Asteroid Mining: Layered Asteroids to add Scaling to Mining AND a use for Prospectors

Lazerus Artificial · Jun 5, 2015

while reading and writing here, i had an idea

Currently our main issues are, that mining wont scale with your ship.
Once you can equip a A4 Refinery, Medium Lasers and some Drones, you are pretty much capped.
More cargo does not increase the income per hour, there are no bigger lasers and refinery has allready 10 slots at A4.

So, i just had the idea that it could work if asteroids would basically be "layered".

Content of the Layers: Mineral | Metal
(the tons there are just to show how much each layer could contain)

First Layer 100-75%: <1.000c => 5-15t

Bauxite 200c
Aluminium 400c
Rutile 400c
Copper 600c
Lepidolite 700c
Cobalt 800c
Uranite 1.000c

Second Layer 75-50%: 1.000c-5.000c => 2-10t

Titanium 1.100c
Coltan 1.500c
Lithium 1.700c
Gallite 2.100c
Indite 2.400c
Bertrandite 2.700c
Uranium 2.800c
Tantalum 4.200c
Silver 5.000c

Third Layer 50-25%: 5.000c-10.000c 1-5t

Gallium 5.500
Indium 6.200
Osmium 7.031
Beryllium 8.500
Gold 9.700

Last Layer 25-0%: <10.000c => 0.25-1t

Palladium 13.500c
Platinum 18.800
Painite 33.000

So the longer you dig, the deeper you get.

Prospector would have a use!!!
Because you dig it in layers, you cant see the 2-4 by just shooting the rock.
So a Prospector would reveal all of them to you!

How to Mine them?
New Mining Lasers
Large and Huge
Each size would have access to a deeper layer.

A small Laser could only mine the first
A medium Laser could mine up to the second
A Large Laser could mine up to the third
A Huge Laser could even mine the core

That does not mean that you need a Conda to get Platinum! More about that below.

The type of material would be based on our current system.

Rocky would have a mix of both, but only very small amounts
Metal Rich would have a lot of the Minerals but less Metal (i would also suggest renaming it to Mineral Rich or so)
Metallic would contain more Metals than Minerals

The amount of Material would be based on where you mine.

In an Intense RES there would be a lot of material per layer.
In a High Secure there would be less.
- So the more secure the RES is, the less material you get per layer
Random spots in belts would have a random value.

The chance of more layers would be based on the value of the field.
so in a Pristine Metalic belt you would have a high chance to have Platinum/Palladium Core,
a Pristine Metal(Mineral) Rich would have a high chance of a Painite Core (third layer has always metal, because there is no mineral in that price range)
I dont know the other names right now, but less valuble belts would have a lower chance to have more layers. For the worst type there would even just be a chance to have a second layer.

Also: each layer would have a chance to have one of the deeper layer materials.
So, the chance to have Painite in the first layer is very low, but increases with the depth.
The chance for the second layer would still be low, for the third layer uncommon and for the fourth layer of course common.
THIS adds the scaling.
A bigger ship that can equip a bigger laser has a higher chance to get the high valuable material from the core, while a smaller ship with a smaller laser would still have the chance, just not as high.

EDIT: Powerplay
As mentioned a few times in other posts, Miners would need something for powerplay.
This could either be done through "trading" miner-unique metals (Platin, Painite, Osmium) for merits, or through the implementation of another ressource (Meritite, Powerplaynium...whatever xD)

Psycho Romeo · Jun 5, 2015

I kinda like this... but wouldn't it end up making mining harder and slower than it already is?

Maun · Jun 5, 2015

I love this idea LazerusKI. Psycho im pretty sure most miners (myself included) dont care if mining would be slower or hard (more involved) as it should be a lengthy process when you think about. Most miners are just bored to tears that we've all put absolutely blinding ideas in how to improve mining, and well FDev hasnt really done much with it.

1.3 hasnt really helped us (collecting drones are useful when not bugged) as prospecting drones serve very little purpose, 3 ores in a roid = less ores mined, HI-RES = pirates/bounty hunters help not miners.

Some sort of financial buff to mining would be nice, but for me mining just needs to be more involving, like OP idea, targeting roids, tagging depleted roids, more metals that cant be purchased, background sim working so mining is a fundemental part of ED universe etc

Gunshow · Jun 5, 2015

All very well laid out and considered suggestions, all of which would greatly improve mining IMHO. I'd love for this kind of engaging process, I really would.

