Automated Fuel Scooping - Supercruise Assist

[Type-10 Offender]

When the heck is this going to be fixed?
The entire reason it was implemented is because even with a MASSIVE fuel scoop , it can take a minute or more of carefully circling a star's superhot edges to get your tank up to half full on larger ships...
Let alone fill up totally.

Gods forbid you use a lower grade fuel scoop or a smaller one that takes up less slot space.

Like... I don't want to MANUALLY ORBIT these stars for so bloody long, especially when doing so I risk potentially ramming into orbit and being turned into molten slag.
This is ridiculous.

Using smaller and lower grade scoops takes way longer... But at least when the autopilot orbited scoopable stars properly, I could lean back and listen to some tunes while I waited. Now, the darn thing is a massive waste of a size-7 slot.

This feature was fully functional last time I played.
Went on hiatus for a bit, came back... And it's bungled into non-existence. what, Frontier?

 

[Riverside]

I've never used the supercruise assist (I bought the game long before it was added) but I have used scoops a lot and it's a rare situation where it's taken me more than a few seconds to scoop.

The closer you go to the star the faster the scoop goes, up to whatever your scoops maximum transfer rate is, but if you get close enough to max it out you will be close enough to the star that your ship (unless you are in a Dolphin) can no longer regulate it's temperature & will continue to rise so can't maintain that rate for long without taking heat damage. It's easy with practice.

So I guess the automated scooping feature you describe is keeping your ship far enough away that the ship is able to dissipate the heat. IIRC the crossover temp is around 66%.

If you're using supercruise assist you aren't in a hurry, or at least you aren't going as fast as you can. Take over the controls manually & you can go faster in almost all circumstances, and scoop faster too.



For completeness what specific ship hull are you using, and what size & class of scoop?

 

[CMDR-AD]

While manually fueling, I've never really preferred orbiting the star while refueling. I just dive into the scooping range to my desired level, flying far enough around just to get my next jump target in view (if possible)... then close the throttle and park there. Tank fills, no risk of an accidental collision with the star.

It's most satisfying when I can pull away from the fill and time the exit so that fueling completes just before/as the scoop rate drops to zero.

 

[Nephthys Vasudan]

All I can say is the OP "Screams" Lazy.

This is a non-issue. Literally.

 

[shockbait]

So first and foremost, you can just park(30km/s throttle zeroed) at whichever distance will allow you the highest scoop rate without overheating, moving faster literally doesn't matter.

After a quick google search of this subject and reading threads on this forum and on reddit, I believe I have an idea what's going on here.
Supercruise assist scooping was more of a bug than a feature, and if you had a ship with a wildly high thermal profile, it would literally kill you, as it was not meant to be used to orbit stars, it's code is entirely focused on planets.
It seems to have had a set distance from body that it orbited, which prior to odyssey was low enough you could scoop at most stars, after odyssey, the distance from body seems to have inscreased.
My guess is the atmospheric planets drop zone extends higher than previously landable bodies, so SCA had to adjust it's orbit higher, which now means most stars won't be scoopable at that distance.

Basically, the thing you were using was never meant for what you were using it for, it's now been adjusted for it's proper use. It's not a bug. It was never meant to be used for scooping, and will not be "fixed" as it is not broken. You can just park, and still listen to music while you scoop, theres no issue here.

 

[IstvaanDCIV]

Huh. I didn't even know you could use SCA to orbit stars. I guess it never occurred to me, because it was always more handy to just manually orbit while scooping, or to find the right distance to throttle zero and wait for the scoop to fill the tank. Since that doesn't require opening up the left hand panel and selecting the object to activate SCA.

Is it possible to assign an input to activate SCA on the currently targeted object?

 

[vanFace]

Nowadays, I usually jump in, turn nose slightly below the star's horizon, wait for the fuel scoop to start showing intake, then immediately cut throttle, switch to FSS and scan away. This almost always fills up my tanks, except maybe for the smallest scoop in the biggest tanker. Never circled a star again since starting using this method... for exploring/standard travel. Buckyballing is different, of course, but there I have a cold ship with over-sized scoops, and by the time I've circled the star to face the next jump, the tank is full already.
I guess that's why I've never understood the need for the SCA. It is just an inefficient automation IMHO, given the sub-optimal cruising speed and being useless for planetary landings. Would it include the later as efficient as shown in Apex taxis, I'd equip it.

