Analysis of Diso and Trading Community Goals from a profit perspective

[stoicfury]

A guaranteed 50 tons of Diso Ma Corn from one stop is a pretty good reward.

I don't know where you're buying the corn, but it wasn't 50 stock when I checked after the CG ended.

The absolute number of participants is irrelevant. "Enough" is the self evident answer to how many participated on a CG that completed all tiers.

You still don't get it. I've said this many times: you cannot say the participation is "enough" if you A) don't know what kind of participation Frontier wants and B) how many people actually participated. It does not follow that you can determine participation was "enough" from the mere fact that a CG completed, or because it did so faster than usual. The craziest thing about our little back and forth argument on this is that it was never a claim of mine that CG participation is not enough. I actually agree with you -- I think CG participation is probably fine (but I admit I can't know absolutely for the same reasons I'm telling you). My post is about CG profits vs. regular trading; I only had that section on participation before to highlight the fact that participation rates will tend to drop when people realize more and more that it's not beneficial to them to stick around grinding to the top tiers.

People being indifferent to the sociopolitical or historical aspects of the CGs is, in my opinion, not any excuse what so ever to make the CG's worth while from a pure credit standpoint. Of course, in game, the factions behind these CG's should be offering incentives in accordance with their needs and abilities, which may need to take the public appeal, or lack thereof, of these aspects into account.

To be clear, I never said CG's should be worthwhile from a profit standpoint because people may be ignorant to the underlying backstory. The only point I've been trying to get across in my post is simply that from a profit standpoint there is no reason to spend much effort to get beyond Tier C while the payout goals remain the same and you already have a decent trading route.

 

[Morbad]

I don't know where you're buying the corn, but it wasn't 50 stock when I checked after the CG ended.

It's fifty now, first time, every time (assuming you got rid of your prior allocation). It did take a few hours after the end of the CG for the new allocation to show up.

 

[stoicfury]

Thanks, and you are totally correct. It's less about how CG's should be done and more of an info piece on the profitability of them for people interested in trading and maximizing profts (which seems to be a lot of people).

I also recorded participation data, but it's pretty boring so I didn't bother reporting out on it. Basically: as a CG reaches its end, more and more people participate in it.

 

[Ben Ryder]

You really didnt need a spreadsheet. Just complete a few community goals and you'll work out what's best for you.

And the analysis does not account for play style and combined saving, for example I missed the Zanonce goal and purchased a new basic Python (for the insurance break and because I love it), an Anaconda (dont forget the insurance break on this one either), a Viper and a Side winder at Zaonce and then flew off to Diso in a Cobra from the Founders world to participate at level 1 in the CG and now get a month of 80000 runs to fit out the python back to how it was. Delivered something like 100 tonnes of combine harvesters and 'made' / saved several million in two three hour sessions.

The benefits of the goals go to everyone not just a single person. You make more by participating. If no body does the goals, that profit is completely lost along with game play.

You're right its not about just the money.

+1 for the thread.

 

[stoicfury]

You really didnt need a spreadsheet. Just complete a few community goals and you'll work out what's best for you.

You are correct in the sense that I had a pretty good idea of what to expect going in having done a few of these now, but as a scientist personality type (literally) I can never live with myself relying merely on intuition; I needed hard numbers!

Thanks for the rep!

 

[Ben Ryder]

You are correct in the sense that I had a pretty good idea of what to expect going in having done a few of these now, but as a scientist personality type (literally) I can never live with myself relying merely on intuition; I needed hard numbers!

Thanks for the rep!

I love numbers and evidence and stuffs! A point held up by Science. Good job!

 

[masopa]

I'll bet FD have a goldmine of data to play with from the CGs so far: each one has been quite different in approach (in my opinion) and by also playing about with the percentile rewards, as well as the crank-up through the tiers, I'll be they're having some fun identifying what makes people join and when. Sadly we're looking through a very murky window into their world of data, getting by through cobbling together snapshots of the participation over time and guessing as to what was achieved within that top percentile band.

