Another game that doesn't want to be played.

(crosspost from my Google Plus page, .)

I haven't found the strength to play this game for about three weeks. Here's why.

I was stupid enough to be suckered into premium beta, lured by the shiny promises of blazing my own trail in a living, evolving galaxy that would react to player action.

Man was I dumb; maybe hypnotised by Braben's ever-moving hands, maybe just starving for a good game in the genre.

Frontier nailed it with the very core feeling of the game, that much I give them. Flying a ship seems (lack of boring "realistic" flight model notwithstanding) real, graphically it's nice, and audio is about the best games have had to date. Sadly, the good things and, most importantly, promises end there. What Frontier managed to fail at, and quite exceptionally so, was that whole "trailblazing" part, or to implement pretty much anything written down in their proposed designs exceeding a product that could be sold without getting sued into the ground for deceptive business practices.

Because you see, the game is little more than a dead spreadsheet. There I said it, it's EVE (which I played for about half a year and absolutely loathed for its promotion of grief to core gameplay and bottom-of-the-lake community), just with direct controls and half-hearted opt-out from the multiplayer aspect. Apart from changes in political ownership, the galaxy doesn't change, unless someone at Frontier sits down and manually writes things into existence based on soothsaying player statistics. There's nothing directly engaging a player. In the "core game", you have the choice of combat (go out and shoot the same things over and over again), trading (go out and trade the same things over and over again, if you want to be "good" at it you just get a premade route from the web!), or exploration where you go really far out so you won't encounter other ships, look at varyingly shiny round things over and over again, hope you don't crash into inconveniently double-parked stars, and eventually fly back and click a button to get credits for the privilege. If you want to play with friends, combat is just about the only viable thing, and it takes a very special mind to do exploration for any significant duration. Oh, all the stations you encounter will look about the same too, so inhabited space isn't vastly more exciting than the vastness of procedurally generated nothing.

The "Powerplay" update was supposed to change that by introducing even more faction mechanics; the game already had three major factions and more minor factions than one could shake a stick at, but apparently Frontier realised that those were so utterly boring and fundamentally unfit to serve as game mechanics that they had to build a third, almost orthogonal, set of factions, called "Powers".

What happened was grind. You gain rank with those factions by going to some place, let's call it "A" because there's nothing inherently exciting about it anyway, load up your ship with tonnes of "stuff" (again nothing exciting), ferry it to place "B", and unload it to gain "merits". Not credits, mind you, because credits would be generally useful, and a fun new gameplay element can't have that. The general goal of a player is then to optimise their experience by making sure that "A" and "B" are as close to each other as possible, because you need to do that procedure a lot. Oh, the "stuff" is rate limited, so you can only buy a certain amount per time, e.g., 10 per half-hour, so you have a strong time sink component on top of your grind. Terrific. Anyway, to what end would you do a less profitable and far less interesting version of trade, you ask? To make some numbers go up. If you trawl the menus long enough you may even find exciting barcharts!

"So I only play for a couple hours a week," you say, "surely the game will keep me entertained that long."

You can do that, but you see, the game doesn't like you having other activities to spend time on. Remember those merits from earlier? If you don't manage to meet or exceed the amount you had last week, you will lose rank with the faction you did all that time sinking grind for. Cool, eh? That's first-rate motivation right there! Nice progress you made, would be a shame if anything happened to it! Now get off your behind and ship that "stuff", lazy fatso! The same, though to a lesser degree, goes for reputation with the major factions. So ultimately you aren't as much "blazing a trail" as you are trying to maintain a muddy path that gets washed out by torrential rain every Friday.

Ultimately, it's a game that is built around all the things that define grind, presents a shiny but at the same time bland, dead galaxy, absolutely loathes casual players, and wasted a lot of talent in its making.
 
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I agree with you for the most part, but i really disagree with you on exploration.

Exploration unlike what many non-explorers claim, isn't the same stuff over and over again.
If you really set out for exploring with a mindset for it, you will see everything is different, maybe similar, but no systems alike.
 
To maintain PP ranks 1-4 it doesnt take much time each week.
They lowered the grind significantly in the last patches.
With casual play you can accumulate enough credits for bigger ships.
 
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I agree with you for the most part, but i really disagree with you on exploration.

