Newcomer / Intro Assasination misson help

[OliDee]

ok, so I've been bounty hunting for a few days now (waiting on a nav beacon and shoot "wanted" ships) and was doing fine, made around 1 million cr.
So I thought why not take on an assasination mission, I never did one of those and I thought I'm not too bad at fighting - plus the money was good. So after chasing my target around through approximately a dozen USSs, including an informant with the typical "did you hear" story, I finally found my target. I could barely scan him when he fired what can only be described as the light ray that the Death Star is firing - my shields went instantly down and him ramming me did the rest.

Did I have bad luck? Or was I in over my head? Are all the assasination targets so much better than the typical "wanted" ships at nav beacon? (I take out all kinds of ships, from novice to dangerous)

 

[Johnny Cyclops]

What ship are you in? What weapons/shields/bulkheads?

What ship is the target in? What weapons/shields/bulkheads?

I imagine you're chasing a 100k+ reward. I did the same. Was one-shot by an Anaconda onto my Cobra. Took thrusters down to 0%. I was a lame duck. I logged out, and when I came back my ship was dead in the water, with the only option to me to self-destruct. I won't be chasing Anacondas again until I'm better matched for it.

It sounds like you had a similar experience to me. On the positive side (depending what ship you're in) is that insurance might be covered two or three times by the bounty fee, so even if you died two or three times on the same mission, eventually completing it would leave you with some profit.

 

[Suicidal Tendencies]

Assassination missions tend to be against Elite Anacondas. Assuming the reward was around 150k credits? They are tough, but beatable depending on your ship, loadout and skill

 

[OliDee]

sorry. in all the baffledness I forgot to write what ship I'm in. IT was a 140k mission and my ship is a Viper, which is pimped up quite good. 2 beam laser, 2 multi cannons and all the equipment upgraded to not the best, but maybe second or third best. The target I think was an Anaconda, to be honest I was so shocked I forgot

But ok, seems like I was in over my head. I just thought because occasionally I got a bounty of 60k or 70k ... and that didn't seem to me too far from the mission. But apparently I was wrong.
@Johnny: No, unfortunately the mission failed upon destruction of my ship.

 

[Daemondym]

Dying to Kill You

So. I've been playing about a month. I have built a 2million credit Viper, with rank A, class 3 shields, military armor, rank A, class 3 power generator, rank A, class 3 distribution. My weapons are 2 class 2 pulse lasers (rank 3), and 2 class 1 gimbaled cannons. (rank D). I am using 11.5 out of 12 energy. Maybe I could squeeze a beam laser in and up my damage output, but I doubt it.

These missions are not 'tough but doable'. I have /no/ difficulty taking any other target I set my sights on. I've scored 70 and 80k bounties interdicting them in the wild. Master, no problem. I don't bother hunting below competent these days, because they're too easy below that.

I took an assasination mission today, just to see if my final upgrade (Class A shields) would finally let me stand up to one of these. After my first pass, his 4 lasers and plasma cannon had me down a ring of shields. He was down a ring as well, but his ring regenerated much faster than mine, since I was dodging turrets. I tried to stay at long range, to use my fixed fire lasers to my advantage, but his plasma cannon proved accurate at range, so I abandoned that idea. I tried playing around in his blind spots, and found that anywhere I park, 2 of his lasers could find me, and since he wasn't firing all 4, he could fire those 2 constantly. I tried every trick and maneuver that my month of daily play has taught me. I slid under him. I slid over him. I ran away, regenerated shields, and pulled some flight assist off maneuvers to fire as he approached. I even ran back to a squad of internal services goons who showed up after I lost my shields the first time. I was at 65 percent, so I figured some non hostile security forces guys could be a good thing. But they weren't interested in shooting him, so he kept shooting me.

I escaped with 11 percent of my hull left, after 5 minutes of combat, and I have a conclusion:

That mission is stupid. Maybe if I went back, bought a shield battery and a chaff launcher, I could get somewhere. But it's not just a 'tough challenge'. It's so near impossible that I've spent a month preparing for it, and still can't beat it. I consider myself a pretty decent pilot. Almost all my deaths have been trying to do these missions, and failing. (I also got rammed by anacondas a few times. Want to watch me curse? watch me die from a ramming when he's at 3 %, and I'm at full health. Yeah. That's fun.)