Such a shame this suggestion box is rarely visited. I'd consider re-posting to discussion for more attention, potentially from FDEV

Ploxbox · Jun 5, 2015

I completely agree. Implementing your idea would not only give the prospector drone a viable purpose, but increase profits for larger ships making it a considerable money making option.

Cosmo · Jun 5, 2015

+1 Great suggestion to enrich the mining experience.

LazerusKI said:
Prospector would have a use!!!
Because you dig it in layers, you cant see the 2-4 by just shooting the rock.
So a Prospector would reveal all of them to you!

How to Mine them?
New Mining Lasers
Large and Huge
Each size would have access to a deeper layer.

A small Laser could only mine the first

A medium Laser could mine up to the second

A Large Laser could mine up to the third

A Huge Laser could even mine the core

...............................
Also: each layer would have a chance to have one of the deeper layer materials.[/B][/SIZE]
So, the chance to have Painite in the first layer is very low, but increases with the depth.
The chance for the second layer would still be low, for the third layer uncommon and for the fourth layer of course common.

THIS adds the scaling.
A bigger ship that can equip a bigger laser has a higher chance to get the high valuable material from the core, while a smaller ship with a smaller laser would still have the chance, just not as high.

Lazerus Artificial · Jun 5, 2015

Thanks^^
I made quite a few mining suggestions in the past, but with this...i could seriously see it work.
I dont know how hard it would be to implement that, but i dont think its Powerplay-Sized.
Basically all it would need is a reworked drop-table and reworked lasers. And that doesnt sound like a completely new feature...
I would even think that modelling new lasers would be the hardest part.

Gunshow said:
Such a shame this suggestion box is rarely visited. I'd consider re-posting to discussion for more attention, potentially from FDEV

Dont know if i should do that...douple-post are usually not wanted, neither is self advertising.
If you want to do that to discuss it there, i cant stop you though.
Actually...do the devs even read suggestions? or is this section just to satisfy the creative minds?

Psycho Romeo said:
I kinda like this... but wouldn't it end up making mining harder and slower than it already is?

Nah, for the lower mininglasers nothing would change. you would still have dozens of asteroids with low valuable material, and sometimes you find the good stuff.
Only the bigger lasers would have a better chance to find them, since they can dig deeper into the core.
The other change woul be, that Asteroids would have much more yield, but you would also need a bigger laser to access it. A small one could just mine 25% of it, so either like it is now or with increased low-tier material.

Lazerus Artificial · Jun 6, 2015

just added another problem that this suggestion would solve.
Decluttering of RNG

Lazerus Artificial · Jun 6, 2015

Added a Refinery change for the system.

starhawkprime · Jun 6, 2015

This sounds very good and profitability could be tweaked by how much the roid drops. Unfortunately its like screaming into space, no one will here you. If this were an offline game and modders had a crack at it but alas all we can do is hope someone does get wind of this suggestion because it seems to be well thought out and adds game play for not too much overhaul.

Lazerus Artificial · Jun 6, 2015

starhawkprime said:
This sounds very good and profitability could be tweaked by how much the roid drops. Unfortunately its like screaming into space, no one will here you. If this were an offline game and modders had a crack at it but alas all we can do is hope someone does get wind of this suggestion because it seems to be well thought out and adds game play for not too much overhaul.

yup, thats why they are just estimate numbers to show how it could look like.

Lazerus Artificial · Jun 8, 2015

Added some refinery calculations

Lazerus Artificial · Jun 23, 2015

added a small text towards powerplay

Father Bladewraith · Jun 23, 2015

Going along the Wing Mining Route

The Mining Mother Ship idea

Have class 2 or 3 upgrade that would make your ship a “Mother ship” for the miners, where you could "hire" smaller NPC mining vessels to mine the rocks and bring you the goods, these hired miners would become part of your Wing so they go with you to a RES or cluster. And you make say 10% on what they give you. This way you could make use of the much larger cargo capacity and also increase the speed, at which you can gain profits, if you hire say 4 or more NPCs to work for you. Easiest way to do this would simply be they mine the rocks and then once they have full cargo bays they fly to you jettison their cargo and then go back for more, you then send out the collector drones to pick them up.this especially along side the layered Asteroids would make Mining so much more scalable

One other possible could be to be able to loan out you spare ships; you could make say 20% profits on what the pilots make in your ship. Combine these two and you could build a full blown Mining Corporation where you own say 10 haulers fitted for mining which are hired out to NPC pilots (Or real pilots, I don’t mind) they work for your Mining Mother ship thus increasing your profits from the previous say 10% to around the 40% margin, the pilots get a better ship early on and you gain more profit as well.