 

[Kira Goto]

I guess that's why I've never understood the need for the SCA.

I use one on my exploration Phantom if I feel lazy and don’t want to pay attention to the ship while it flies to the next planet to scan, while throwing up a vid or something like that on a laptop.

Or to just walk off and have a break as it flies 200k+ ls to a secondary star(with throttle to 0 beforehand, not that it ever seems to have issues arriving safely at a planet). Furthest I’ve had was 715k ls from a procedurally generated system, iirc. Some undiscovered one out in the Formidine Rift, don’t think I kept it as a bookmark though.

But anyway, generally none of my other ships do to use the slot for something else. Convenience is nice and all but not that important. (Some people have said those docking/SC assist modules should be default features without the need of a module…)

 

[robbyp]

This is a game of skill of flying your spaceship. Being able to fuel scoop quickly without damage is a skill to be learnt, whatever the rating of the scoop.

 

[Jokerman]

Hell of a first post there @Type-10 Offender.
Look the style of play is fair enough ... slightly exaggerated in terms of describing the problem though ... a bit of an own-goal LOL.

I too am a hop in, close down the throttle and check some navigation cmdr ... it takes maybe 10-15 seconds for my condi to top up most of the time (I never pass a fuel station out here in the extremes LOL) and sure longer when I've run low.

I cannot see this issue being a priority item!

The manual scooping is not as bad as you suggest @Type-10 Offender

S!

 

[Fnord Velkor]

I can't understand why people keep SCA fitted. I think it has only one "benefit" and that is the exploit to drop-out at high speed at a station.

The orbiting a body feature is the very worst thing they have exposed new players to, nonsensical.

Seriously OP - you fuel scoop in SCA? That has to be the most ridiculous thing I have read this year.

FLY YOUR SHIP!

 

[Hanerib]

I kinda like that new players actually use these fancy things like super cruise assist, docking assist, flight assist, makes you feel a bit old.

 

[vanFace]

I think it has only one "benefit" and that is the exploit to drop-out at high speed at a station.

That one never worked all that well for me. Either it dropped me some 100 klicks away or just refused to drop at all. I think it only works reliably on a fast machine?
What I usually do is using a low-gravity-well curve to the target at full throttle, straight in up to 6s, then blue mark, stay there until 5M, then full throttle again, wait for <1M or notification, then drop manually. Works fine except for Maelstroms, where I had to adjust the approach according to mission.

 

[Untilting]

even with a MASSIVE A-grade fuel scoop , it can take a minute or more of carefully circling a star's superhot edges to get your tank up to half full on larger ships.

Do you wait until your fuel is low before scooping? The trick is to scoop little and often, I think - if I see dashed lines on my route planner then I refuel at each star I pass, I usually just travel manually around it at about 30% speed scooping, then back to full speed when the the next destination is in sight. The tank remains reasonably full throughout the journey then.

I usually compare the sizes of the FSD, the fuel tank and the scoop to assess likely refuelling pain. If the FSD is larger than the fuel tank (I'm looking at you in particular, Clipper) then the fuel tank will empty a lot with each jump unless you fit an optional one to bring it up to size (it will also fill up faster while scooping, of course). If the scoop (A-rated) is the same size as the fuel capacity then I find the scooping time is acceptable, if you can fit a larger scoop than fuel capacity then the galaxy is the shellfish of your choice - generally by the time you've travelled around the current star the tank is full again.

But it all depends on ship build - my cargo or combat ships have no scoop (or tiny ones for emergencies) since they'll never travel outside the Bubble. If I ever had to emergency scoop those I'd expect it to take a while.

 

[CMDR-AD]

As above, yes whenever I pass a scoopable star, I will take few seconds to stop and gather fuel. A couple of reasons:

First, it keeps the tank most always topped off. If I hit a stretch of 2 or 3 unscoopable stars, I'm good.