I'm not going into it again without a squad to back me up. Maybe that is what it's designed for, to encourage group play, and give wings something to do. I don't know.

I do know it's stupid to offer it as a starting mission. I do know it's stupid to offer it to single players. I do know that I'm not stupid enough to try it again on my own.

 

[paul1828]

I don't take on 140k kill missions ( elite anacondas) .. any more ......I get killed more often than not..taking his shields down is straight forward , getting close and then hopelessly out gunned or rammed, my shields down in one blast from the firing squad on board ....and.its just a pain flying from USS to USS ... Money is easier made at nav points or war zones... If I want reputation gain then take missions below 100k ...will be a clipper or fed jump ship.... Better match for my viper

 

[Bertrand Du Guesclin]

Killing Elite Anacondas in a Viper or Cobra was easier a few patches ago.
It is still doable if you know what you are doing, but it takes a long time as you have to run away to recharge shields often.
Two things to think about when attempting these missions :
- know when you have to run away to avoid droping shields
- use and abuse your lateral and vertical thrusters to avoid plasma, canon, and multi-canon shots.

I wouldn't advise doing those missions at all, unless you want a challenge. The reward is ridiculous compared to the risk, and it takes a long time to complete. Because of this, it is not a very efficient way to make credits.

Until the devs increase the reward for those missions, stick to regular bounty hunting at RES and Nav points.

 

[the100thmonkey]

If you shoot first the system authority ships don't help.

These missions aren't that hard. I've done some 30 of them. You just have to kite the Anaconda until you get its shields down.

I wrote up one way of approaching these missions that minimises the risks to you and your ship. You can read it here.

 

[Daemondym]

Well, I was wrong about one thing: I am stupid enough to try it again.

Close combat vs an elite Anaconda doesn't work out for me. I ended up cheaping it by flying backwards, knocking out its shields, then targetting the power generator, since none of my weapons did enough oomph to knock out the hull taking random pot shots.

I stayed at max range the whole time, and strafed around it, knocking out the shields, and targetting the power gen. It took me the better part of 30 minutes to chew through this, and at the end, he went berserk, and managed to take my shields out with a lucky plasma shot. I went from 80 percent hull (what I took trying to dog fight him/get behind him), to 12 percent hull in about 5 seconds. But, I did manage to knock out his power generator in the ensuing dog fight.

I have to agree that the rewards aren't worth the time/risks involved. I like fights. I like challenging fights. But this fight doesn't feel like it's a challenge. It feels like the only way I can beat it is by exploiting a loop hole in the AI programming, and kiting it. I'd like to try this in a group some time, and see if maybe having multiple targets to distract him will make this crap more enjoyable. However, I'm unlikely to do this mission again on my own.

Also, shield cell banks were useful, but not particularly great. They dragged the dog fight portion out. If I'd been brighter, I'd have kited, and used the shield cells for strafing runs once the shields were down. But, again, Kiting shouldn't work. No intelligent person would chase you around the map, letting you stay at max range plinking them while they were unable to make contact. They'd turn and run, and make you try to catch them. This is a flaw in the AI program, and it feels like I exploited it to 'win' the mission.

 

[Zylark]

The assassination missions were a lot easier in 1.0 than they are currently in 1.1. So these days I find it very hard using a 10 million Cobra, and just about doable - but by no means profitable - in my 30 million Asp.

The basic premise for taking out those Elite Anacondas are the same. The opening salvo from it will be the blue blob of death. A shot from its huge Plasma-Cannon. So whatever you do, keep clear from its nose. If it do get its nose on you, apply left or right lateral thrusters until the blue blob whizzes past you.

Getting shields down is a simple affair, but for actually destroying the ship, it is not enough to try and whittle down the hull. You will need to target a subsystem and make it go critical. I prefer either Power Generator or Drives. Getting the Power Generator to 0 will cause it to explode outright. Downside being it is a rather small target and you need to be somewhat above or below to get a clear shot. With the drives getting one of them to 0, will cause the Anaconda to spin helplessly in place and more important, to not fire its weapons for some reason. Making it a sitting duck for you to finish off. The drives are a big target, and it is a bit easier getting guns on it if you manage to at most times keep at the rear of the ship.