All this then means that there are larger ships out there carrying higher value cargo for the pirates to prey on if they want. But also, it means the mother ships wouldn’t need mining lasers and therefore be able fit more weapons to protect the smaller mining ships from the pirates

Would only require some tweaking to the NPC coding to allow them to follow you, and also bring you the mined goods, the addition of the “Mining Motherside upgrade” (I’m sure someone can think of a better name), and adding hireable ships into the contacts option in starports and outposts. After that they could use the same mechanic to allow NPCs to be hired for various other jobs like bounty hunting or haulage, even exploring! any thoughts

PS: I know i'm new to the forums so apologies if something like this has been suggested already, i haven't seen it so thought i'd throw my two cents in.

Lazerus Artificial · Jun 24, 2015

Father Bladewraith said:
Going along the Wing Mining Route

The Mining Mother Ship idea

Have class 2 or 3 upgrade that would make your ship a “Mother ship” for the miners, where you could "hire" smaller NPC mining vessels to mine the rocks and bring you the goods, these hired miners would become part of your Wing so they go with you to a RES or cluster. And you make say 10% on what they give you. This way you could make use of the much larger cargo capacity and also increase the speed, at which you can gain profits, if you hire say 4 or more NPCs to work for you. Easiest way to do this would simply be they mine the rocks and then once they have full cargo bays they fly to you jettison their cargo and then go back for more, you then send out the collector drones to pick them up.this especially along side the layered Asteroids would make Mining so much more scalable

One other possible could be to be able to loan out you spare ships; you could make say 20% profits on what the pilots make in your ship. Combine these two and you could build a full blown Mining Corporation where you own say 10 haulers fitted for mining which are hired out to NPC pilots (Or real pilots, I don’t mind) they work for your Mining Mother ship thus increasing your profits from the previous say 10% to around the 40% margin, the pilots get a better ship early on and you gain more profit as well.

All this then means that there are larger ships out there carrying higher value cargo for the pirates to prey on if they want. But also, it means the mother ships wouldn’t need mining lasers and therefore be able fit more weapons to protect the smaller mining ships from the pirates

Would only require some tweaking to the NPC coding to allow them to follow you, and also bring you the mined goods, the addition of the “Mining Motherside upgrade” (I’m sure someone can think of a better name), and adding hireable ships into the contacts option in starports and outposts. After that they could use the same mechanic to allow NPCs to be hired for various other jobs like bounty hunting or haulage, even exploring! any thoughts

PS: I know i'm new to the forums so apologies if something like this has been suggested already, i haven't seen it so thought i'd throw my two cents in.

thats allready denied.
no "automated gameplay"
that was mentioned somewhere as npcs who can trade stuff for you, so basically you sitting in a virtual chair and sending commands to npc ships and earn money through it.
so free material from npcs would fall into the same category.
(btw, the mining motherships sounds totally like this^^)
edit:

You will be able to own small inflatable asteroid stations as depicted here as part of an update, but you can't own large stations, build empires or own fleets, since that would change the nature of the game.
For example, why would you pilot space ships yourself, when the most efficient way to make money and progress in a game is to sit back in an office and hand out commands?

but: i would love to see a ship with a mining-role (and not just combat, explorer, hauler).
also i would love to see some wing-stuff with other players togehter instead of just "shoot some bounty while you are here"

J4CK · Jun 30, 2015

It would be nice if collector drones could have options which type of chunks you wan to collect because they automatically collecting all of them which is sometimes disadvantage.Othervise great job frontier drones are great idea thanks!

natebluehooves · Sep 8, 2015

cant just let this die... I was a hardcore miner in eve online and desperately want my profession to remain relevant in this game... bounty hunting is fine and all, and i dare say VERY FUN, but at the same time some variety in the list of VIABLE gameplay styles would be greatly appreciated. i understand this forum isn't often read, but if there's even a fraction of a percent of a chance this will make it into the game, i think the time spent nagging here about it is WORTH IT.