Ammo Regenerator: Module to improve variety of PVE builds

[zegram33]

Hi All
its always faintly bugged me that really only the high capacity weapons are useful in pve. some poor designer presumably put a lotof work into all the various torpedoes and mines and a lot of pve players will never see them


With that in mind, I'd like to see an internal module which restocked the ammo for all weapons that use it.
It would only take effect when the ammo is completely out.
It would only regen 1 clip at a time.


the regen process would take awhile (by default about 3x as long as a "standard" reload for that weapon)


whilst regenning it would have moderate heat buildup (enough that small or bad heat profile ships would struggle to use it mid combat)

most importantly: whilst regenning it would drain the SYS capacitor moderately, with draw based on the weapon its reloading

maybe have it drain a smidge of fuel a la the "plasma slug" experimental effect.




I feel like that would be balanced and allow mines/torpedoes and other weapons to be used a bit more freely when PVE bounty hunting if desirable, whilst not being SO strong that the default pvp build suddenly becomes "T10 with 9 torpedo launchers with various effects"


what do you all think?
good? bad?

 

[Lestat]

You can farm mats and synthesis your ammo. You can also mix and match your weapons so you use lasers to kills the shields while Kinetic weapons down the the armour and Modules.

 

[zegram33]

well the mats are a workable solution but is only really viable for fully endgame

mixing and matching weapons works for things like multicannons, and cannons to an extent, but not very well for dumbfire missiles, and honestly not at all for torpedoes, mines, and homing missiles

 

[varonica]

well the mats are a workable solution but is only really viable for fully endgame

There is no endgame, that's just an annoying noise as far as Elite is concerned.

With mats you can generate ammo instantly, I don't see how that isn't viable right through the game. Of course beginners won't have mats, but then in any encounter they are probably not going to survuve long enough to use up all their ammo. Mats are so easy to get, and becoming even easier with the next update that no-one will have an excuse for not having a full inventory of mats and as much ammo as they want, instantly.

 

[Lestat]

well the mats are a workable solution but is only really viable for fully endgame

You sound like a tunnel vision play style see your only focus on combat. See I have ammo coming out of my ears. But I also a Miner. So I am able to stay in the location while in combat for a long long period of times. But I earn that right to stay in that location not have an easy mode like ammo rack.

mixing and matching weapons works for things like multicannons, and cannons to an extent, but not very well for dumbfire missiles, and honestly not at all for torpedoes, mines, and homing missiles

It why I stick with lasers and Mulitcannon on my earlier builds when I was not able to use materials . But once I got my Asp Explorer I was able to Farm for materials and ores so I could do my combat session longer without returning for refills.

But the thing is I earn those refills. I use more than one game mechanic to help me.

Hay zegram33 how long have you been playing. What type of ship are you flying?

 

[Bortas]

It why I stick with lasers and Mulitcannon on my earlier builds when I was not able to use materials .

Efficient beam/OC MC is probably the one goto combination for PvE, regardless of how much materials you have lying around. MC always have higher DPS than i.e. seekers, so why use the latter and waste mats for reloads, when MCs are better anyway?

It's sad, but OP is not wrong... missiles are mostly useless for PvE, and even in PvP their use is very limited thanks to the omnipresence of TLB-plasmas.

 

[CMDR Cosmic Spacehead]

I've been trying to come up with a way to increase ammo, but only making it viable in PvE.
Ammo synthesis is expensive, making missiles inefficient in PvE.

Long reload times don't particularly matter in PvP, because you can simply rearm before your next right.

Having a larger, powered module would work to some degree, because PvPers are reluctant to lose some H/MRP space. But if it gave them a big enough advantage, they'd use it.

Maybe make an Ammo Auto Loader a bit like the SRV bay.
Each class has a set number subslots for an ammo type, you simply select what you want. There's no rating involved.
Most non-meta ammo would be quite plentiful per slot, but things like torpedoes and mines would be rather limited (probably just 1 per slot).
All reloads require hardpoints be retracted, and take 30 seconds (torpedoes take 120 seconds).

You can only have 1 Ammo Auto Loader per ship.
Power up time is slow (like the FSD), and it requires a lot of power to operate.

Or something like that. It could still end up unbalancing PvP more, mainly with torpedoes. But then FD could give them an indirect nerf by improving countermeasures against them.

 

[Tiili]

Spend 30 min hunting rocks with your SRV and visit the material trader, you'll get around 50 basic reloads for explosives.

If that is expensive, I dunno how you can afford engineering

 

[Rexoplex]

You can farm mats and synthesis your ammo. You can also mix and match your weapons so you use lasers to kills the shields while Kinetic weapons down the the armour and Modules.