Exploration unlike what many non-explorers claim, isn't the same stuff over and over again.
If you really set out for exploring with a mindset for it, you will see everything is different, maybe similar, but no systems alike.
Disagree. Small differences, but mostly the same thing with slight variances.

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Whiners,to maintain PP ranks 1-4 it doesnt take much time each week.
They lowered the grind significantly in the last patches.
With casual play you can accumulate enough credits for bigger ships.

You whiners are boring if you hate the game stop pesting us who still enjoy it.
Not among the whingers however it's still grinding with not much depth to it. Not to mention the PP point thing is a mess. having to reach the same amount of points each week just to maintain rank is silly and lack of foresight on the developers part. It means I can't take time away from the game without all my previous efforts being wasted.
 
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I agree with you. I am also having trouble getting back into the game and I am somewhere far away from colonized space. Luckily I have to read something for my work, and soon I will play some more, while reading, because I wouldn't have the patience to explore otherwise.
 
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Disagree. Small differences, but mostly the same thing with slight variances.

- - - Updated - - -


Not among the whingers however it's still grinding with not much depth to it. Not to mention the PP point thing is a mess. having to reach the same amount of points each week just to maintain rank is silly and lack of foresight on the developers part. It means I can't take time away from the game without all my previous efforts being wasted.

But you don't have to reach the same amount each week. Just enough to 'top up' after the decay. Maintaining 1500 merits for Rank 4 maybe only requires a few hundred a week? Maybe an hour or two of undermining?

Granted it's still a grind if you do it all in one go but once it's done you can go and do whatever you want if maintaining rank is all you care about.
 
(crosspost from my Google Plus page,.)

I haven't found the strength to play this game for about three weeks. Here's why.

I was stupid enough to be suckered into premium beta, lured by the shiny promises of blazing my own trail in a living, evolving galaxy that would react to player action.

Man was I dumb; maybe hypnotised by Braben's ever-moving hands, maybe just starving for a good game in the genre.

Frontier nailed it with the very core feeling of the game, that much I give them. Flying a ship seems (lack of boring "realistic" flight model notwithstanding) real, graphically it's nice, and audio is about the best games have had to date. Sadly, the good things and, most importantly, promises end there. What Frontier managed to fail at, and quite exceptionally so, was that whole "trailblazing" part, or to implement pretty much anything written down in their proposed designs exceeding a product that could be sold without getting sued into the ground for deceptive business practices.

Because you see, the game is little more than a dead spreadsheet. There I said it, it's EVE (which I played for about half a year and absolutely loathed for its promotion of grief to core gameplay and bottom-of-the-lake community), just with direct controls and half-hearted opt-out from the multiplayer aspect. Apart from changes in political ownership, the galaxy doesn't change, unless someone at Frontier sits down and manually writes things into existence based on soothsaying player statistics. There's nothing directly engaging a player. In the "core game", you have the choice of combat (go out and shoot the same things over and over again), trading (go out and trade the same things over and over again, if you want to be "good" at it you just get a premade route from the web!), or exploration where you go really far out so you won't encounter other ships, look at varyingly shiny round things over and over again, hope you don't crash into inconveniently double-parked stars, and eventually fly back and click a button to get credits for the privilege. If you want to play with friends, combat is just about the only viable thing, and it takes a very special mind to do exploration for any significant duration. Oh, all the stations you encounter will look about the same too, so inhabited space isn't vastly more exciting than the vastness of procedurally generated nothing.

The "Powerplay" update was supposed to change that by introducing even more faction mechanics; the game already had three major factions and more minor factions than one could shake a stick at, but apparently Frontier realised that those were so utterly boring and fundamentally unfit to serve as game mechanics that they had to build a third, almost orthogonal, set of factions, called "Powers".

What happened was grind. You gain rank with those factions by going to some place, let's call it "A" because there's nothing inherently exciting about it anyway, load up your ship with tonnes of "stuff" (again nothing exciting), ferry it to place "B", and unload it to gain "merits". Not credits, mind you, because credits would be generally useful, and a fun new gameplay element can't have that. The general goal of a player is then to optimise their experience by making sure that "A" and "B" are as close to each other as possible, because you need to do that procedure a lot. Oh, the "stuff" is rate limited, so you can only buy a certain amount per time, e.g., 10 per half-hour, so you have a strong time sink component on top of your grind. Terrific. Anyway, to what end would you do a less profitable and far less interesting version of trade, you ask? To make some numbers go up. If you trawl the menus long enough you may even find exciting barcharts!

