Advanced Scanner has totaly ruined exploration for me : here is my solution.

[Chronix Chaos]

With a ship equipped with a Basic Scanner exploration is a fun and gameplay rich experience that has been totally nullified by the Advanced Scanner. In my trusty Eagle I would jump into a system, scan to see if there was any planets close, and if not align myself with the stars spin and set off into the void and try and find those stars that weren't stars but planets because they moved. I chose an Eagle because of its large viewing screen and I would use this to fly under the system plane and look up to find those elusive planets. And when I had found the whole set there was a sense of achievement of a job well done. But now it's RUINED! Now I jump to a system, Blap the scan once, and that's it. Every thing its discovered! NO!!! How could they destroy all of that gameplay? And make a mockery of all the exploring that's gone before. What's the point of flying around to examine everything? Money? - NO! Exploring is like fishing. Plenty of people love to fish, and the more difficult the catch the better. But who wants to work on a fishing trawler? Exploring is supposed to be hard. It's more fun! So I'm fed up and I think the following would have been a much better solution.
The Range of the Exploration Scanner should curtailed to 1,000ls and be used in connection with the System Map. The System Map would be altered to Star centred with concentric planetary rings along with the Goldilocks Zone. When the Scanner is used in Super Cruise, Firstly the planets in range are discovered as normal. Secondly, information is gathered about the rest of the solar system and would be displayed on the system map in the form of likelihoods with possible positions of planets, their possible size and possible make up. The likelihood of a planet being in a place would become less certain the further away the planet is but the accuracy would become greater with closer scans or with better scanners. The pilot would then select an area of space on the System map which would be transferred as a target onto the Navigation Compass. This would allow the pilot to actually decide which targets to prioritise. i.e. planets in the goldilocks zone or gas giants, and the pilot would have to use those skills gained to find those planets. I would also limit the Surface Scanner to be used in normal space in a planet low orbit. As this takes time the pilot would have to pick and choose which planets to scan to make the most profit. All of this allows for planets to be hidden in already explored outer solar systems, as promised.
I wish I had the money to be in at the Beta because this is something I would have definitely wanted implemented.

 

[pakriksz]

I have a perfect solution: don't buy advanced scanner, so you can have "fun"

 

[esraven]

I have a perfect solution: don't buy advanced scanner, so you can have "fun"

I agree totally that not using the advanced scanner is more fun and gives more satisfaction finding an planet.

But... ingame we are able to get our name cited as the first discoverer when we are the first human being to find that planet. And here the advanced scanner is spoiling the gameplay of those trying to get fun out of exploration.
Exploration ia also about being really the first who found that hard to find planet.

So I would suggest to seriously limit the range in which the advanced scanner is possible to pinpoint a planet (let's say twice the intermediate), but in stead enables to see how many planetary bodies there really are out there and display them in the system overview, same way you see all the stars in the system overview. And even here I would put an upper limit in detection (ie 50000 ls)

 

[InMemoriamSirocco]

How about the Advanced Scanner shows you exactly how many bodies are in a System and can distinguish them by size, but not tell you what type of planet there is?

View attachment 29753

 

[rootsrat]

I have a perfect solution: don't buy advanced scanner, so you can have "fun"

This. Nobody MAKES you use the AS. Just stick to the Basic Scanner...

Whenever you bring "fun" into the equation, the discussion becomes pointless, as you're bringing in a very subjective criteria. What's fun for you is tedious and boring for someone else, and vice versa.

I for one think it's fun the way it is with an Advanced Scanner. I don't have the patience or time to stare at my screen trying to spot 1 moving dot amongst hundreds of other dots. But I would still like to see some good sights in the galaxy. Advanced Scanner is perfect for me. Basic Scanner is perfect for you.

If you take the Advanced Scanner away or change the way it works, you will take the fun away from my game. Currently both of us can have good time when exploring. With your solution only you will have fun and I'll be a little upset bunny that spent millions on Asp for nothing. Live and let live!

 

[CrispyLeper]

How about the Advanced Scanner shows you exactly how many bodies are in a System and can distinguish them by size, but not tell you what type of planet there is?

View attachment 29753

+1
Absolutely right.
When I first starting using the ads I assumed unscanned planets were all pink and you had to scan then to get the detail which would then transform then into a more representative image in the sysmap. Didn't take me long to figure out "nope, they are all just ice!"
If there was no ads how many black holes and neutron stars would go unnoticed? It would be a travesty!

