Be careful of what you wish for...

[Pville_Piper]

So, I enjoy playing the part of galactic hobo and doing whatever I might enjoy, often not bothering with missions. When Horizons came out, I spent countless hours roaming planets and finding things to sell. So recently when thargoid pod recues became a thing, I thought I'd give that a go.

The first attempt I had the pods stolen from after 8 interdictions and I limped into port with 9% hull after rebooting some modules. I was really upset at the time, raging mad about being manhandled and mauled so badly... I wanted less interdictions, why didn't the NPCs help?

But, I persisted. I upgraded, learned a lot, got better and soon it was challenging, but fun. And quite profitable! Making as much as 20 million a run...

But since 16 dropped, I've not had a lot of time to play, and conflicting goals presented themselves when I did (I got Terra Velasquez and Oden Geiger completed). But I finally got back to thumping Scythes and delivering pods... But it's not the same. I've working HIP 20890, an alert system, and I rarely get jumped by Scythes in system and almost never when I jump out or are cruising my current home system, HIP 20019, next door.

I did do a couple of thargoid controlled systems nearby and even those seem pretty tame anymore. So FDEV, if you're reading this, please put it back to the way it was, I'm losing money here!

 

[Ned Flandalorian]

For some reason when scythe aggressiveness was complained about they reacted almost immediately but continue to ignore glaives gatekeeping people from getting to the titans or ruining AX CZs by melting guardian weapons and leaving ships unable to repair properly.

 

[Jack Winter]

IMO, it's really sad if everything challenging gets nerfed due to the whining of some (not that I've done any AX for quite a while so have no first hand experience with this specifically)..

 

[Rat Catcher]

Sadly the nerf bat is wielded too often - the Thargoid war had its teeth pulled after a few weeks because some complained it was too hard and they were losing...

I stopped bothering with AX combat following that debacle.

 

[Ned Flandalorian]

IMO, it's really sad if everything challenging gets nerfed due to the whining of some (not that I've done any AX for quite a while so have no first hand experience with this specifically)..

There's a difference between "challenging" and "not fun". Being intercepted by a ship packed with OP offensive capabilities (guardian-module-melting field, FSD reboot missiles, caustic missiles, lightning attack that can both recharge its shield and be spammed at any time, 800m/s thrusters, and a mass-lock factor that affects everything but the largest available ships) designed for "fight or die" combat while in a ship decked out for rescue activity/materials gathering (packed with single-use modules that are mandatory to even access a maelstrom) is not a challenge, it's poor design. And instead of acknowledging it as an issue, they're doubling down and dressing up another recycled game mechanic as "new" titan gameplay. I really can't see why most people will bother with it when, if they wanted to go mining, they could just go mining rather than deal with the extra poorly-thought-out obstacles put in the way...

 

[Rat Catcher]

There's a difference between "challenging" and "not fun".

Indeed there is - and it differs for individuals - finding a 'comfort zone' that encompasses the gamut of play styles is going to be incredibly challenging, so, rather than accept the challenge, gameplay is styled for the lower ability player as any real challenge would be 'too hard'.

is not a challenge, it's poor design.

an often chanted mantra here - challenge is poor design, OK...

I really can't see why most people will bother with it when, if they wanted to go mining, they could just go mining rather than deal with the extra poorly-thought-out obstacles put in the way...

Most people probably won't bother, only those interested in doing so - that content, just like most content in the game, is optional.
I won't be bothering as it doesn't interest me, not because it may be too challenging.

 

[SteveWW57]

I did a few of the rescue missions early on, and did not find them very satisfying. What I do find satisfying is regime change, so I will devote myself to that and not bother with the thargoid related stuff.

Steve

 

[Pville_Piper]

There's a difference between "challenging" and "not fun". Being intercepted by a ship packed with OP offensive capabilities (guardian-module-melting field, FSD reboot missiles, caustic missiles, lightning attack that can both recharge its shield and be spammed at any time, 800km/s thrusters, and a mass-lock factor that affects everything but the largest available ships) designed for "fight or die" combat while in a ship decked out for rescue activity/materials gathering (packed with single-use modules that are mandatory to even access a maelstrom) is not a challenge, it's poor design. And instead of acknowledging it as an issue, they're doubling down and dressing up another recycled game mechanic as "new" titan gameplay. I really can't see why most people will bother with it when, if they wanted to go mining, they could just go mining rather than deal with the extra poorly-thought-out obstacles put in the way...

The Scythe can be outrun... And are good practice against the Glaive. First few times I fought a Glaive, I came away with 30% hull, now I'm lucky to lose 30%. The biggest issue with AX combat is what works with the hunters doesn't work well with the interceptors and vice versa. The other big issue is the need for heavy armor to fight them and that precludes long jump ranges and cargo. With the Hunters, you need speed to survive.

If they're going to nurf the combat, they need to raise the cash rewards.

 

[Ned Flandalorian]

The Scythe was(/is) fine because it doesn't have the ridiculous combination of overpowered attacks at its disposal. I thought the overwhelming opinion was that they were a welcome addition to the game rather than an annoyance like the glaives.

 

[Schmack]

There's a difference between "challenging" and "not fun". Being intercepted by a ship packed with OP offensive capabilities (guardian-module-melting field, FSD reboot missiles, caustic missiles, lightning attack that can both recharge its shield and be spammed at any time, 800m/s thrusters, and a mass-lock factor that affects everything but the largest available ships) designed for "fight or die" combat while in a ship decked out for rescue activity/materials gathering (packed with single-use modules that are mandatory to even access a maelstrom) is not a challenge, it's poor design. And instead of acknowledging it as an issue, they're doubling down and dressing up another recycled game mechanic as "new" titan gameplay. I really can't see why most people will bother with it when, if they wanted to go mining, they could just go mining rather than deal with the extra poorly-thought-out obstacles put in the way...