"So I only play for a couple hours a week," you say, "surely the game will keep me entertained that long."

You can do that, but you see, the game doesn't like you having other activities to spend time on. Remember those merits from earlier? If you don't manage to meet or exceed the amount you had last week, you will lose rank with the faction you did all that time sinking grind for. Cool, eh? That's first-rate motivation right there! Nice progress you made, would be a shame if anything happened to it! Now get off your behind and ship that "stuff", lazy fatso! The same, though to a lesser degree, goes for reputation with the major factions. So ultimately you aren't as much "blazing a trail" as you are trying to maintain a muddy path that gets washed out by torrential rain every Friday.

Ultimately, it's a game that is built around all the things that define grind, presents a shiny but at the same time bland, dead galaxy, absolutely loathes casual players, and wasted a lot of talent in its making.

Yeah there are different ways to play this game, thats for sure. Since you talk of PP; its a bit pleasant to hear some discomfort; it appears Power mongering won't be the anticipated 'walk over'.
 
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Relax, sit back. This isn't a game to binge out on, stuff your face and then fart the evening away.

This is a game to admire, to pick at, to savour. Appreciate and enjoy every aspect of the game. Personally, I find that big ships are clumsy so I fly the perfectly formed smaller ships and enjoy every minute of immersion in the game.

Elite has never been a game focused on the destination, from the ground-breaking open-world origins of the 1980s original to the current state-of-the-art incarnation. Take a step, look around, feel the heat of a new star on your skin, reflect upon the changing starscape as you traverse the galaxy. Then take your second step...

This game is about the journey, not the destination. There are goals that you can set yourself, but after each goal is achieved, there is a new challenge. Open your mind and reap the rewards of your imagination.
 
(crosspost from my Google Plus page, .)

I haven't found the strength to play this game for about three weeks. Here's why.

I was stupid enough to be suckered into premium beta, lured by the shiny promises of blazing my own trail in a living, evolving galaxy that would react to player action.

Man was I dumb; maybe hypnotised by Braben's ever-moving hands, maybe just starving for a good game in the genre.

Frontier nailed it with the very core feeling of the game, that much I give them. Flying a ship seems (lack of boring "realistic" flight model notwithstanding) real, graphically it's nice, and audio is about the best games have had to date. Sadly, the good things and, most importantly, promises end there. What Frontier managed to fail at, and quite exceptionally so, was that whole "trailblazing" part, or to implement pretty much anything written down in their proposed designs exceeding a product that could be sold without getting sued into the ground for deceptive business practices.

Because you see, the game is little more than a dead spreadsheet. There I said it, it's EVE (which I played for about half a year and absolutely loathed for its promotion of grief to core gameplay and bottom-of-the-lake community), just with direct controls and half-hearted opt-out from the multiplayer aspect. Apart from changes in political ownership, the galaxy doesn't change, unless someone at Frontier sits down and manually writes things into existence based on soothsaying player statistics. There's nothing directly engaging a player. In the "core game", you have the choice of combat (go out and shoot the same things over and over again), trading (go out and trade the same things over and over again, if you want to be "good" at it you just get a premade route from the web!), or exploration where you go really far out so you won't encounter other ships, look at varyingly shiny round things over and over again, hope you don't crash into inconveniently double-parked stars, and eventually fly back and click a button to get credits for the privilege. If you want to play with friends, combat is just about the only viable thing, and it takes a very special mind to do exploration for any significant duration. Oh, all the stations you encounter will look about the same too, so inhabited space isn't vastly more exciting than the vastness of procedurally generated nothing.

The "Powerplay" update was supposed to change that by introducing even more faction mechanics; the game already had three major factions and more minor factions than one could shake a stick at, but apparently Frontier realised that those were so utterly boring and fundamentally unfit to serve as game mechanics that they had to build a third, almost orthogonal, set of factions, called "Powers".