 

[stephen_usher]

How about the Advanced Scanner shows you exactly how many bodies are in a System and can distinguish them by size, but not tell you what type of planet there is?

Well, the system as it is now annoyingly half does this, as in the system map can tell you what type of object has been found, what they look like, their size etc. but the targeting panel in the cockpit can't. Most annoying in systems with lots of asteroid belts.

I must admit though that the AS does take a lot of the fun out but the intermediate scanner's range is too low.

May I suggest that instead of a discrete distance it should use the angular size of the object as the measure as to whether it's detected. (i.e. a large object a long way away would be as scannable as a small object near by.) It would make more logical sense in terms of the the real world. The three scanners would then be gauged by the minimal apparent size of the object.

e.g.
Basic scanner: Stars within 10,000ls, large gas giants out to 1,000ls, small gas giants to 500ls, small planets out to 10ls
Intermediate scanner: Stars within 100,000ls, large gas giants out to 10,000ls, small gas giants out to 1,000ls, small planets out to 100ls
Advanced scanner: Stars within 1,000,000ls, large gas giants out to 100,000ls, small gas giants out to 10,000ls, small planets out to 1,000ls

This should make finding all bodies in a system easy using the advanced scanner without handing it all on a plate.

Also marking the objects in the targeting panel with the object type icon would be logical.

(Oh, and it should number the objects in terms of those discovered and re-number them as more are discovered as how does the ship know the body's absolute place in a system before you've found the intermediate objects?)

 

[DocLooshkin]

I don't really know what the solution is, but I do feel exploration needs more work. A ship should have no trouble recognising the presence of a large astronomical body, even without a dedicated scanner - pre-technological humans have been doing it for thousands of years, after all. I would like to see scanners instead dedicated to specific purposes - one general scanner for doing everything slowly and with limits, an astro-scanner that does what the Advanced Scanner does now (so Rootsrat isn't put out), one offering specific useful info for miners (and would make it easier to find better asteroids to mine), a ship-scanner for bounty-hunters / pirates (the most expensive version of which could potentially replace the FWS, KWS and cargo scanner, none of which I would miss)... you get the idea. Obviously, it should be up to the player if they want to sacrifice module-slots to different types of dedicated scanner.

 

[rootsrat]

I don't really know what the solution is, but I do feel exploration needs more work. A ship should have no trouble recognising the presence of a large astronomical body, even without a dedicated scanner - pre-technological humans have been doing it for thousands of years, after all. I would like to see scanners instead dedicated to specific purposes - one general scanner for doing everything slowly and with limits, an astro-scanner that does what the Advanced Scanner does now (so Rootsrat isn't put out), one offering specific useful info for miners (and would make it easier to find better asteroids to mine), a ship-scanner for bounty-hunters / pirates (the most expensive version of which could potentially replace the FWS, KWS and cargo scanner, none of which I would miss)... you get the idea. Obviously, it should be up to the player if they want to sacrifice module-slots to different types of dedicated scanner.

Thanks, appreciate your concern - very generous!

 

[Psycho Romeo]

Very good points from many posters.

After reading the inputs, I agree that the whole 'discovery' element should be preserved by limiting the range of the advanced discovery scanner. I would think anything outside of 1,000ls is just too far to be worth it for most explorers anyway, and those who would rather be thorough aren't going to mind doing a visual check.

 

[xondk]

It is a bit tricky if you ask me, especially given that exploration is already the easily slowest way to gain money though it is better now, it is 'less' risky as well. But I enjoy exploration as it is now, if it was made so for every single system I'd need to use paralax discovery to find stuff, for all of them, it would quickly become annoying.

If people want to do this, then just don't get the advanced discovery scanner? seems like the obvious choice.
However do you feel "slow" compared to others then? that others will get first discoveries before you? if so then I do not believe the solution is affecting everyone else.

 

[stephen_usher]

If people want to do this, then just don't get the advanced discovery scanner? seems like the obvious choice.

The Intermediate Discovery Scanner is too weak to be usable for picking up all planets even when trying to use parallax, especially if they're small and the system is large.

 

[Ben Ryder]

Hi Chronix.