Still, it's good fun aside from the whole "optimise profit" perspective... and as Ben Ryder says, some of the global rewards are fantastic, especially this latest 16% discount!

 

[NullAndVoid]

Great analysis, I thought the rewards for both Diso and Zaonce were very reasonable versus time spent and enjoyed participating as opposed to doing your own thing.

 

[Tuub t Tute]

Maybe the "Community" aspect of CGs needs to be factored in. Some super traders might be altruistic enough to look at a CG and think "I'll make sure that one succeeds" which then gives the reward to the community as a whole?

16% on a Conda is not much to a multi-millionaire with an A Conda already. The trickle down to people grinding for Pythons and Condas, to get out of their Lakons has been immense

 

[Quineloe]

Maybe the "Community" aspect of CGs needs to be factored in. Some super traders might be altruistic enough to look at a CG and think "I'll make sure that one succeeds" which then gives the reward to the community as a whole?

16% on a Conda is not much to a multi-millionaire with an A Conda already. The trickle down to people grinding for Pythons and Condas, to get out of their Lakons has been immense

disagree, I rebought both my Python and my Anaconda after Zaonce because I got a lot of money out of it right away and permanently lowered insurance rebuy on both ships.

 

[bsnaylor]

Nice analysis. Ignore the "yeah but I can make more doing..." comments stuff, we all know that.
Like a lot of people I do it for the competition, fun and to help others in the community. (I'm an 0ld sk00l Eliter and I have more Cr than I could possibly use, but love the ability to do what ever I like with and within the game)
I can see as you said, that you too love helping the community, and using your analytical skills
Keep it up. (& +1 ofc)
ps, I'm always open to wing assistance for anyone doing runs or whatever, feel free to add/PM me here.

 

[Tuub t Tute]

disagree, I rebought both my Python and my Anaconda after Zaonce because I got a lot of money out of it right away and permanently lowered insurance rebuy on both ships.

I think we are at cross-purposes. I was floating a theory out there that perhaps some of the participants who were top 5%, flying 50k tons of cargo or whatever, might have thought it cool to complete the CG to give something back to the community.

That was why I said "some" and not "all" I managed enough for top 70% and really only participated, because I thought I needed to have joined in to get the ship discounts. So I am in the same camp as you, that I was there for me primarily and not as some Daddy Warbucks philanthropist!

I should have enough to buy a cheap Python shell before the discount ends. Then wait and see what the Dback is all about in 1.3 and decide if I want to buy one.

 

[dreamer1986]

That was why I said "some" and not "all" I managed enough for top 70% and really only participated, because I thought I needed to have joined in to get the ship discounts.

Wait, Ship Discounts? What ship discounts and on what ships?

 

[masopa]

Maybe the "Community" aspect of CGs needs to be factored in. Some super traders might be altruistic enough to look at a CG and think "I'll make sure that one succeeds" which then gives the reward to the community as a whole?

16% on a Conda is not much to a multi-millionaire with an A Conda already. The trickle down to people grinding for Pythons and Condas, to get out of their Lakons has been immense

I'm not sure and individual or even a small group of individuals could really have that much of an impact on a contribution, especially for a trade CG. Ultimately we're all capped by the cargo capacity of our ships which for me is an Annie and for a supertrader would be an Annie or a T9... so although I don't consider myself a supertrader, I can still (more or less) generate the same contribution as the aforementioned "supertrader"... as can any Annie/T9 owner.

If I ground out 10 hours of trading for a CG, let's call that 7 round trips with 500ish (just under) tonnes... so 35k tonnes contributed. That is WAAAY into the top 5% but still only 0.2% of the total goal - hardly shifting things much.

I guess the whole point is it's a community goal so individuals or small groups shouldn't be able to shift it much - it requires a combined, community effort. Which is good.