Engineers ARSENIC : We are NOT being short changed !

[dognosh]

Don't know why, but every time I go on the hunt for Arsenic, I think the amount I pick up isn't representative of the amount(in %) we get in the SYS Map info.
I then thought is there another factor that makes me think that I am being short changed ?
Well, there was no 2 ways about it, time to do a mini survey.

I landed on a world that has 2.4% Arsenic(GRADE 3) , 2.0% Cadmium(GRADE 4) & 1.7% Niobium(GRADE 3). I shot at every Ore I came across and after 500 mat pickups(or logged,if not picked up) my mini, not so scientifically (or statistically correct) results were :

Arsenic 3.9% actual(2.4%)
Cadmium 5.5% actual(2.0%)
Niobium 6.7% actual(1.7%)

Arsenic was around +60% margin of error , Cadmium +175% & Niobium +295%.
These tally with my previous experiences of noticing lots of other G3 & G4 mats when hunting Arsenic.

Conclusion : Arsenic looks rarer than it should be because of the abundance of other similar,or higher grade, materials. In actual fact it is dropping at the correct amount.

 

[crispydog]

Don't know why, but every time I go on the hunt for Arsenic, I think the amount I pick up isn't representative of the amount(in %) we get in the SYS Map info.
I then thought is there another factor that makes me think that I am being short changed ?
Well, there was no 2 ways about it, time to do a mini survey.

I landed on a world that has 2.4% Arsenic(GRADE 3) , 2.0% Cadmium(GRADE 4) & 1.7% Niobium(GRADE 3). I shot at every Ore I came across and after 500 mat pickups(or logged,if not picked up) my mini, not so scientifically (or statistically correct) results were :

Arsenic 3.9% actual(2.4%)
Cadmium 5.5% actual(2.0%)
Niobium 6.7% actual(1.7%)

Arsenic was around +60% margin of error , Cadmium +175% & Niobium +295%.
These tally with my previous experiences of noticing lots of other G3 & G4 mats when hunting Arsenic.

Conclusion : Arsenic looks rarer than it should be because of the abundance of other similar,or higher grade, materials. In actual fact it is dropping at the correct amount.

well said. a 1 in 40 drop rate FEELS like it isn't happening at all...

 

[Xious]

I've had great luck finding arsenic on Pemoeri B 5.

 

[jijik2]

Arsenic galore, mostly every time i go to a planet with 2% and up.
I find some and just relog and drive a bit find some more, and relog. Maybe its just my head that thinks relog helps. But still it worked for me

 

[AktiveNudel]

There's a much better way to find arsenic. Here's the link to my thread in the PS4 forum.
https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showthread.php/366376-FSD-Jump-Range-Rolling-The-Definitive-Guide

 

[dognosh]

There's a much better way to find arsenic. Here's the link to my thread in the PS4 forum.
https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showthread.php/366376-FSD-Jump-Range-Rolling-The-Definitive-Guide

+1 rep , good thread
This wasn't about finding Arsenic, but the percentages and amount on Planetary surfaces

 

[goemon]

Conclusion : Arsenic looks rarer than it should be because of the abundance of other similar,or higher grade, materials. In actual fact it is dropping at the correct amount.

actually, you can source a better arsenic source by looking at the relative percentage of materials of the same grade (or higher grades from the same sources as arsenic). high arsenic percentage, low other percentages. that said, i shoot barnacles for arsenic or go mining (if i like to mine).

 

[Stinja]

a 1 in 40 drop rate FEELS like it isn't happening at all...

This is my main problem with collecting materials the "proper way", it's so unsatisfying.

Drive your SRV randomly and hope a RNG signal appears on your scanner; drive towards said signal (assuming it's the type you want); shoot the rock; pray to RNG for the mat you want; repeat.

When our ships have a DSS system that can analyse moons from 20Ls, with a scan that can detect the composition, the actual minerals, and their rarity - why can we not get a mini-version of that on our SRV?
Or fly our ships at low orbit to detect clumps / veins of minerals of the same type?
Or fire prospector drones out?