It depends. If you want that level of challenge it's good to have it, but if you don't you could always just avoid that region. I don't fight bulls, for example.

 

[tolm]

It depends. If you want that level of challenge it's good to have it, but if you don't you could always just avoid that region. I don't fight bulls, for example.

The difference is that folks were happily playing football but then FDev released the bulls onto the same pitch rather than adding a separate bull ring that people could go to if they wanted more of a challenge.

 

[Ned Flandalorian]

It depends. If you want that level of challenge it's good to have it, but if you don't you could always just avoid that region. I don't fight bulls, for example.

"That region" means all AX CZs (which were fine before the glaives were introduced), all control systems, and any activity near/in the maelstroms. Basically the areas where all new content is being added. You'd think the devs would want people to experience new content rather than avoid it, no?

As for it being a "challenge", it's really not - you just slap some AX multis on any old ship, find a glaive and hold the trigger for a while until it pops. There's practically no skill involved besides keeping the target on the screen in front of you.

 

[Schmack]

"That region" means all AX CZs (which were fine before the glaives were introduced), all control systems, and any activity near/in the maelstroms. Basically the areas where all new content is being added. You'd think the devs would want people to experience new content rather than avoid it, no?

Plenty have avoided the thargoid narrative altogether. If the devs wanted more to experience it I'd have thought they would have made it more interesting. It seems to satisfy the combat folks, not much for anyone else. Well, save for some explorers who returned and were killed in the progress.

As for it being a "challenge", it's really not - you just slap some AX multis on any old ship, find a glaive and hold the trigger for a while until it pops. There's practically no skill involved besides keeping the target on the screen in front of you.

Ok then what's the problem? Either they are OP or they aren't. Like so many other aspects of the game, it's a take it or leave it proposition to me. I choose to leave it.

 

[Ned Flandalorian]

Plenty have avoided the thargoid narrative altogether. If the devs wanted more to experience it I'd have thought they would have made it more interesting. It seems to satisfy the combat folks, not much for anyone else. Well, save for some explorers who returned and were killed in the progress.

You're really not getting the point: their addition to the game has also ruined parts that were previously enjoyable.

Ok then what's the problem? Either they are OP or they aren't. Like so many other aspects of the game, it's a take it or leave it proposition to me. I choose to leave it.

If you are explicitly looking to engage them and have prepared for that, they are not difficult to defeat. Likewise if you don't want to engage them they aren't a challenge because they're impossible to defeat; they just either waste your time and/or send you to the rebuy screen. They add nothing positive to the experience of playing the game. I've seen multiple players simply self-destruct their ship when interdicted by glaives, simply because it's easier/quicker than attempting to deal with them. Does that sound like an engaging experience at all?
It's like saying a brick wall is a challenge - incorrect because it's either impassable or trivially removable with the correct equipment, there's no in-between that equates to being challenging.

 

[Danieros]

Risk vs reward is always an interesting discussion.

I've always thought the best way to balance this would be based on how many missions you're doing at the same time as that can be from 0 to 20. Though this stacking is only practical in the thargoid war, or rank grinding systems.

 

[Rat Catcher]

their addition to the game has also ruined parts that were previously enjoyable.

I guess some may see it that way. It depends exactly what they wish to focus on in the game.
The Thargoid war has certainly not ruined any of the myriad of activities I engage with in the game.

If Frontier had not listened to the players who complained that the war was "too hard", and the incursion had grown in scale logarithmically, maybe then it would affect my play, after a year or 2, but, as it is today, nothing happening in the areas surrounding the Maelstroms (Titans) is having any affect on me in the least.

I did a couple of weeks of AX combat, it was quite fun, then went on playing my normal game.

Of course, others may be affected differently, the 'free choice' thing, but, the tiny area of the bubble affected hardly impacts options for a player.

 

[Ned Flandalorian]

The Thargoid war has certainly not ruined any of the myriad of activities I engage with in the game.

I struggle to understand why people who don't partake in a particular part of the game continue to offer their insights about changes affecting it. It's just like the people who supposedly stop playing but keep popping up in threads to declare the game is dead/dying.

 

[Rat Catcher]

I struggle to understand why people who don't partake in a particular part of the game continue to offer their insights about changes affecting it. It's just like the people who supposedly stop playing but keep popping up in threads to declare the game is dead/dying.

Missed this bit then?

I did a couple of weeks of AX combat, it was quite fun, then went on playing my normal game.

Never mind...

Easy to miss if you just want to criticise, I guess...

ETA: When the Thargoid war actually becomes a threat (which is likely to be never) I'll happily jump back in with my mothballed ships. Frontier may decide to make the altercation meaningful, maybe even add content for Odyssey, but then again, in the same manner as the most undecided, they may not.

 

[Jack Winter]

Considering the perspective of the update 17 spoiler, it seems likely that we'll finally get some more meaningful on foot content.

 

[EdzUp]

I think the major issue with ED is the speil that we are able to choose what happens, this is total bull. After all this time we know there is a background narrative that chooses what happens it's this that has made a otherwise enjoyable story ark just a linear what happens next fest.

I would have loved to see peaceful Thargoids maybe more interactions between the two species after centuries of war and misinformation it would have made a change. We could have had Thargoid space, human space, guardian bubble by now each with its own PP actions and missions now we get kill it all missions.

This seems more like a eighties sci-fi than a 20xx mmo game