 

[the100thmonkey]

Well, I was wrong about one thing: I am stupid enough to try it again.

Close combat vs an elite Anaconda doesn't work out for me. I ended up cheaping it by flying backwards, knocking out its shields, then targetting the power generator, since none of my weapons did enough oomph to knock out the hull taking random pot shots.

I stayed at max range the whole time, and strafed around it, knocking out the shields, and targetting the power gen. It took me the better part of 30 minutes to chew through this, and at the end, he went berserk, and managed to take my shields out with a lucky plasma shot. I went from 80 percent hull (what I took trying to dog fight him/get behind him), to 12 percent hull in about 5 seconds. But, I did manage to knock out his power generator in the ensuing dog fight.

I have to agree that the rewards aren't worth the time/risks involved. I like fights. I like challenging fights. But this fight doesn't feel like it's a challenge. It feels like the only way I can beat it is by exploiting a loop hole in the AI programming, and kiting it. I'd like to try this in a group some time, and see if maybe having multiple targets to distract him will make this crap more enjoyable. However, I'm unlikely to do this mission again on my own.

Also, shield cell banks were useful, but not particularly great. They dragged the dog fight portion out. If I'd been brighter, I'd have kited, and used the shield cells for strafing runs once the shields were down. But, again, Kiting shouldn't work. No intelligent person would chase you around the map, letting you stay at max range plinking them while they were unable to make contact. They'd turn and run, and make you try to catch them. This is a flaw in the AI program, and it feels like I exploited it to 'win' the mission.

Yeah - you pretty much nailed it. They're pretty stupid pirate lords right now. Just one point to make though - it took you so long because you were using class 1 gimballed multicannon. Gimballed weapons do 25% less damage than fixed weapons, and weapons are subject to a damage modifier depending on the class of ships they're firing on. The modifier works out to roughly 33% per class difference. This means you're looking at 66% less damage - class 1 kinetics on a small ship going against a ship two classes above it:

33% x 0.75 = 25% of the damage per shot you were expecting.

A medium fixed multicannon therefore does a great deal more damage - it will deal out 66% damage per shot (one class difference), and wont take a 25% damage hit.

66% x 1 = 66%.

Gimbals are OK against smaller ships, but they do you a disservice against the big snakes.

Thing is, while aiming with fixed kinetics is more difficult, Anacondas are a lot easier with even one wingman - you can get on their six much more easily if they have more than one target to point the business ends of their ships at. I suggest you switch to fixed class 2 multicannons and employ class 1 beams - it takes longer to get the shields down, but once they're down, you'll take big chunks out of their subsystems.

There are major improvements to the AI coming in 1.2 (next week) which will probably render kiting ineffective, but the addition of wings makes kiting moot anyway.

Basically, 1.2 will change assassination missions considerably.

 

[Daemondym]

Yeah - you pretty much nailed it. They're pretty stupid pirate lords right now. Just one point to make though - it took you so long because you were using class 1 gimballed multicannon. Gimballed weapons do 25% less damage than fixed weapons, and weapons are subject to a damage modifier depending on the class of ships they're firing on. The modifier works out to roughly 33% per class difference. This means you're looking at 66% less damage - class 1 kinetics on a small ship going against a ship two classes above it:

33% x 0.75 = 25% of the damage per shot you were expecting.

A medium fixed multicannon therefore does a great deal more damage - it will deal out 66% damage per shot (one class difference), and wont take a 25% damage hit.

66% x 1 = 66%.

Gimbals are OK against smaller ships, but they do you a disservice against the big snakes.

Thing is, while aiming with fixed kinetics is more difficult, Anacondas are a lot easier with even one wingman - you can get on their six much more easily if they have more than one target to point the business ends of their ships at. I suggest you switch to fixed class 2 multicannons and employ class 1 beams - it takes longer to get the shields down, but once they're down, you'll take big chunks out of their subsystems.

There are major improvements to the AI coming in 1.2 (next week) which will probably render kiting ineffective, but the addition of wings makes kiting moot anyway.

Basically, 1.2 will change assassination missions considerably.

A) I'm using cannons, not multi cannons, because I like being able to kill asps and cobras, and they give the best damage for a class 1 device that I could find. Well, I could switch to fixed rail guns, but the energy cost for those is too high.. I gimbaled them because I still can't find any class 1 fixed fire cannons (and their bullet speed is so slow, I'm not sure I'd want them without the tracking of the gimbals.)

