want to call it deep inside the ship where it's well protected from any threat. It really makes no sense in Star Trek for example to put your ship's nerve center up on top where it's prominently displayed to everyone.

Also wouldn't you want to depressurize your ship anyway before going into combat? Explosive decompression could cause severe structural damage.

 

[JetsonRING]

1) it is not the Star trek universe.

If you do not have transparent aluminum, the next best thing is a window because a window does not stop working when the power fails. Sort of like using pencils in space, it does not need expensive over-engineering.

 

[CMDR Heisenberg B. Damned]

Well, if one is watching Star Trek then the answer of course has to be transparent aluminum! Holds whales and lots of water with no problems so great for canopies.

Don't be silly. Star Trek isn't real

Transparent aluminum

No, I’m not talking about the “Star Trek” variant. This type of transparent aluminum is made of an aluminum-based ceramic, aluminum oxynitride, also called ALON. It is commercially synthesized and manufactured by Surmet Corp. of Burlington, Mass. The material itself has extraordinary properties. ALON is 80% transparent, almost as hard as sapphire and very resistant to damage from oxidation or radiation. A 1.6-inch-thick piece of ALON armor is capable of stopping 0.50-caliber armor-piercing machine-gun rounds.

From:

http://www.marketwatch.com/story/fu...sparent-aluminum-are-now-a-reality-2015-06-09

 

[Wolfe3]

Actually BSG (the reboot) really did it right. Bury the bridge/CIC/whatever you want to call it deep inside the ship where it's well protected from any threat. It really makes no sense in Star Trek for example to put your ship's nerve center up on top where it's prominently displayed to everyone.

Also wouldn't you want to depressurize your ship anyway before going into combat? Explosive decompression could cause severe structural damage.

Anybody remember the combat bridge? Enterprise had it.

 

[Falcon JSDF]

In an episode of Next Generation Picard is standing in front of an observation window with someone not of the 24th century (It may have been the Mark Twain episode, can't remember) The other person points to the "window" and says "That isn't glass is it?" Picard responds, "No, no glass could hold back the vacuum of space, it is a force field".

I agree, why do we have glass, especially glass that can be broken by weapons.

But, I don't see Elite as the "Future that will be" but more of the "Future we thought would be back in 1980s!" Like the future we should be living in now according to those in the 50s and 60s. (Which did not happen)

Stupid idea, any power loss and all your stuff would be lost to the void

I hate the glass on the Cobra MK III, That silly plastic bubble ruins the whole look in my eyes.

 

[GoldenSilver484]

Transparent aluminum

No, I’m not talking about the “Star Trek” variant. This type of transparent aluminum is made of an aluminum-based ceramic, aluminum oxynitride, also called ALON. It is commercially synthesized and manufactured by Surmet Corp. of Burlington, Mass. The material itself has extraordinary properties. ALON is 80% transparent, almost as hard as sapphire and very resistant to damage from oxidation or radiation. A 1.6-inch-thick piece of ALON armor is capable of stopping 0.50-caliber armor-piercing machine-gun rounds.

From:

http://www.marketwatch.com/story/fu...sparent-aluminum-are-now-a-reality-2015-06-09

How would that 1.6 inches of ALON do against a 20mm rotary cannon? That's at least what a small multicannon is, if not larger. I've taken direct hits on my canopy from a huge cannon and it didn't break, though it had quite a few cracks in it, and that thing has to be at least a 10 inch naval gun in caliber.
The canopies are definitely not made of glass, or anything we currently have now, solid steel couldn't even stop that unless it's stupidly thick.

 

[CMDR Heisenberg B. Damned]

How would that 1.6 inches of ALON do against a 20mm rotary cannon? That's at least what a small multicannon is, if not larger. I've taken direct hits on my canopy from a huge cannon and it didn't break, though it had quite a few cracks in it, and that thing has to be at least a 10 inch naval gun in caliber.
The canopies are definitely not made of glass, or anything we currently have now, solid steel couldn't even stop that unless it's stupidly thick.

Well I didn't say they were and I didn't say they were only 1.6 inches think. The point is more the hardness and durability of a material doesn't mean it can't be transparent and we already have transparent aluminium type material. With a 1000 years of advances it's not too out of place to expect a material that could be both seen through and resist 20mm rotary cannons.

 

[Martyn W]

Anybody remember the combat bridge? Enterprise had it.

Think Battle Bridge called it was.

 

[GoldenSilver484]

Well I didn't say they were and I didn't say they were only 1.6 inches think. The point is more the hardness and durability of a material doesn't mean it can't be transparent and we already have transparent aluminium type material. With a 1000 years of advances it's not too out of place to expect a material that could be both seen through and resist 20mm rotary cannons.

That's my point exactly. Whatever the canopies are made of is strong enough to withstand quite a large amount of damage to the point that a sensor/viewscreen system isn't worth the potential trouble electronic warfare would bring.