AI Mission Targets got repaired to 100% hull again - Bug or working as intended ?

[Max Magic]

Hey Guys,


being relatively fresh to the game, i made good progress earning me a VULTURE within a week with solely making bounty hunting in RES and CZ...


But then i took me a minute and had the bad feeling that money came far too easy this way and that "FARMING" in those, how i call them, "artificial" instances didnt felt quite right...that it destroys immersion and finally the fun to actually PLAY the game like a lonesome Pilot, starting with a rusty ship with a handful of credits, trying desperately to make his way in this universe...


So long story, short answer: I decided to DELETE my savegame, starting from the fresh again and sweared to me that i will never ever enter such an instance again !!!


This leaves me in my starter EAGLE with:

- bounty hunting in SC
- mission running
- few tons of trading
- smuggling
- mining (painful with just the starter refinery with only one bins)

So i opened bulletin board and found 2 assasination missions in a nearby system and i took them...

...arriving into the system, i found quickly this one WANTED Guys, being also a Mission Target worth for around 70k credits plus extra money for his bounty (a fortune for me when playing the game like this)...and he flew a VIPER only !!!
From my first savegame i had some good combat experiences and knew, i can handle him when i would be able to stay on his six...so i started Frame Shift Interdiction...and here he came:

- with my 3 fixed Pulse lasers, i quickly took out his shields
- and like i thought, i was able to stay on his six, so he couldnt land a shot on me, giving me the freedom to set 4 pips in engines and 2 in weapons
- but as you alll know with LvL 1 Pulse Lasers, it takes an eternity to wear down the hull...
- so when he was at 20% Hull, he started his Frame Sift Drive...
- and with my EAGLE, i couldnt masslock him, so he managed to jump out with 16% Hull left
- i thought, doesnt matter, i will intercept him right again a second time

---> but then disaster stroke:
- Seconds after being in SC again, i identified him again, the same guy in the same ship, but he was at 100% Hull again !!! Right after entering SC, with no docking at a station in the meantime...just a wonder has happened, his hull had recovered by itsself... just lol
- So i thought, maybe a bug or a misleading number on my HUD...
- i intercepted him again, we both fall into normal space, and...
- yeah, what the hell, he was indeed at 100% Hull again !!!
- so i started shooting again, this time even more aggresive...but when he got under 30% Hull, he was trying to run again, jumped out at 12% Hull, and guess what ???

---> when i found him seconds later in SC, he was at 100% Hull again !!!!!


I mean, (sorry) is happening here ??? I quit outraged the game and are not sure whether i should start again, because it looks like, when you want to play the game "lore-friendly", those insane bugs strikes you much harder than when you just farm a fortune in a high RES in a matter of hours...


Thanks for reading Guys :S

 

[Mohrgan]

It's not a bug, it's just a function of instancing. Once a target leaves the regular space bubble, or instance you were fighting in, that target is effectively gone. When you return to SC you are entering an new instance of that system, so the targets, even the one named guy you're looking for, will be new as well. It would be interesting to know if the target you brought down to 16% High waked out, or Low waked. High, would mean to another system, and Low would be into SC. If he went to another system to escape, you shouldn't have been able to find him again so soon. It's just how the game generates NPC's. A small price we have to pay.

You should look into targeting specific modules. You can target your opponents FSD, Drives, and the big one is the Power Plant. Destroying the FSD will make them unable to jump. The Drives are required for any motion. And the Power Plant is the target of choice, for now, as it is much quicker to pop a PP, than to completely crack the hull. You may have had enough time to destroy the PP, before he jumped if you started on it as soon as it's shields were down.

 

[nrage]

Does it matter if you target the wake when you activate supercruise? If he had hyperspaced to another system then you would need a wake scanner, but in system perhaps not. And.. when you follow a wake I believe you will get the same ship you were attacking before - I once followed an NPC pirate through 2 hyperspace jumps and his hull damage remained both times.

 

[Max Magic]

Thanks for the reply mate

First time he low waked, the second time when he ran, i think, it was your mentionend high wake...but not sure about this

Yeah, targeting his FSD is a good idea, gives me more time to beat him


Nevertheless, it was one of the most thrilling fights i had in the game so far, much more than this boring farming in high RES zones when you have sometimes 2 Anacondas to back you up or even in CZs...because i knew, one good volley from his 4 guns would had taken out my E - rated shields immediatley...so i had to be really careful...