This may work for most weapons, but have you ever tried using ammo synthesis to sustain shock cannons? Although tbh I'd attribute that more to shock cannons just needing more ammo, but still, synthesis recipes are inconsistent across loadouts, and every new type of ammo is more painful to make for whatever reason (see enzyme missile synthesis). It doesn't seem like a worthwhile chore just to fuel my ability to farm npcs with a more entertaining weapon.

 

[zegram33]

You sound like a tunnel vision play style see your only focus on combat. See I have ammo coming out of my ears. But I also a Miner. So I am able to stay in the location while in combat for a long long period of times. But I earn that right to stay in that location not have an easy mode like ammo rack.

It why I stick with lasers and Mulitcannon on my earlier builds when I was not able to use materials . But once I got my Asp Explorer I was able to Farm for materials and ores so I could do my combat session longer without returning for refills.

But the thing is I earn those refills. I use more than one game mechanic to help me.

Hay zegram33 how long have you been playing. What type of ship are you flying?

Been playing since the ps4 release, fly a T9, T10, or Anaconda for serious missions and a crusader for more fun/bounty hunting with friends.

Im primarily a trader and explorer, elite trader, mid level for both combat and exploring.

and im glad that mining gets you ammo, but having only 1playstyle out of 4 or 5 supply any sort of the mats for ammo is just weird design, if I could buy ammo components with my trade proceeds I wouldnt mind so much, but iron is apparently so rare that nowhere in the galaxy sells it.
you also straight up cant ever craft torpedo ammo, which was a significant part of what I mentioned at the top, and crafting refills for more than 1 explosive weapon become prohibitively expensive real fast.

like I said, whilst this would work for multicannons and frags in a pinch, the idea is more about bringing the very rarely used pve weapons into a state where they are a competitive alternative in pve play.

currently you absolutely can mine out mats to resupply your seeker missile rack, but doing so is less efficient in pretty much all regards than just bolting another laser on.
its not like every weapon needs to have the exact same effect in every situation, but a rough parity is just good design


EDIT after looking at CSH's ammo crafting topic, what would you all say to them just making an even lower tier ammo type?
so call it "mass produced", it draws straight from fuel, has -10% dmg
AND has some form of penalty...maybe experimental effects don't trigger when this ammo type is used? or maybe has a chance to "jam" like damaged weapons do even if the weapon is at full durability?

 

[Jaylem]

Efficient beam/OC MC is probably the one goto combination for PvE, regardless of how much materials you have lying around. MC always have higher DPS than i.e. seekers, so why use the latter and waste mats for reloads, when MCs are better anyway?

It's sad, but OP is not wrong... missiles are mostly useless for PvE, and even in PvP their use is very limited thanks to the omnipresence of TLB-plasmas.

In regards to OP, the idea brings a little promise for those unwilling to use their materials ( I alone cry for many hours on end after using grade 1 materials to synthesize ) for this the ammo regeneration rack sounds good, however it would make Synthesis basic pretty much obsolete.

My take on it is that it should be specific to guardian weapons, as with the new AXCZ, it is rather hard to survive the scenario without synthesising anything, for Thargoid content in general, basilisk and up you will be synthesising SOMETHING, be that heatsinks, ammo or limpets. It would be nice to have one less thing to worry about for this aspect of the game. especially due to the fact their ammo consumes Guardian Materials, which are many lightyears out of the way and I simply cannot be stuffed going out there every time I want to have a bit of expanded pew pew.

In regards to your post Bortas, I agree missiles ain't the best, but if you engineer a Pack hound with expanded ammo and time your shots, she can easily last you 30min in a CZ! TLB APA's are amazing! but really for PvP, NPCs tend to be immune to it it seems.

 

[MK Regular]

I've been trying to come up with a way to increase ammo, but only making it viable in PvE.
Ammo synthesis is expensive, making missiles inefficient in PvE.

Long reload times don't particularly matter in PvP, because you can simply rearm before your next right.

Having a larger, powered module would work to some degree, because PvPers are reluctant to lose some H/MRP space. But if it gave them a big enough advantage, they'd use it.

Maybe make an Ammo Auto Loader a bit like the SRV bay.
Each class has a set number subslots for an ammo type, you simply select what you want. There's no rating involved.
Most non-meta ammo would be quite plentiful per slot, but things like torpedoes and mines would be rather limited (probably just 1 per slot).
All reloads require hardpoints be retracted, and take 30 seconds (torpedoes take 120 seconds).

You can only have 1 Ammo Auto Loader per ship.
Power up time is slow (like the FSD), and it requires a lot of power to operate.

Or something like that. It could still end up unbalancing PvP more, mainly with torpedoes. But then FD could give them an indirect nerf by improving countermeasures against them.

So, like an AFMU for ammo? I'd be down for that.

What would we call it though, an Auto Field Resupply Unit? Yeah, AFRU works....