Dont buy the scanner and go exploring very very far away and play the way you like and still get your name as the first to discover.

Have fun.

 

[CrispyLeper]

Very good points from many posters.

After reading the inputs, I agree that the whole 'discovery' element should be preserved by limiting the range of the advanced discovery scanner. I would think anything outside of 1,000ls is just too far to be worth it for most explorers anyway, and those who would rather be thorough aren't going to mind doing a visual check.

Again, how do we discover those neutron stars 300kls away?
Advanced scanner is needed you should just not necessarily know what types of planets they are until scanned.

 

[Edith_The_Hutt]

May I suggest that instead of a discrete distance it should use the angular size of the object as the measure as to whether it's detected. (i.e. a large object a long way away would be as scannable as a small object near by.) It would make more logical sense in terms of the the real world. The three scanners would then be gauged by the minimal apparent size of the object.

e.g.
Basic scanner: Stars within 10,000ls, large gas giants out to 1,000ls, small gas giants to 500ls, small planets out to 10ls
Intermediate scanner: Stars within 100,000ls, large gas giants out to 10,000ls, small gas giants out to 1,000ls, small planets out to 100ls
Advanced scanner: Stars within 1,000,000ls, large gas giants out to 100,000ls, small gas giants out to 10,000ls, small planets out to 1,000ls

This should make finding all bodies in a system easy using the advanced scanner without handing it all on a plate.

Also marking the objects in the targeting panel with the object type icon would be logical.

I have to say I like this idea very much. I'm currently using an Intermediate Discovery Scanner and the problem with it is that some bodies in a system are bleedin' obvious (stars) but you can't scan them without shlepping 100,000ls across a system to get within a 1,000 ls of them. This is what's wrong with the "Don't use the ADS" solution, there are circumstances when not having a scanning range longer than 1,000ls is tedious, but I don't want to lose the entertainment I get from the parallax mini-game at the same time.

 

[Psycho Romeo]

Again, how do we discover those neutron stars 300kls away?
Advanced scanner is needed you should just not necessarily know what types of planets they are until scanned.

You don't, unless you go exploring or get lucky. That's the nature of discovery, is it not?

 

[Branko]

Just go out of the way. Travel at max jump range for a hour. You'll find plenty of unclaimed planets and things with the ADS and even with the intermediate scanner; because nobody really cares about scanning icy rocks and whatnot. If being the first to put your name on a rock is your thing, you can find plenty of that 500ly from Sol, even with the intermediate scanner and without parallax.

The galaxy is so g huge that people who explore to find important things - habitable worlds, and so on - their game wouldn't really change with removal of the ADS, because if it's not within 1000 ly, its most likely not habitable unless the star is very hot, and if it's not habitable, nobody is paying you for it. Even if every tenth planet more then 1000ly out which you find via parallax scrolling was a previously unexplored earthlike / waterworld (and you won't be so lucky) there'd be no sense in doing it, because there's plenty of unexplored systems with prospective stars which you could scan in the meantime.

Once you're close to SOL you'll find more systems which are completely explored with every rock scanned, but move away some distance and you'll see that while people have ADS, they just don't bother to map out entire systems unless they're perspective.

 

[Psycho__99]

I agree And someone found an intermediate solution here
https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showthread.php?t=139382
He stated this to find pirates station or following supercruise wake but I'm quite sure he didn't thought about interation between solar wind and celestial objects.

In short ,if they replace the Advanced discovery scanner by an overlay for no vuisible spectra I promess to not complain.

 

[Ziljan]

The problem isn't the ADS. The problem is that exploring needs a bit more depth of gameplay to make it interesting. Parallax is an ancient method of finding nearby objects used by jumped-up cave people. This is the 34th century. We should be using spectral analysis, orbital perturbation, planetary albedo/brightness of parent star, reflective vs radiative emission, interference from solar and cosmic radiation. there should also be greatly increased rewards based on how close we are at the time of the scan just based on theoretical angular resolution limits. A lower resolution camera up close can be far superior to a more advanced camera far away. Likewise with full orbit of the target object. Just getting one half of a planet that is partly in shadow from 50Ls away shouldn't give the same reward as a 360deg orbital sweep from <25Mm.

 

[Arnoldo]

C'mon Mods, necro from almost 2 years ago!!!

Do your thang