Even more disappointing was it to see that the game doesnt record your combat in a RP way and just makes a new fresh copy of him...but next time, i will do better

- - - Updated - - -

Does it matter if you target the wake when you activate supercruise? If he had hyperspaced to another system then you would need a wake scanner, but in system perhaps not. And.. when you follow a wake I believe you will get the same ship you were attacking before - I once followed an NPC pirate through 2 hyperspace jumps and his hull damage remained both times.

I had no wake scanner equipped...and the first time he just run to normal SC in the same system...like we all do when running from a superior guy to get to this damn station

 

[Nanos]

I'd call it a bug.

It is a consequence of the design, which relies on instancing, so is functioning as intended in that regard.

But as far as good game design goes, well, no it breaks the rules there !

It could be fixed, improved, function as it is supposed to, but whether anyone will bother to tidy up the lose ends in things like this, I just don't know.

Maybe.

Or you will just have to wait for someone to write a better game and play that instead.

 

[RG-870]

You either accept NPCs using "cheats" or you should look for another way to earn your money. Some major points where NPCs don't follow the same rules as you are:
- Respawn after instance switching (100% Hull)
- unlimited ammo for ballistics
- no mass lock in asteroid fields
- assassination targets may open fire on you without becoming wanted
- dropping out of FSD at max speed

 

[Mohrgan]

My ruminating on the High or Low waking of the target was more about continuity than process. If he has High waked out, seeing him again in the same system would be as breaking as his having a restored hull.

I believe the words Bug, and Immersion should be stricken from the forums dictionary. What the OP saw was not a bug. It was a example of how NPC's are generated. It has to be done somehow. Trying to make one NPC, or any NPC persistent in that was is just not feasible. This kind of limit is present in all of the games I have played in the last ten years. It's a limit to any kind of large scale programming. I find some people just use any excuse to bad mouth games and their designers. Not just here, and now, but across many games.

 

[nrage]

I had no wake scanner equipped...and the first time he just run to normal SC in the same system...like we all do when running from a superior guy to get to this damn station

Ok. I was just wondering if you could ensure you ended up in the same instance as the guy if you did target the wake when you jumped back to supercruise. It should not require a wake scanner to do this, as it's a low wake. That was my thinking.

 

[Time Streamer]

Does it matter if you target the wake when you activate supercruise? If he had hyperspaced to another system then you would need a wake scanner, but in system perhaps not. And.. when you follow a wake I believe you will get the same ship you were attacking before - I once followed an NPC pirate through 2 hyperspace jumps and his hull damage remained both times.

Yes i can confirm this. This weekend while i was finishing a RES run i decided to pursuit a Dropship trying to escape. She jumped out of the system and i followed her with a wake scanner. There she was, orbiting the sun at 77% hull. Its seems that following a target without a wake scanner is quite hard/impossible but as long you have one of those it's just like exiting SC into a drop wake of any ship: you "teleport" to a location near your target.

 

[nrage]

Yes i can confirm this. This weekend while i was finishing a RES run i decided to pursuit a Dropship trying to escape. She jumped out of the system and i followed her with a wake scanner. There she was, orbiting the sun at 77% hull. Its seems that following a target without a wake scanner is quite hard/impossible but as long you have one of those it's just like exiting SC into a drop wake of any ship: you "teleport" to a location near your target.

Yeah, I know it works with a wake scanner when you follow them out of the system. I was wondering if it also worked in system without a wake scanner. Basically, I was thinking to myself (with my developer hat on) how does the game know you want to follow that specific ship vs just wanting to jump to SC (whereupon it resets your mission state to the start and spawns a new ship for you to catch/kill).

 

[Time Streamer]

Yeah, I know it works with a wake scanner when you follow them out of the system. I was wondering if it also worked in system without a wake scanner. Basically, I was thinking to myself (with my developer hat on) how does the game know you want to follow that specific ship vs just wanting to jump to SC (whereupon it resets your mission state to the start and spawns a new ship for you to catch/kill).

If you have a wake signal targeted, the game assumes you want to chase that ship when you call FSD. Is this what you were talking about?

 

[Chann3l]

You should add conflict zones to your allowable hunting grounds. You are after all at war so of course there will be plenty of enemy ships

 

[nrage]

If you have a wake signal targeted, the game assumes you want to chase that ship when you call FSD. Is this what you were talking about?