Maybe the numbers are correct statistically, but when you're on a 9% Chromium moon and get more arsenic drops in a session, something feels wrong.

Oh and don't get me started on Bromellite mining...

 

[Morbad]

The reason it feels like arsenic is rare is because it's not concentrated in metallic meteorites like most other rare elements, probably because it's not a metal.

It's much easier to find rare elements that do tend to be concentrated in certain types of rocks, but arsenic seems to be spread almost evenly between them.

 

[AktiveNudel]

but arsenic seems to be spread almost evenly between them

I've got some numbers to back this up:

Mixed nodes: 98
Arsenic drops: 21
Mixed drop chance: 21.42%

Node-specific drop chances

Bronzite Chrondite: 10%
Mesosiderite: 40.63%
Outcrop: 11.11%
Metallic Meteorite: 25%

Note that the sample size for outcrop and metallic meteorites is quite small and therefore the percentages are probably inaccurate.

 

[dognosh]

I've got some numbers to back this up:

Mixed nodes: 98
Arsenic drops: 21
Mixed drop chance: 21.42%

Node-specific drop chances

Bronzite Chrondite: 10%
Mesosiderite: 40.63%
Outcrop: 11.11%
Metallic Meteorite: 25%

Note that the sample size for outcrop and metallic meteorites is quite small and therefore the percentages are probably inaccurate.

All your samples, I can probably agree with, except 1 of them :
My experience --->>> Metallic Meteorite: 0 (ZERO)

I have NEVER seen Arsenic out of an MM , just now I found(in 15 mins) 7 MM, out came tons of Ruthenium, Cadmium & Niobium, but no Arsenic.
(I would guess I have seen 30-40 MM in the last 3 or 4 days)

 

[Devari]

Don't know why, but every time I go on the hunt for Arsenic, I think the amount I pick up isn't representative of the amount(in %) we get in the SYS Map info.
I then thought is there another factor that makes me think that I am being short changed ?
Well, there was no 2 ways about it, time to do a mini survey.

I landed on a world that has 2.4% Arsenic(GRADE 3) , 2.0% Cadmium(GRADE 4) & 1.7% Niobium(GRADE 3). I shot at every Ore I came across and after 500 mat pickups(or logged,if not picked up) my mini, not so scientifically (or statistically correct) results were :

Arsenic 3.9% actual(2.4%)
Cadmium 5.5% actual(2.0%)
Niobium 6.7% actual(1.7%)

Arsenic was around +60% margin of error , Cadmium +175% & Niobium +295%.
These tally with my previous experiences of noticing lots of other G3 & G4 mats when hunting Arsenic.

Conclusion : Arsenic looks rarer than it should be because of the abundance of other similar,or higher grade, materials. In actual fact it is dropping at the correct amount.

Part of the issue is that collecting mat isn't just pure RNG, if you know how and where to look on planets you can increase your chances of certain drops significantly. Usually rough terrain (craters, valleys, etc.) is much better for higher-grade drops and the areas around mountains are particularly high-yield. Flat planes are usually the lowest, giving much more common mats, and this can reduce your chances of good drops significantly. If you're not familiar with how the terrain affects mat gathering you can easily spend most of your time in an area that has low-quality mats and get frustrated. Conversely, if you know what you're doing you can raise your chances of rare mats significantly above the overall statistical averages listed on the planet info tab. Not to mention that knowing how to read the scanner properly allows you specifically seek out the higher-grade rocks, so most players are also biasing the drop rates that way as well. I suspect if you landed randomly on different areas of the planet (i.e., a representative sample of the terrain) and went in a spiral pattern and shot every single rock on your scanner you'd find the statistical results were much closer to the stated drop rates.