B) I have thought about switching to class 2 multicannons, and class one beam lasers, but I haven't had both the desire, and the money at the same time, since I've been going for class a power generation and classs a shields for the last couple weeks. (Farming bounties takes time, yo.)

C) I really need to find people to shoot at these guys with. I just really wish they'd make it clear that this mission isn't something intended for or easily performed by a single person in a fighter. Some sort of difficulty rating would be good for missions. Perhaps gating it behind a higher trust required.

D) The rewards for doing it really don't justify doing it. Sure, it was 30 minutes of fight for as much as I usually make in 2-3 hours, but the damage I took to my ship, and the fact that if I screwed up once, I'd be dead, mean that it's just not reasonable for me to do this sort of thing often.

When you get one of these, and get a wing, and go kill them, do your wing mates get any rewards? How does wing play work? I have yet to group up with anyone, been playing solo for the extent of my time.

 

[the100thmonkey]

A) I'm using cannons, not multi cannons, because I like being able to kill asps and cobras, and they give the best damage for a class 1 device that I could find. Well, I could switch to fixed rail guns, but the energy cost for those is too high.. I gimbaled them because I still can't find any class 1 fixed fire cannons (and their bullet speed is so slow, I'm not sure I'd want them without the tracking of the gimbals.)

B) I have thought about switching to class 2 multicannons, and class one beam lasers, but I haven't had both the desire, and the money at the same time, since I've been going for class a power generation and classs a shields for the last couple weeks. (Farming bounties takes time, yo.)

C) I really need to find people to shoot at these guys with. I just really wish they'd make it clear that this mission isn't something intended for or easily performed by a single person in a fighter. Some sort of difficulty rating would be good for missions. Perhaps gating it behind a higher trust required.

D) The rewards for doing it really don't justify doing it. Sure, it was 30 minutes of fight for as much as I usually make in 2-3 hours, but the damage I took to my ship, and the fact that if I screwed up once, I'd be dead, mean that it's just not reasonable for me to do this sort of thing often.

When you get one of these, and get a wing, and go kill them, do your wing mates get any rewards? How does wing play work? I have yet to group up with anyone, been playing solo for the extent of my time.

Fair enough - a great deal of weapon set up is personal preference. I was simply explaining why it took you so long and suggesting an alternative setup that works well for me and takes me less than half that time. I've tried cannons, but find the bullet speed is, as you say, too slow for accurate fire. Actually, even with gimbals, if you're not within, say, 500m, the projectile often misses because it's so slow and the enemy has time to turn.

Bounty hunting is a slow way to earn your credits, yes. It's more fun than trading though. At the moment, doing the missions in pairs is quite difficult - it's very hard to lock on to the low-energy FSD wake and drop into someone's instance, and some people have even reported being able to see theiur mate shooting but not see the Anaconda! This won't be an issue next week with 1.2, but then again, the kill missions are going to get harder to do on your own.

Wings will be able to share rewards among them. I expect that the missions will get a lot harder and the rewards to increase. They should still be achievable solo by a very skilled pilot, but they'll be very much more dangerous thna they are now. I think, for example, that the Anacondas will be escorted, and if you start to win a post-interdiction battle, the NPCs mates will jump in to support him. That kind of thing.

 

[Daemondym]

That brings up another question I had. I was tailing a target, trying to get in range to interdict him, and saw him interdict another player. I tried to drop out of cruise on the wake, and was told that I needed to 'analyze the cloud'. Problem was, even though I had a wake scanner, I couldn't use it in cruise. Is this a bug, or is there just no way to lock on to a wake and drop out of hyperspace on it?

 

[the100thmonkey]

You can target the wake and try to drop out in range to get into the local instance, which I believe is 100km in radius from the player. Needless to say, it's really hard to do because the navigation system doesn't treat it like a planet or station and modify your speed for you. The wake scanner is inteded for inter-system tracking, I believe, and doesn't work on low-intensity wakes - you an always change direction in supercruise anyway!

I've managed to drop into friends' local instances in this way twice, and each time I was a long way from their position - well beyond scanner range. I only found them because they fired their lasers as a beacon.