What happened was grind. You gain rank with those factions by going to some place, let's call it "A" because there's nothing inherently exciting about it anyway, load up your ship with tonnes of "stuff" (again nothing exciting), ferry it to place "B", and unload it to gain "merits". Not credits, mind you, because credits would be generally useful, and a fun new gameplay element can't have that. The general goal of a player is then to optimise their experience by making sure that "A" and "B" are as close to each other as possible, because you need to do that procedure a lot. Oh, the "stuff" is rate limited, so you can only buy a certain amount per time, e.g., 10 per half-hour, so you have a strong time sink component on top of your grind. Terrific. Anyway, to what end would you do a less profitable and far less interesting version of trade, you ask? To make some numbers go up. If you trawl the menus long enough you may even find exciting barcharts!

"So I only play for a couple hours a week," you say, "surely the game will keep me entertained that long."

You can do that, but you see, the game doesn't like you having other activities to spend time on. Remember those merits from earlier? If you don't manage to meet or exceed the amount you had last week, you will lose rank with the faction you did all that time sinking grind for. Cool, eh? That's first-rate motivation right there! Nice progress you made, would be a shame if anything happened to it! Now get off your behind and ship that "stuff", lazy fatso! The same, though to a lesser degree, goes for reputation with the major factions. So ultimately you aren't as much "blazing a trail" as you are trying to maintain a muddy path that gets washed out by torrential rain every Friday.

Ultimately, it's a game that is built around all the things that define grind, presents a shiny but at the same time bland, dead galaxy, absolutely loathes casual players, and wasted a lot of talent in its making.

Thiiiissss!!!! I thought it was an EVEisch thing too... EVE is wonderful but wanted to fly my ship. So I saw Elite. Then I was very very very happy and directly bought the beta. And now I'm... Disappointed... It hurts.
 
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Another game that doesn't want to be played.

I disagree with you for the most part, and for the other part too.
Mostly because those who grind seem to complain about grinding.
I just do what comes to mind. Sometimes it is even absurd stuff like bounty hunting in a T9.

Also from the way you formulate your complaints I conclude you don't seem to realize that this is a huge project in the midst of development. Soooo much will be added, changed, tweaked etc. etc.

The main reason I disagree with you is that I am just fed up with the neverending negative, whining tone that pierces my eardrums in threads like this.

I have made many suggestions for tweaks and changes myself, multiple dozens at least, but never, ever did I resort to the use of whining, repeated neverending nonconstructive whining.

It is entirely possible that this is just not the game for you and never will be. In that case... good bye.
 
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you lost me when you said its like Eve. "This sausge is like a Car minus the Doors and stuff" Yeah... sure.

And it wants to be played, but you have to keep in mind that not everybdoy will like every Game. That its not for you does not mean its for nobody.
 
If people need to use spreadsheets to play a game, no matter the mechanics they will find a way to play the game using spreadsheets. Especially any games that require the collection of some resources to acquire stuff in the game.

Me personally I just fly about blowing stuff up, completing missions and then occasionally venture out into the deep dark black of the galaxy to discover a few things. Still need to find my first earth type planet no spread sheet going to help me there.

Thank to massive decrease in graphics popping for me, with a slight increase in stuttering for me, fix one problem create another the bain of every programmer life or at least it is with me and the ones I know. The mystery surrounding UA, I want my own UA to play with, I have been playing it more than ever, .


trading (go out and trade the same things over and over again, if you want to be "good" at it you just get a premade route from the web!)
What the point of playing a game if you just going to run off to the web. One of the biggest points with elite is that you got to fly your ship and explore space around you to discover profitable trade routes, which actually do over time end up becoming less profitable, I have had several go that way. One of the best times I had in the game is when I discovered a rare good by simply just flying around.

Powerplay is completely optional, you don't have to take part in it if you don't want to. An Powerplay was introduce the first wave of Tier 1 NPC Characters, as per the design documents.
 
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This sums up my feelings about the entire game right now.

It's grind and believe it or not, there are people around here who will try to pin that as a personal fault of yours while excusing the game from any valid criticism.

As all games it only feels like a grind if you set your goal as being obtain elite as quick as possible or to obtain a anaconda in the shortest amount of time because of some believe that the best ship in the game is the most expensive, biggest ship in the game. Whilsts that true of most games, it certainly isn't true in elite, the best pilot really do tend to win even if they aren't in the best ship with the best equipment and the biggest, meanest weapons around.
 
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