Yes. And, a wake scanner isn't really necessary for a low-wake because you already know which system it goes to

 

[Max Magic]

Okay Guys...many thanks for all your answers...didnt knew in particlar that you can target low wake signals to get into the same "instance" as your fleeing target

You should add conflict zones to your allowable hunting grounds. You are after all at war so of course there will be plenty of enemy ships

Hmmm...not sure about this !! Even CZs feels like a "farming ground" with infinite numbers of enemy ships showing up just to get destroyed by you...

if it would be so, that both sides had a limited amount of ships fighting for dominance and you could join one side to help them achieve a victory...then i would answer yes !!
But like it is now, it doesnt feel like a real battle because noone can win it

 

[Crash1099]

Hey Guys,


being relatively fresh to the game, i made good progress earning me a VULTURE within a week with solely making bounty hunting in RES and CZ...


But then i took me a minute and had the bad feeling that money came far too easy this way and that "FARMING" in those, how i call them, "artificial" instances didnt felt quite right...that it destroys immersion and finally the fun to actually PLAY the game like a lonesome Pilot, starting with a rusty ship with a handful of credits, trying desperately to make his way in this universe...


So long story, short answer: I decided to DELETE my savegame, starting from the fresh again and sweared to me that i will never ever enter such an instance again !!!


This leaves me in my starter EAGLE with:

- bounty hunting in SC
- mission running
- few tons of trading
- smuggling
- mining (painful with just the starter refinery with only one bins)

So i opened bulletin board and found 2 assasination missions in a nearby system and i took them...

...arriving into the system, i found quickly this one WANTED Guys, being also a Mission Target worth for around 70k credits plus extra money for his bounty (a fortune for me when playing the game like this)...and he flew a VIPER only !!!
From my first savegame i had some good combat experiences and knew, i can handle him when i would be able to stay on his six...so i started Frame Shift Interdiction...and here he came:

- with my 3 fixed Pulse lasers, i quickly took out his shields
- and like i thought, i was able to stay on his six, so he couldnt land a shot on me, giving me the freedom to set 4 pips in engines and 2 in weapons
- but as you alll know with LvL 1 Pulse Lasers, it takes an eternity to wear down the hull...
- so when he was at 20% Hull, he started his Frame Sift Drive...
- and with my EAGLE, i couldnt masslock him, so he managed to jump out with 16% Hull left
- i thought, doesnt matter, i will intercept him right again a second time

---> but then disaster stroke:
- Seconds after being in SC again, i identified him again, the same guy in the same ship, but he was at 100% Hull again !!! Right after entering SC, with no docking at a station in the meantime...just a wonder has happened, his hull had recovered by itsself... just lol
- So i thought, maybe a bug or a misleading number on my HUD...
- i intercepted him again, we both fall into normal space, and...
- yeah, what the hell, he was indeed at 100% Hull again !!!
- so i started shooting again, this time even more aggresive...but when he got under 30% Hull, he was trying to run again, jumped out at 12% Hull, and guess what ???

---> when i found him seconds later in SC, he was at 100% Hull again !!!!!


I mean, (sorry) is happening here ??? I quit outraged the game and are not sure whether i should start again, because it looks like, when you want to play the game "lore-friendly", those insane bugs strikes you much harder than when you just farm a fortune in a high RES in a matter of hours...


Thanks for reading Guys :S

Npc Cheat in this game plain and simple. Unlimited ammo and instant repair.

 

[CMDR Mansoul]

You either accept NPCs using "cheats" or you should look for another way to earn your money. Some major points where NPCs don't follow the same rules as you are:
- Respawn after instance switching (100% Hull)
- unlimited ammo for ballistics
- no mass lock in asteroid fields
- assassination targets may open fire on you without becoming wanted
- dropping out of FSD at max speed

That last one - you can do that too. Press J twice while at speed in SC without having another system selected. You'll take same damage as being interdicted.

 

[Forlorn]

Assasination targets behave differently than other NPCs in that they 1) never leave their assigned systems, even when high waking, and 2) get returned to fully repaired when they exit an instance.

I think these 2 are related, and hope that someday they will loosen the leash and allow us to chase them around the galaxy. Maybe then I'll have a reason to follow the other NPCs into normal space when they claim to have information for me.

 

[deMangler]

Definitely a bug even if it is a design bug rather than a code bug. I would ticket it. We need to be able to hunt NPC's across systems otherwise why have all that space?

 

[RG-870]

That last one - you can do that too. Press J twice while at speed in SC without having another system selected. You'll take same damage as being interdicted.

I'm not talking about an emergency drop which damages the hull. I'm talking about ALL NPCs approaching planets / stations at insane speed levels and then dropping out. If you follow their wake you will find them at the target station. If I would approach at such a speed I would either overshoot or have to do an emergency drop which would end up with me floating somewhere in space far away from the station. Like in my other examples the NPCs don't follow the same rules / mechanics as we players and to me that just feels cheap and breaks any immersion the game claims to create.