 

[dognosh]

Part of the issue is that collecting mat isn't just pure RNG, if you know how and where to look on planets you can increase your chances of certain drops significantly. Usually rough terrain (craters, valleys, etc.) is much better for higher-grade drops and the areas around mountains are particularly high-yield. Flat planes are usually the lowest, giving much more common mats, and this can reduce your chances of good drops significantly. If you're not familiar with how the terrain affects mat gathering you can easily spend most of your time in an area that has low-quality mats and get frustrated. Conversely, if you know what you're doing you can raise your chances of rare mats significantly above the overall statistical averages listed on the planet info tab. Not to mention that knowing how to read the scanner properly allows you specifically seek out the higher-grade rocks, so most players are also biasing the drop rates that way as well. I suspect if you landed randomly on different areas of the planet (i.e., a representative sample of the terrain) and went in a spiral pattern and shot every single rock on your scanner you'd find the statistical results were much closer to the stated drop rates.

That actually made a lot of sense

 

[Red Anders]

All your samples, I can probably agree with, except 1 of them :
My experience --->>> Metallic Meteorite: 0 (ZERO)

I have NEVER seen Arsenic out of an MM , just now I found(in 15 mins) 7 MM, out came tons of Ruthenium, Cadmium & Niobium, but no Arsenic.
(I would guess I have seen 30-40 MM in the last 3 or 4 days)

That's RNG for you. It definitely spawns in them and to be honest my own experience is broadly comparable with his figures.

Part of the issue is that collecting mat isn't just pure RNG, if you know how and where to look on planets you can increase your chances of certain drops significantly. Usually rough terrain (craters, valleys, etc.) is much better for higher-grade drops and the areas around mountains are particularly high-yield. Flat planes are usually the lowest, giving much more common mats, and this can reduce your chances of good drops significantly. If you're not familiar with how the terrain affects mat gathering you can easily spend most of your time in an area that has low-quality mats and get frustrated. Conversely, if you know what you're doing you can raise your chances of rare mats significantly above the overall statistical averages listed on the planet info tab. Not to mention that knowing how to read the scanner properly allows you specifically seek out the higher-grade rocks, so most players are also biasing the drop rates that way as well. I suspect if you landed randomly on different areas of the planet (i.e., a representative sample of the terrain) and went in a spiral pattern and shot every single rock on your scanner you'd find the statistical results were much closer to the stated drop rates.

This also. Those horrible to drive over bumpy little dunes around the base of larger hills and mountains tend to be a particularly profitable source of rarer materials. I've assumed it's a rudimentary balancing mechanic to stop you just screaming across a totally flat plain and syphoning up loads of rare stuff.

 

[Morbad]

I've assumed it's a rudimentary balancing mechanic to stop you just screaming across a totally flat plain and syphoning up loads of rare stuff.

I think it's as much geological consideration than a balance one. Metallic meteorites are much more common around the edges and in the vicinity of craters, while rough terrain has more outcrops, etc.

I've always gone to where I thought things should logically be and have rarely had trouble. Even star metallicity seems to be taken into account, as that's how I found specific elements before the percentages were shown on surface scans.

 

[XW_Ziggy]

I'm pretty sure that Deciat 5D has artificially-boosted arsenic rates, possibly because it's the nearest arsenic-rich body to the first engineer in the game, who gives recipes requiring arsenic as a material - so FDev added some extra arsenic to it?

Whether this is true or just how it unscientifically feels to me is irrelevant - if I want arsenic I go to Deciat 5D and after 45 minutes I have enough arsenic to get several good FSD rolls from Felicity.

 

[tulextreme]

RNG is a BIATCH! Was tired of hunting it following the infamous Galaxy Map (last time went to a 2.4% chance and had 2 drops in like 1h) no thank you... so i went to Europa (0.8%) and found like 7 in the same time amount... yeah life sucks in ED terms!

 

[metatheurgist]

I just found 42 Arsenic in 1.5 hours, also 78 Ruthenium on Deciat 1. Coasting around flat areas as usual. What Arsenic problem?