Second, each short scooping seems to take less time than having to stop and do a long refill when the tank is low. This might just be imaginary, however? I never timed it out, but it feels faster to do the short scoops, to me.

In fact, after most jumps I never need to completely stop. Just doing a partial orbit (to bring my next jump into view) is enough time to complete the refueling. This does vary with each ship and build. My Chieftain will often use nearly half a tank of fuel, and the scoop isn't fast enough to refill that much without a stop. I seem to recall similar situations with my FAS, FGS, and FDL.

 

[HansAcker]

Basically, the thing you were using was never meant for what you were using it for

I loved to park the Cobra in orbit around a star and not worrying about fuel consumption. I noticed, too, that SCA-refueling doesn't work anymore. It used to and I thought it was a handy feature.

 

[Type-10 Offender]

So first and foremost, you can just park(30km/s throttle zeroed) at whichever distance will allow you the highest scoop rate without overheating, moving faster literally doesn't matter.

After a quick google search of this subject and reading threads on this forum and on reddit, I believe I have an idea what's going on here.
Supercruise assist scooping was more of a bug than a feature, and if you had a ship with a wildly high thermal profile, it would literally kill you, as it was not meant to be used to orbit stars, it's code is entirely focused on planets.
It seems to have had a set distance from body that it orbited, which prior to odyssey was low enough you could scoop at most stars, after odyssey, the distance from body seems to have inscreased.
My guess is the atmospheric planets drop zone extends higher than previously landable bodies, so SCA had to adjust it's orbit higher, which now means most stars won't be scoopable at that distance.

Basically, the thing you were using was never meant for what you were using it for, it's now been adjusted for it's proper use. It's not a bug. It was never meant to be used for scooping, and will not be "fixed" as it is not broken. You can just park, and still listen to music while you scoop, theres no issue here.

Is that so? I'll have to give that a go sometime.

 

[Type-10 Offender]

All I can say is the OP "Screams" Lazy.

This is a non-issue. Literally.

Bro, you can't just waive issues folks have by calling them "lazy". I don't want to risk MELTING IN THE FIERY CORONA OF THE SUN for fuel; a resource which, may I remind everyone, is dirt cheap. Like, I'd rather pay 8,000 credits or so to refuel after a long haul between destinations than pay the bloody 16,000,000 fee for popping my chonker.

Even if crashing and burning up is a rarity, it's still a risk... And for less maneuverable, high-mass ships it's hard to get out of safely.

 

[Type-10 Offender]

This is a game of skill of flying your spaceship. Being able to fuel scoop quickly without damage is a skill to be learnt, whatever the rating of the scoop.

I feel like this is the equivalent to saying "Skill issue" when the skill in question is literally putting gas in the tank.
You shouldn't have to risk your livelihood for something so minor.

 

[Type-10 Offender]

I kinda like that new players actually use these fancy things like super cruise assist, docking assist, flight assist, makes you feel a bit old.

I used to go without, plenty.
That changed after I started using a phatter ship. As you may have guessed from my alias, I use a Type-10 Defender fairly regularly.
Type-9 Heavy if I feel like doing some cargo hauling or trading.

Like... Anyone can CHOOSE whether they use these features. There's a regular and advanced variant for the docking module and the supercruise assist module is an additional small slot. This isn't a feature anybody was ever forcing on you, myself or others. It's something for folks that want to play with a little less tedium and risk when engaging in otherwise meaningless, minor actions.

Exploding because your oversized meatball with rockets got jammed in the mailslot or because you refueled a bit too close to the spicy gas-ball is kinda lame.
Imagine if mining required some additional layer of finesse, in which your ship would be slammed into by your own drones and damaged by their micro-explosions...
Or if turning too hard while carrying passengers legit pulped a fraction of them each time...

Like, folks laugh about the concept of auto-pilot, but a lot of players make heavy use of the inertial dampeners on their ships.
It's not a "skill issue", people just don't want to add more layers of difficulty to tasks in which such is wholly unnecessary.